Obama pro/con

[RealDealNeverstop]

Wright has spent 40 years preaching about what Christ taught regarding social justice and that no group should be subjugated. He has said some dumb things but iam guessing every single one of us can find dumb things we have said if we look at a 4 decade period. He does not preach hate against people. He preaches against racism, greed, optional wars, etc.

 

[RealDealNeverstop]

Carey, Time did a cover story 'Does God Want You to be Rich?' and Osteen was one respondent. Jesus said it's easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle-you know the rest. How much does Osteen spend on his crocodile shoes and wardrobe? How much is his house? How much is the lease on the Compaq Center? What was it, 70 MILLION dollars to renovate a building? He is money and not Christ centered. This is partly revealed by how his wife paid an FAA fine for assault against a flight attendant. In first class no less.

 

[JustAsIam77]

There you go. Because every white person is a racist, even his very own grandma, socialism is the only possible way to make everyone equal.

Sounds like his pastor has really affected him more than I thought. Of course, since he opened the speech by admitting he'd lied about not hearing that type of thing, I'm not surprised.

Are we to believe Mr. Obamas statements or our lying eyes and ears?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72B3tUAqpo4

 

[Carey]

Carey, Time did a cover story 'Does God Want You to be Rich?' and Osteen was one respondent. Jesus said it's easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle-you know the rest. How much does Osteen spend on his crocodile shoes and wardrobe? How much is his house? How much is the lease on the Compaq Center? What was it, 70 MILLION dollars to renovate a building? He is money and not Christ centered. This is partly revealed by how his wife paid an FAA fine for assault against a flight attendant. In first class no less.

If you listened to Joels sermons you would know he says sometimes the abundance God wants for us is not always finacial sometimes it is in other areas of our life.

Because for someone finacial wealth would corrupt.

Joel was already financially well off from his other career before taking over Lakewood.

Joels Books have become sooo successful he has mode tons off them.

He does not take a salary from the Church did you know that he Pastors for ZERO pay???

The Compaq center is full every Sunadya nd saturday and is almost too small for his blessed ministry. What do you think he should do get a smaller building ???

The actions of his wife have bearing on his blessings how??

Paying the fine was not an admission of guilt but rather If they want to take you coat give them your shirt tooo and turn the other cheek Christ like way to deal with an opportunist to get 15 minutes of fame.

http://www.religionnewsblog.com/16138/faa-fines-victoria-osteen-3000


You really should go and listen www.joelosteen.com

I think you will be amazed at what you learn

 

[JGL53]

Are we to believe Mr. Obamas statements or our lying eyes and ears?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72B3tUAqpo4

Obviously the Rev. is correct about one thing - Hillary has never been called a N-word.

And neither have you.

I still prefer Obama to the other choice McCain. What is his excuse for admiring people like Falwell, Hagee and Parsley?

Obama pretty much cleared things up in his speech on race relations the other day.

<staff edit>

Done.

 

[JustAsIam77]

Obviously the Rev. is correct about one thing - Hillary has never been called a N-word.

And neither have you.

I still prefer Obama to the other choice McCain. What is his excuse for admiring people like Falwell, Hagee and Parsley?

Obama pretty much cleared things up in his speech on race relations the other day.

If you and people like you STILL will not give it up but MUST continue to bore everyone with your personal PROBLEM here, then perhaps the rest of us should put you on ignore.

Yeah, that's a great idea.

Done.

I thought this thread title was Obama Pro/Con? Not just Obama Pro?

 

[Dannager]

I thought this thread title was Obama Pro/Con? Not just Obama Pro?

The expectation is that the discussion of the negatives associated with Obama's campaign will be honest. Not the sort of vitriol-filled mud-slinging we've come to associate with smear politics. Unfortunately, it appears that expectation was a bit too much for this thread to handle.

 

[Scribbler]

He does not preach hate against people.

Yes. Aids really was invented by white people to kill black people.
I'm sure the good reverend is just speaking truth to power.

We cant even love fellow Christians so how can we expect non believers we love them?

There goes the irony meter again.

 

[Scribbler]

A honest question and if you may a candid response. Obama has record as a Professor, he has on record a book, he has a state legislation record, he has federal legislaton record replete with crafted and sponsored legislation, and he has on record a myriad of speeches, how much do you think Wrights views influenced him to the point it is a political concern?

"Wright is not an incidental figure in Obama's life, or his politics. The senator "affirmed" his Christian faith in this church; he uses Wright as a "sounding board" to "make sure I'm not losing myself in the hype and hoopla." Both the title of Obama's second book, The Audacity of Hope, and the theme for his keynote address at the Democratic National Convention in 2004 come from Wright's sermons. "If you want to understand where Barack gets his feeling and rhetoric from," says the Rev. Jim Wallis, a leader of the religious left, "just look at Jeremiah Wright." -From this weeks Rolling Stone puff piece


To answer your question, JoyJuice,...'quite a bit'.

 

[Scribbler]

The expectation is that the discussion of the negatives associated with Obama's campaign will be honest.

A good way to counter that would be to point out the dishonesties. If you find any in my posts, I'm happy to retract.

 

[NPH]

Yes. Aids really was invented by white people to kill black people.

On the face of it, to me and you (assuming we are both white), to say such a thing seems patently ridiculous, doesn't it?

How ridiculous, though, would it sound to a people who have actually had similar things done to them?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuskegee_Study_of_Untreated_Syphilis_in_the_Negro_Male

The Tuskegee Study of Untreated Syphilis in the Negro Male[1] also known as the Tuskegee Syphilis Study, Pelkola Syphilis Study, Public Health Service Syphilis Study or the Tuskegee Experiments was a clinical study, conducted between 1932 and 1972 in Tuskegee, Alabama, in which 399 (plus 201 control group without syphilis) poor &#8212; and mostly illiterate &#8212; African American sharecroppers were denied treatment for Syphilis.
This study became notorious because it was conducted without due care to its subjects, and led to major changes in how patients are protected in clinical studies. Individuals enrolled in the Tuskegee Syphilis Study did not give informed consent and were not informed of their diagnosis; instead they were told they had "bad blood" and could receive free medical treatment, rides to the clinic, meals and burial insurance in case of death in return for participating.

I don't find it so outrageous coming from the mouth of someone like Rev. Wright, who has seen his people targeted by unethical/immoral medical experimentation in the past.

 

[Scribbler]

On the face of it, to me and you (assuming we are both white), to say such a thing seems patently ridiculous, doesn't it?

How ridiculous, though, would it sound to a people who have actually had similar things done to them?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuskegee_Study_of_Untreated_Syphilis_in_the_Negro_Male
I don't find it so outrageous coming from the mouth of someone like Rev. Wright, who has seen his people targeted by unethical/immoral medical experimentation in the past.

While the Tuskagee study was shameful, there's an enormous leap from allowing a disease to remain uncured so you can learn more about it's effects...

To the Government intentionally creating a incurable virus specifically to kill black people. What funny, is, it doesn't even target black people.

 

[JoyJuice]

"Wright is not an incidental figure in Obama's life, or his politics. The senator "affirmed" his Christian faith in this church; he uses Wright as a "sounding board" to "make sure I'm not losing myself in the hype and hoopla." Both the title of Obama's second book, The Audacity of Hope, and the theme for his keynote address at the Democratic National Convention in 2004 come from Wright's sermons. "If you want to understand where Barack gets his feeling and rhetoric from," says the Rev. Jim Wallis, a leader of the religious left, "just look at Jeremiah Wright." -From this weeks Rolling Stone puff piece


To answer your question, JoyJuice,...'quite a bit'.

Alright, maybe we can get some where.

Exactly how has Wright's antagonistic views manifest in Obama's political record or his long record of speeches?

I was kind of looking for examples, some substance, and not persay another claim. Does Rev Wallis provide an example?

 

[NPH]

While the Tuskagee study was shameful, there's an enormous leap from allowing a disease to remain uncured so you can learn more about it's effects...

To the Government intentionally creating a incurable virus specifically to kill black people. What funny, is, it doesn't even target black people.

How is it such an enormous leap? Maybe it might seem that way to you, but you didn't live through what they did, did you? How is it so far from taking advantage of infected people and treating them like lab rats for your benefit, to intentionally infecting them for your benefit? Once the mental adjustment has been made to not view a group as 'people' (a necessary thinking to have performed the Tuskegee experiments) then how can it be a leap at all to continue treating them as if they're not 'people'? These folk were treated as property for most of the history of this country! They've had one humiliation upon another dropped on top of them over and over and over ... they have every reason to be paranoid.

Me and you, we don't and never will understand where Rev. Wright is coming from because we didn't and likely won't experience it or similar. But our incredulity does not mean he is not justified in his fear.

 

[Scribbler]

How is it such an enormous leap? Maybe it might seem that way to you, but you didn't live through what they did, did you? How is it so far from taking advantage of infected people and treating them like lab rats for your benefit, to intentionally infecting them for your benefit? Once the mental adjustment has been made to not view a group as 'people' (a necessary thinking to have performed the Tuskegee experiments) then how can it be a leap at all to continue treating them as if they're not 'people'? These folk were treated as property for most of the history of this country! They've had one humiliation upon another dropped on top of them over and over and over ... they have every reason to be paranoid.

Me and you, we don't and never will understand where Rev. Wright is coming from because we didn't and likely won't experience it or similar. But our incredulity does not mean he is not justified in his fear.

Reverend Wright possesses both a Master and a Doctorate. I'm assuming that equals enough education
to understand that AIDS is not an invention of whites to kill non-whites, not withstanding his emotions
about Tuskagee...something he never lived through, either.

 

[Voegelin]

Obama Campaign Removes New Black Panther Party Endorsement From Web Site

The campaign didn't know anything about this either. Quote from the leader of the New Black Panther party from the article above:

"I think the way Obama responded to the attack on him and the attempt to sabotage his campaign shows true leadership and character. He had a chance to denounce his pastor and he didn’t fall for the bait. He stood up and addressed real issues of racial discord” ---Malik Zulu Shabbazz

The Anti-Defamation League on Malik Zulu Shabazz:

http://www.adl.org/anti_semitism/shabazz.asp

 

[Conspiracy Theory]

Is he attracting the Ron Paul! brand of nuts now that Ron Paul! has dropped out?

 

[JoyJuice]

The campaign didn't know anything about this either. Quote from the leader of the New Black Panther party from the article above:

"I think the way Obama responded to the attack on him and the attempt to sabotage his campaign shows true leadership and character. He had a chance to denounce his pastor and he didn’t fall for the bait. He stood up and addressed real issues of racial discord” ---Malik Zulu Shabbazz

Well said Malik.

 

[Scribbler]

Well said Malik.

Beacuse I can't think of any reason why you would want
to denounce such a racist, ignorant divisive pastor, right?

 

[JoyJuice]

Beacuse I can't think of any reason why you would want
to denounce such a racist, ignorant divisive pastor, right?

I think Malik is talking about Obama not the Pastor here.

BTW; There is denounce, which Obama has done on more than one occasion...and then there is to abandon, which in light of his Christian faith it simply is not the Jesus thing to do.