Gays!!!

[OphidiaPhile]

How about perverts. Read 1 Timothy in false teachers

And what exactly is a pervert? I know I am and I am not gay.

 

[allhart]

And what exactly is a pervert? I know I am and I am not gay.

to affect with perversion. 2. to lead astray morally. 3. to turn away from the right course. 4. to lead into mental error or false judgment. 5. to turn to an improper use; misapply. 6. to misconstrue or misinterpret, esp. deliberately; distort: to pervert someone's statement. 7. to bring to a less excellent state; vitiate; debase. 8. Pathology. to change to what is unnatural or abnormal. 9. to convert or persuade to a religious belief regarded as false or wrong.

 

[Beanieboy]

My guess is that it is far easier to condemn others, justly or injustly, than it is to actually live a Christlike life. It is easier to be more concerned that man thinks you are holy than God, because man will look up to you, honor you, and give you instant gratification for how holy you are, like they did for the Phariesees. With man, you can simply call yourself a Christian, and then justify hatred, and call it "love". On one site, the self-proclaimed Christians actually said that "hating, mocking and being emotionally abusive to a homosexual is one of the most loving things one can do." The said that it was better than "hand holding someone on the road to hell." However, it was hard to tell this "love" from the hatred of "the world," and that was not true of Christ.

Say that you have a terrible marriage. You drink too much, you lie to your spouse, you are selfish, and you know that you could do better. The human thing to do is say, "Gay Marriage is threatening my marriage! Gays want to destroy the family! My wife is considering leaving me, and I would have a much better chance if Adam and Steve hadn't moved in next door!"

In a way, he's right. Adam and Steve may actually communicate, share the jobs of the house, not assign "the man's work/women's work", but because they are the same sex, demand equality in all parts of their relationship. In fact, they may be very happy, and to someone in a miserable relationship, what would be more threatening?

So, they point the finger at another.

It's human. However, we can transcend that, but it involves being honest with ourselves, and being truthful about the Sequoia growing from our eye.

 

[OphidiaPhile]

to affect with perversion. 2. to lead astray morally. 3. to turn away from the right course. 4. to lead into mental error or false judgment. 5. to turn to an improper use; misapply. 6. to misconstrue or misinterpret, esp. deliberately; distort: to pervert someone's statement. 7. to bring to a less excellent state; vitiate; debase. 8. Pathology. to change to what is unnatural or abnormal. 9. to convert or persuade to a religious belief regarded as false or wrong.

We are talking sexual perversion here.
Liking S&M, toys and other fun things makes me a pervert but they are not dangerous nor illegal.

Sexual perversion in psychology, sexual behavior deemed pathological by its deviation from "normal" sexual desire. The definition of sexual perversion has shifted considerably over time: indeed, it has never been an uncontested category of meaning. For example, homosexual desire has long been stigmatized as sexual perversion among many segments of Western society (and remains so among some), but within the field of psychology, it is no longer considered pathological. Use of the term perversion itself has come under wide criticism in recent years. Today, psychologists generally refer to nontraditional sexual behavior as sexual deviation or, in cases where the specific object of arousal is unusual, as paraphilia. There are a number of recognized disorders of this type. In fetishism, the object of sexual desire is either an inanimate object or a nongenital part of the human anatomy. Voyeurism involves the covert viewing of other individuals who are naked, undressing, or engaged in sexual activity, as the primary means of sexual arousal. Sexual arousal as a result of physical contact with prepubescent children is described as pedophilia. Other forms of sexual deviation include exhibitionism, incest, transvestism, necrophilia, sadism, and masochism. Many of these behaviors, when they involve the participation of nonconsenting adults (or children, consenting or not), are punishable by law. Although rape is not classified as a paraphilia, it is a serious sexual deviance, and perhaps the most highly reviled form of sexual gratification.

 

[allhart]

My guess is that it is far easier to condemn others, justly or injustly, than it is to actually live a Christlike life. It is easier to be more concerned that man thinks you are holy than God, because man will look up to you, honor you, and give you instant gratification for how holy you are, like they did for the Phariesees. With man, you can simply call yourself a Christian, and then justify hatred, and call it "love". On one site, the self-proclaimed Christians actually said that "hating, mocking and being emotionally abusive to a homosexual is one of the most loving things one can do." The said that it was better than "hand holding someone on the road to hell." However, it was hard to tell this "love" from the hatred of "the world," and that was not true of Christ.

Say that you have a terrible marriage. You drink too much, you lie to your spouse, you are selfish, and you know that you could do better. The human thing to do is say, "Gay Marriage is threatening my marriage! Gays want to destroy the family! My wife is considering leaving me, and I would have a much better chance if Adam and Steve hadn't moved in next door!"

In a way, he's right. Adam and Steve may actually communicate, share the jobs of the house, not assign "the man's work/women's work", but because they are the same sex, demand equality in all parts of their relationship. In fact, they may be very happy, and to someone in a miserable relationship, what would be more threatening?

So, they point the finger at another.

It's human. However, we can transcend that, but it involves being honest with ourselves, and being truthful about the Sequoia growing from our eye.

Heirs with Christ


12So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. 13For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. 15For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, "Abba! Father!" 16 The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, 17and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him
Everyone has a cross to bare!!!!!

 

[Beanieboy]

Heirs with Christ


12So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. 13For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. 15For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, "Abba! Father!" 16 The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, 17and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him
Everyone has a cross to bare!!!!!

And your point?
That your role on earth is to be the cross of gay people?

 

[allhart]

We are talking sexual perversion here.
Liking S&M, toys and other fun things makes me a pervert but they are not dangerous nor illegal.

Sexual perversion in psychology, sexual behavior deemed pathological by its deviation from "normal" sexual desire. The definition of sexual perversion has shifted considerably over time: indeed, it has never been an uncontested category of meaning. For example, homosexual desire has long been stigmatized as sexual perversion among many segments of Western society (and remains so among some), but within the field of psychology, it is no longer considered pathological. Use of the term perversion itself has come under wide criticism in recent years. Today, psychologists generally refer to nontraditional sexual behavior as sexual deviation or, in cases where the specific object of arousal is unusual, as paraphilia. There are a number of recognized disorders of this type. In fetishism, the object of sexual desire is either an inanimate object or a nongenital part of the human anatomy. Voyeurism involves the covert viewing of other individuals who are naked, undressing, or engaged in sexual activity, as the primary means of sexual arousal. Sexual arousal as a result of physical contact with prepubescent children is described as pedophilia. Other forms of sexual deviation include exhibitionism, incest, transvestism, necrophilia, sadism, and masochism. Many of these behaviors, when they involve the participation of nonconsenting adults (or children, consenting or not), are punishable by law. Although rape is not classified as a paraphilia, it is a serious sexual deviance, and perhaps the most highly reviled form of sexual gratification.

always learning and never able to arrive at a knowledge of the truth. 8Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men corrupted in mind and disqualified regarding the faith

 

[Polycarp_fan]

I'm trying very hard not to call people who compare homosexuality to bestiality names. The sort of names that make moderators unhappy.

Listen, you...person, the difference between letting gays marry and letting people marry animals is that GAY PEOPLE ARE *PEOPLE*, AND AS SUCH ARE CAPABLE OF SIGNING LEGALLY BINDING DOCUMENTS. The reason you can't get a dog to marry you is the same reason why you can't get a dog to open a bank account or vote!

And again, allhart, YOU DON'T HAVE TO MARRY ANYONE YOU DON'T HAVE TO. Seriously, just because gay marriage gets legalized doesn't mean you're obligated to get one.

Barriers fall and some are pushed over.

It is for concerned citizens to be thoughful as to the consequences long before it happens.

 

[jcook922]

Not so fast. I have written many, many times that I could not care any less than I do about GLBT's and their sexual proclivities. "I" am not one of the Evangelicals standing against the homosexual lifestyle for homosexuals. It's when they demand that we celebrate their perversions that I stand my ground.



The evidence speaks against your assertion. A Gay Christianity is not the Church of the Apostles. It is not the Gospel either. It is something foreign and wrong.



It's not "just" Christians that oppose gays and their desires for society. It's just that Christians are in the sights of secularists driving the media.



Wrong. It is the open-minded Christian that show that gay sex and gay culture is antithetical to Christian truth ,that has the GLBT's all up in arms. "Fundamental beliefs" is not an epithet or sign of ignorance, but a sign of truth and honesty.

Find me one scripture that promotes OR celebrates gay culture. Go to www.biblegateway.com and use any number of different versoins of the Bible and get back to me. You seem a bright fellow.



No way. With gay activism comes gay sex acts being pamphleted in our schools and celebrated to OUR children BY homosexual activists. I have psoted the actual happenings.

That one is off the table J. You referee gay activism out of the schools, no rainbow clubs and no pink triangles and no gay "clubs," and that's the place to start the negotiations. If you want the same thing for Christian clubs, I'll have the treaty signed by morning. If you want debauchery, find it off school grounds. God is big enough to play by the same rules.

Care a go at that?



Wrong again, Evangelicals ALL come from the peoples and places they now oppose, or do not support any longer. If anyone knows the debauchery growing in our society, it is those that used to eat it.



It is seen as immorality sickening OUR children. There are planty of facts to prove the Evangelicals absoluetly and fundamentally correct.



Taxes and injustice towards hard working families and their children.

See why so many Evangelicals are conservatives and vote GOP?

I'm all ears for your next treatment of what Christians believe.

Just to state, I made no reference to gays incidentally also being Christians. That isn't even on my radar, and I don't even care. That's an issue for your faith to work out on it's own. I've stated before that I would be in full support of COMPLETE removal of any gay OR Christian clubs or teachings in our public school system. Both sides either completely integrated or completely abolished. Fair is fair.

You don't like that gays are gay, that's fine. But really and truly they are people, just like you when it comes to the flesh and blood, but with a different belief system. You're free to believe they are all going to hell if you wish, but you keep saying that gays are asking you to celebrate their lifestyle, when all I see is them telling Christians to leave them alone and turn a blind eye, live and let live. I don't see anything unreasonable about that really. I don't think homosexuality is the reason our culture is as depraved and screwed up as it is, it's the media in general along with a huge variety of factors.

The point is pretty simple PCF, in the eyes of our Government, Christians and Gays should be equal, when it comes to your opinion it's your business, but Christianity has no right to bring it to a government level because your religious beliefs conflict with their personal ones. You're basically saying to deny them rights and benefits that normal folks get because they're different from you, and you don't like them, and blame them on the eventual downfall of our whole society.

 

[allhart]

And your point?
That your role on earth is to be the cross of gay people?

I had to lay down my sin into do what was right for my life. Just as its your choice to lay your sin down or not, but like a drug addict they have to admit they have a problem first.
we suffer with christ in order that we may also be glorified with him
also to gain the world to only lose your soul is in vain

 

[morningstar2651]

Going back to the OP...

What have you done to help the poor?
What have you done to help the homeless?
What have you done to reduce violent crime?
What have you done to cure cancer?
What have you done to cure AIDS?
What have you done to give homes to orphans?
What have you done to reduce the number of wars?

Why should anyone care what you oppose if you don't do something to help these people?

See also:
Matthew 25:34-40

Anybody feel up to answering this?

 

[allhart]

To be honest with myself! God is in control, but as he will asks me what have I done with his resource of money, time and energy in my life that was given to me. I would say ever learning to know your truth to only turn around and share it to whom ever would listen to your message to the best of my ability's.
I can say that all that criticizes me on how I present Love. All I can say is God's love is multifaceted. You can look for any reasons to tune out the message, but you tuned it out. What will you say to God when he asks why should I let you in, knocking at the door of heaven. When I knocked at your heart for a lifetime to be only be shoot down cold.

Acts 28:26-27 states it best

Passage Acts 28:26-27:

26 "'Go to this people, and say, You will indeed hear but never understand,
and you will indeed see but never perceive.
27 For this people’s heart has grown dull,
and with their ears they can barely hear,
and their eyes they have closed;
lest they should see with their eyes
and hear with their ears
and understand with their heart
and turn, and I would heal them.'

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Barriers fall and some are pushed over.

It is for concerned citizens to be thoughful as to the consequences long before it happens.

And yet, despite decades of quizzing, no detrimental consequence of extending marriage to same-sex couples has ever been presented. Funny, that.

 

[seashale76]

Anybody feel up to answering this?

The people who are doing those things have no time for internet discussions.

 

[Polycarp_fan]

Just to state, I made no reference to gays incidentally also being Christians. That isn't even on my radar, and I don't even care. That's an issue for your faith to work out on it's own.

That bird is cooked.

I've stated before that I would be in full support of COMPLETE removal of any gay OR Christian clubs or teachings in our public school system. Both sides either completely integrated or completely abolished. Fair is fair.

What about atheism and Humanism? They gotta go too. Philosophy clubs can exist quite easily off campus.

You don't like that gays are gay, that's fine. But really and truly they are people, just like you when it comes to the flesh and blood, but with a different belief system.

Mmmm not exactly. I oppose many kinds of people that call themselves Christians but whose actions are repugnant. You juts don't see that in GLBT circles.

You're free to believe they are all going to hell if you wish, but you keep saying that gays are asking you to celebrate their lifestyle, when all I see is them telling Christians to leave them alone and turn a blind eye, live and let live.

Wrong. They are demanding that we look straight at their sexuality and our children. There is no dissent of gay activism. That is more than clear now. C'mon now.

I don't see anything unreasonable about that really. I don't think homosexuality is the reason our culture is as depraved and screwed up as it is, it's the media in general along with a huge variety of factors.

Coughing up blood isn't cancer, it is the sign of cancer.

The point is pretty simple PCF, in the eyes of our Government, Christians and Gays should be equal, when it comes to your opinion it's your business, but Christianity has no right to bring it to a government level because your religious beliefs conflict with their personal ones.

They are violating Christians civil and constitutional rights by pushing their sex acts to a minority status and forcing us to celebrate THEIR sex lives.

We're told to shutup by laws, and they are told to parad their sex acts in every place in society. Why can't they act like us? They certainly are parroting a lot of Christian symbols these days.

You're basically saying to deny them rights and benefits that normal folks get because they're different from you, and you don't like them, and blame them on the eventual downfall of our whole society.

They have benefits. That is obviously NOT the final goal. Other than that, my answer to your last sentence would be yup.

I have the proof in my history books. My bible is just one of them.

Hedonism and lasciviousness are social carcinogens.

Check it out, Christians are not demanding to have sex in public:

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=59803

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/08/08/fort.lauderdale.mayor/index.html

 

[Polycarp_fan]

And yet, despite decades of quizzing, no detrimental consequence of extending marriage to same-sex couples has ever been presented. Funny, that.

Same-gender marriage is very new on the stage of history. No doubt that decadence, hedonism and lascivious licentious will futher explode into full-blown biblical warning mode. I'm fully Ok with you marking my words.

I've shown time and time again how correct my positions are.

History is repeating itself. The bad version.

 

[Polycarp_fan]

Originally Posted by morningstar2651

Going back to the OP...

What have you done to help the poor?
What have you done to help the homeless?
What have you done to reduce violent crime?
What have you done to cure cancer?
What have you done to cure AIDS?
What have you done to give homes to orphans?
What have you done to reduce the number of wars?

Why should anyone care what you oppose if you don't do something to help these people?

See also:
Matthew 25:34-40​

​

Anybody feel up to answering this?

I voted Yes on Prop 8




-----Voting is still legal for Christians.

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Same-gender marriage is very new on the stage of history.

So?

No doubt that decadence, hedonism and lascivious licentious will futher explode into full-blown biblical warning mode.

No doubt? What makes you so sure? Of those countries and states that have legalised same-sex marriage, there is absolutely no correlating increase in, ahem, decadence and hedonism (explosive or otherwise).

And, I think you missed out a word; lascivious licentious... what? Chickens?

History is repeating itself. The bad version.

OK, let's compare:

"Same-gender marriage is very new on the stage of history."

"History is repeating itself. The bad version."

So is history repeating itself, or is there no history to repeat?

 

[CreedIsChrist]

U.S. population as of 2007: 301,621,157

approx. 74.3% of the U.S. population claims to be christian

approx. 4.6%(over 13 million) of the U.S. population claims to be a homosexual

assuming that these two are mutually exclusive(which they are apparently not, as I have seen recently on this forum but, we will say they are for this) we know that there is another whole 21.1% of the population that is "unsaved"

----------------------------

-There were 11,252,828 counts of violent crimesin the U.S. in 2007 including everything from theft, assault, rape, murder, and burglary
(not including drug, alcohol, or vehicle related crimes)

-There are 3.5 million homeless people in the U.S.(1.35 million of which are children) at any given point in the year.

-852 million(13%) people world wide (almost 3x the U.S. population) are starving right now.

-4,162 U.S. troops and 1,033,112 total deaths in Iraq since the beginning of the war 5 years ago.

-approx. 33 million people worldwide infected with HIV

-approx. 10.9 million _new_ cancer patients a year; 6.7 million of which die every year

-Divorce rates in the U.S.:
Jews 30%
Born-again Christians 27%
Other Christians 24%
Atheists, Agnostics 21%

-No. of countries at war as of 2008: 59

-approx 210 million orphan children worldwide
---------------------
So why is it that I see almost every other thread titled with something to do with homosexuality or "gays"?

Do you seriously believe that they're out to get you and destroy what you believe?

Or is it that they don't follow your beliefs, that they bother you, and that they're a relatively easy target that's close to home.

Given that they want to have the right to get married for the sake of having that title and the tax benefits that come along with it, I don't see the problem. They aren't asking for a christian wedding. You can't pull the "marriage is a sacred thing given to us by god" crap. There is a form of wedding tradition in EVERY culture.

What about AAALLL of the people worldwide that will die and supposedly go to hell because they never heard of God because you did not witness to them? Given that 2 people die every second, it looks like you're a little behind.

It would appear that God would rather shame gays before giving an orphan a home, in fact, it looks like he'll likely send both to hell.

-E

I agree partly, there are alot of more important things in the world to be concerned about than immoral sexual activity. Although the bible does say we must reprove and rebuke, we must also show compassion and help towards others. At times it can be hard to balace both out without going too far on one end side of the spectrum. Personally I think homosexuality wouldn't have been such a big issue today until they started meddling in marriage and using their bully pulpit, the ACLU to give them special rights. Many people do not like what the gay community is trying to do with marriage, and in reality they have no buisness and right to meddle in things like marriage, its not their sacrament and they don't have that authority.

Personally, I breaks my heart to see some people such slaves to lust and sex while being so angry with God. We need to reach out to them for conversion.

 

[Funny Fundie]

Personally, I breaks my heart to see some people such slaves to lust and sex while being so angry with God. We need to reach out to them for conversion.

I think this is the problem. What does it say in Romans 1? That homosexuality is just the first step in hating an almighty God that's what.
If gay dudes can stop their hostilities we can all get along but they won't.