How should Christians treat gay and bisexual people?

[Ohioprof]

You're right.

How should we treat homosexuals? With love as we treat all sinners. We must lovingly plant the seed of the Gospel..and what comes from there is the work of the Holy Spirit. If they refuse to heed the call of the gospel well that's there loss..we shouldn't "throw our pearls to pigs" as it were..

Being gay is not refusing the Gospel. It may be refusing to listen to YOUR interpretation of the Bible, but that's not the same as refusing the Gospel.

Jesus never called people to stop being gay. Jesus never said anything about gay people, nor did he condemn same-sex marriage.

You can certainly preach at gay people that being gay is a sin if you want to, but I predict that most gay people will avoid you, because they will find your preaching offensive and annoying. I predict that you won't win over many gay people to Christianity by telling gay people that how God made us is a sin.

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear Ohioprof,

Being gay is not refusing the Gospel. It may be refusing to listen to YOUR interpretation of the Bible, but that's not the same as refusing the Gospel.

Your interpretation of the gospel ends up being not the gospel and a different one. The message is to be a Christian rather than being gay, gays and straights can be Christians.

Jesus never called people to stop being gay.

Where? Show me where He didn’t.

Jesus never said anything about gay people

Nor straight people so whats your point?

nor did he condemn same-sex marriage.

Yes He did, Genesis 2, Matt 15 & 19, Mark 7 & 10, Eph 5, 1 Cor 5-7, Romans 1, 1 Tim 1 etc.

You can certainly preach at gay people that being gay is a sin if you want to,

As I think many of us have said even to the point of trolling we don’t want to do that nor do we. The question is why cant you see or understand what we have written.

have said about but I predict that most gay people will avoid you, because they will find your preaching offensive and annoying.

in your imagination of what we aren’t doing yes I wouldn’t be surprised.

I predict that you won't win over many gay people to Christianity by telling gay people that how God made us is a sin.

I predict we won’t tell them that.
Jesus Christ Himself wins over people, we just lead people to Him.
but I predict many gay people will listen to your false testimony.

 

[OllieFranz]

Jesus never called people to stop being gay.

Where? Show me where He didn’t.

If a Person did not say a thing, then normally there is no way to quote Him not saying it. However, if He did say something incompatable with a statement, that is indirect evidence that He would not have made the statement.

When Jesus said that gays are born that way (Matt 19:12), that is at odds with calling for them to stop being gay.

Also, for those of you who insist that malakos in 1 Cor 6:9 means "gay": if "soft" means "gay," then Jesus specifically spoke out against gay-bashing in Matt 5:22

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear Olliefranz,

If a Person did not say a thing, then normally there is no way to quote Him not saying it.

Jesus didn’t mention ‘gay people’ so you cant say Jesus didn’t say anything about something He didn’t mention. So the question was nonsense, hence my question to expose it as nonsense. Jesus never mentions straight or gay, what He does teach is that man and woman are to be in faithful union and sex outside that is error, and specifically same-sex sex. That tells you straight and gay is not an issue people unless straight and gay sexual activity is outside faithful man/woman marriage.

When Jesus said that gays are born that way (Matt

19:12), that is at odds with calling for them to stop being gay.

Nope that’s eunuchs, celibates, some people are born celibate, some made that way by men and some choose it for the Kingdom. No mention of gay or straight, that’s gay theology seeing gay as the key to everything.

Also, for those of you who insist that malakos in 1 Cor 6:9 means "gay": if "soft" means "gay," then Jesus specifically spoke out against gay-bashing in Matt 5:22

Of course Jesus spoke out against gay bashing just as He did about straight bashing, just as much as He spoke out against same-sex sex, however I see that some ignore one or the other and complain about the other.

 

[Ohioprof]

Dear Olliefranz,

Jesus didn’t mention ‘gay people’ so you cant say Jesus didn’t say anything about something He didn’t mention. So the question was nonsense, hence my question to expose it as nonsense. Jesus never mentions straight or gay, what He does teach is that man and woman are to be in faithful union and sex outside that is error, and specifically same-sex sex. That tells you straight and gay is not an issue people unless straight and gay sexual activity is outside faithful man/woman marriage.
Nope that’s eunuchs, celibates, some people are born celibate, some made that way by men and some choose it for the Kingdom. No mention of gay or straight, that’s gay theology seeing gay as the key to everything.

Of course Jesus spoke out against gay bashing just as He did about straight bashing, just as much as He spoke out against same-sex sex, however I see that some ignore one or the other and complain about the other.

This post does not make sense, notably this statement of yours: "Jesus didn’t mention ‘gay people’ so you cant say Jesus didn’t say anything about something He didn’t mention."

If Jesus didn't mention gay people, then he didn't say anything about gay people. To read his silence as saying something about gay people is just engaging in mental contortions to try to put beliefs or words into the mouth of Jesus.

 

[BreadAlone]

This post does not make sense, notably this statement of yours: "Jesus didn’t mention ‘gay people’ so you cant say Jesus didn’t say anything about something He didn’t mention."

If Jesus didn't mention gay people, then he didn't say anything about gay people. To read his silence as saying something about gay people is just engaging in mental contortions to try to put beliefs or words into the mouth of Jesus.

He didn't say anything because all Jews knew that homosexuality was an abomination, and Jesus' target audience was the Jews, so it was unncecessary.

On the other hand, Paul, whose target ministry was that of the Gentiles, spoke of it quite frequently..

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear Ohioprof,

This post does not make sense, notably this statement of yours: "Jesus didn’t mention ‘gay people’ so you cant say Jesus didn’t say anything about something He didn’t mention."

If Jesus didn't mention gay people, then he didn't say anything about gay people. To read his silence as saying something about gay people is just engaging in mental contortions to try to put beliefs or words into the mouth of Jesus.

Jesus didn’t mention straight people either, or bisexual, so he didn’t mention anything about people’s sexuality so why introduce an idea that He didn’t specifically mention about gays? I can make sense of nonsense.

Breadalone is also perfectly correct that Paul spoke about this to primarily gentile churches in gentile places where this pagan activity was rife, He didn’t need to tell the Jews same-sex sex was wrong, they knew that only too well

 

[jojored]

I feel and try to treat all people the same "Love thy neighbor as I love thyself"...and I don't say this because I'm a 54 year old gay man, but I believe that is the only way "humanity" will survived.

I loved and was loved by another man for 20 years...he passed away 5 years ago and I still greave to this day...so PLEASE don't tell me that two people of the same sex can't LOVE each other., they can and do!

I won't lecture you on the Bible...I can come up with some on the plus side side for gays...as I know it can be counteracted with negiative from others. But I know that it is only by the grace of God and belief in Jesus that will get us through those "PEARLY GATES"! So, it comes down to "judge not least ye be judged."

In short, I won't be setting on your jury nor will you be setting on mine...therefore I pray that you go out and just be the best person that you can to all those that you can...

And remeber...Jesus walked amoung the outcast of his time!

 

[davedjy]

He didn’t need to tell the Jews same-sex sex was wrong, they knew that only too well

...yet another unfounded statement based upon assumption.

It's like me saying "Jesus never mentioned it because it wasn't a sin to begin with".
It's an argument from silence, they don't work too well.

 

[jojored]

I feel and try to treat all people the same "Love thy neighbor as I love thyself"...and I don't say this because I'm a 54 year old gay man, but I believe that is the only way "humanity" will survived.

I loved and was loved by another man for 20 years...he passed away 5 years ago and I still greave to this day...so PLEASE don't tell me that two people of the same sex can't LOVE each other., they can and do!

I won't lecture you on the Bible...I can come up with some on the plus side side for gays...as I know it can be counteracted with negiative from others. But I know that it is only by the grace of God and belief in Jesus that will get us through those "PEARLY GATES"! So, it comes down to "judge not least ye be judged."

In short, I won't be setting on your jury nor will you be setting on mine...therefore I pray that you go out and just be the best person that you can to all those that you can...

And remeber...Jesus walked amoung the outcast of his time!

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear jojored,
I think the Christian message is slightly different.
I can't see how humanity can survive with same-sex unions! As to love ones neighbour clearly this doesnt work, humans cannot seem to. Therefore I feel that the hope is through loving God first and then loving ones neighbour which comes from that.

I loved and was loved by another man for 20 years...he passed away 5 years ago and I still greave to this day...so PLEASE don't tell me that two people of the same sex can't LOVE each other., they can and do!

I have been posed this point several times before, of course 2 people of the same sex can love each other, I love people of the same sex and I am straight. What I think you mean is a love which is sexual or includes sexual activity, but thats not the love of the NT, the love of the NT is described using agape and fileo not eros, nor does it include sex in the description.

 

[davedjy]

I can't see how humanity can survive with same-sex unions!

Same sex unions are going on as we speak, and humanity IS surviving. No more than a minority of the population has ever been homosexual.

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear Davedjy,
I mean humanity cant survive with same-sex unions, to survive it needs opposite sex unions. So it cant survive with bestiality either even though that might also go on. Common sense really

 

[Ohioprof]

Same sex unions are going on as we speak, and humanity IS surviving. No more than a minority of the population has ever been homosexual.

You are right. The argument that "humanity cannot survive with same-sex unions" is absurd. One could as easily argue that humanity cannot survive with single and celibate people. Of course it can, and it does. There have been same-sex couples for as long as humanity has existed. The only difference today is that we have come out of hiding to demand fair and equal treatment.

Not everyone is the same as everyone else, and not everyone is called to reproduce. Not all married heterosexuals are called to reproduce, nor are all married gay people called to reproduce, nor are all single people called to reproduce. But so far enough people have been reproducing so that we see no problem of underpopulation in the world. Indeed, the reverse appears to be true.

 

[Phinehas2]

What is absurd is the response.
The statement "humanity cannot survive with same-sex unions" is true, same-sex unions will not procreate and continue the species. Sure there may be a mixture but the point being made is if humanity only had opposite sex unions it would survive, if it only had same-sex unions it wouldnt.
So the conclusion is that same-sex unions are useless to humanity's survival.
Whats absurd is how gay thinking sees common sense logic as absurd.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

What is absurd is the response.
The statement "humanity cannot survive with same-sex unions" is true, same-sex unions will not procreate and continue the species. Sure there may be a mixture but the point being made is if humanity only had opposite sex unions it would survive, if it only had same-sex unions it wouldnt.
So the conclusion is that same-sex unions are useless to humanity's survival.
Whats absurd is how gay thinking sees common sense logic as absurd.

Unless homosexuality conveys some OTHER sort of benefit... it is possible to be a beneficial trait that doesn't directly improve the viability of your own offspring.

Just think of uncles and aunts... they aren't your parents, but do they help you out?

 

[EnemyPartyII]

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear EnemyPartyII

Unless homosexuality conveys some OTHER sort of benefit... it is possible to be a beneficial trait that doesn't directly improve the viability of your own offspring.

That doesnt make sense and if you had addressed the point I made you would see it doesnt make sense. Humanity's survival hopes rest on opposite sex unions alone, same-sex unions wont do.
Now you replied homosexuality but homosexuality isn't ame-sex unions exactly as the debates have so often shown. homosexuality is same-sex attraction.

Just think of uncles and aunts... they aren't your parents, but do they help you out?

How do I think of both with same-sex unions? Doesnt make sense. are uncles men? are aunts women? My uncle Samantha and my aunt Sarah ????

 

[Ohioprof]

Dear jojored,
I think the Christian message is slightly different.
I can't see how humanity can survive with same-sex unions! As to love ones neighbour clearly this doesnt work, humans cannot seem to. Therefore I feel that the hope is through loving God first and then loving ones neighbour which comes from that.
I have been posed this point several times before, of course 2 people of the same sex can love each other, I love people of the same sex and I am straight. What I think you mean is a love which is sexual or includes sexual activity, but thats not the love of the NT, the love of the NT is described using agape and fileo not eros, nor does it include sex in the description.

Love within marriage is often expressed through sexual intimacy. That's true for opposite-sex marriage and for same-sex marriage. There is no difference.

 

[Ohioprof]

Dear EnemyPartyII
That doesnt make sense and if you had addressed the point I made you would see it doesnt make sense. Humanity's survival hopes rest on opposite sex unions alone, same-sex unions wont do.
Now you replied homosexuality but homosexuality isn't ame-sex unions exactly as the debates have so often shown. homosexuality is same-sex attraction.

How do I think of both with same-sex unions? Doesnt make sense. are uncles men? are aunts women? My uncle Samantha and my aunt Sarah ????

Humanity is in no danger of dying out for lack of reproduction. And gay people do reproduce.

Your arguing is a red herring. And it makes no sense.