Saved!

[MarkEvan]

I think that people will be judged by the amount of light they have received and how they responded to that light.

Good answer.


darn it why didn`t I think of that

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Pretty much everything thats written in the new testament. Putting of the flesh, commandments kept at a higher spiritual level, by your words you will be judged, and so on. Although to tell ya the truth PK, for the most part ive found that what was said in the new testament had already been said in the old.

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellow servant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

 

[WailingWall]

I think that people will be judged by the amount of light they have received and how they responded to that light.

Yeah.

Luke 12:48
But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

This scripture mirrors exactly what you said

 

[WailingWall]

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. Rev 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellow servant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Hi PROPHECYKID
What does that mean? the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. I keep reading that over and over, yet i cant quite grasp what the scripture is saying. How does that explain to us what the testimony is to us?

 

[Catholic Christian]

Originally Posted by stumpjumper
I think that people will be judged by the amount of light they have received and how they responded to that light.


From The Catechism Of The Catholic Church:
http://www.usccb.org/catechism/text/pt1sect2chpt3art9p3.htm

842 - The Church's bond with non-Christian religions is in the first place the common origin and end of the human race:

"All nations form but one community. This is so because all stem from the one stock which God created to people the entire earth, and also because all share a common destiny, namely God. His providence, evident goodness, and saving designs extend to all against the day when the elect are gathered together in the holy city. . . ."

843 - The Catholic Church recognizes in other religions that search, among shadows and images, for the God who is unknown yet near since he gives life and breath and all things and wants all men to be saved. Thus, the Church considers all goodness and truth found in these religions as "a preparation for the Gospel and given by him who enlightens all men that they may at length have life."

SOURCE LINK"
http://www.usccb.org/catechism/text/pt1sect2chpt3art9p3.htm

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Hi PROPHECYKID
What does that mean? the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. I keep reading that over and over, yet i cant quite grasp what the scripture is saying. How does that explain to us what the testimony is to us?

Well i was hoping someone could use that text and explain it to me. I am going to ask this question elsewhere and tell you what answers i get.

 

[WailingWall]

Hi PK

2 Cor. 3:14-17
But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. [15] But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. [16] Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. [17] Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

Heres a scripture which talks about those who are blinded (obviously not those of prophecy)......Well not even sure the 2 scriptures are related. Maybe.

The more i look at both scriptures, the more i believe they are related

 

[zeke37]

Did you miss this post?




Basically, Wailing Wall, we don't know how God will deal with 'ignorant ones'. It's not only the pre-Pilgrim American Indians, it's also those who have heard the gospel, but heard it presented wrongly or by someone who is not actually spirit-filled and leads the person farther astray. What then? What about the people today who have not heard? What about babies and children who die before hearing the gospel?
You keep asking the question as if you already know the answer and we are all stupid. God alone knows how he will 'deal' with these people.

that is what the Millennium is for....

in His service
c

 

[WailingWall]

Actually Zeke37, i was trying to ignore that post. In it she accuses me of calling board members stupid. The truth is i think the people here on the board are the smartest people in the world. The stupid people (no matter how intelligent) are those not seeking the Lord.

Zeke, could you show me the scriptures that say, thats what the millennium is for. Thanks

 

[beloved57]

I have one great wish. I wanna be saved. But I have questions.

1. Must i keep Gods 10 commandments in order to be saved? Includind His sabbath.

2. Must i keep Gods Holy Days in order to be saved?

3. Must i keep the testimony of Jesus in order to be saved?

4. Can i attain eternal life and not be saved?

I would love to hear from as many as see this post. What do you think about all 4 questions. Or any that you might have knowlegde of. We are all here for one reason. We seek the Lord. HE says you will not seek ME in vain. That is one thing we all must believe. HE said it, i believe it! No matter our differences.

Believe on the Lord Jesus christ and thou shalt be saved..

 

[WailingWall]

Well, i was hoping to find more scripture to prove that you can attain eternal life and not be saved to the Kingdom but i suppose ill just post what ive found.

REV. 20 [4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. [5] But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. [6] Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

We know from 1 Cor.15 that those who are resurrected in the 1st resurrection are ONLY those who are the dead in Christ.

JOHN 5 [28]Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, [29] And shall come forth; THEY THAT HAVE DONE GOOD, unto the resurrection of life; and THEY THAT HAVE DONE EVIL, unto the resurrection of damnation.

John5 must be speaking of the 2nd resurrection which happens after the 1000 yr period of rest. The Great White Throne. Youll notice theres nothing in the above scripture about belief in Christ or God. Also at that time the good and the bad (and the ugly) shall come forth from their graves.

REV. 20 [11]And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. [12] And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and THE BOOKS WERE OPENED: and another book was opened, which is THE BOOK OF LIFE: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, ACCORDING TO THEIR WORKS. [13] And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. [14] And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. [15] And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Again, no mention of belief in Jesus or God. They are simply judged by their works. The book of life is opened at this time and also the book which we want no part of is opened.

MATTHEW 19 [16]And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, WHAT GOOD THING SHALL I DO, THAT I MAY HAVE ETERNAL LIFE? [17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. [18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, [19] Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

The works these people will be judged by is that portion of the ten commandments that pertain to your interaction with man. Jesus tells us that, so you can take it to the bank.The man asked Jesus how he should attain eternal life. Jesus did not mention even one of the ten commandments that deal with your interaction with God. Had Jesus been asked, how shall I be saved? Jesus would have given a totally different answer. But if these scriptures say what they appear to say the American Indian or whomever, has a chance to attain eternal life while never having heard of Jesus.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Well, i was hoping to find more scripture to prove that you can attain eternal life and not be saved to the Kingdom but i suppose ill just post what ive found.

REV. 20 [4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. [5] But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. [6] Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

We know from 1 Cor.15 that those who are resurrected in the 1st resurrection are ONLY those who are the dead in Christ.

JOHN 5 [28]Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, [29] And shall come forth; THEY THAT HAVE DONE GOOD, unto the resurrection of life; and THEY THAT HAVE DONE EVIL, unto the resurrection of damnation.

John5 must be speaking of the 2nd resurrection which happens after the 1000 yr period of rest. The Great White Throne. Youll notice theres nothing in the above scripture about belief in Christ or God. Also at that time the good and the bad (and the ugly) shall come forth from their graves.

REV. 20 [11]And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. [12] And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and THE BOOKS WERE OPENED: and another book was opened, which is THE BOOK OF LIFE: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, ACCORDING TO THEIR WORKS. [13] And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. [14] And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. [15] And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Again, no mention of belief in Jesus or God. They are simply judged by their works. The book of life is opened at this time and also the book which we want no part of is opened.

MATTHEW 19 [16]And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, WHAT GOOD THING SHALL I DO, THAT I MAY HAVE ETERNAL LIFE? [17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. [18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, [19] Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

The works these people will be judged by is that portion of the ten commandments that pertain to your interaction with man. Jesus tells us that, so you can take it to the bank.The man asked Jesus how he should attain eternal life. Jesus did not mention even one of the ten commandments that deal with your interaction with God. Had Jesus been asked, how shall I be saved? Jesus would have given a totally different answer. But if these scriptures say what they appear to say the American Indian or whomever, has a chance to attain eternal life while never having heard of Jesus.

Just one question on your interpretation of John. It is a smart thing to conclude that the resurrection that John speaks of is the second resurrection except for one thing. Those who are resurrected to life would have been those that are dead in Christ. The dead in Christ would have been resurrected and changed along with those that are alive at his coming before the 1000 years.

If there are some that are saved in the second resurrection and were not dead in Christ then your conclusion will be correct. The dead in Christ are resurrected first i.e the first resurrection. The first resurrection in Revelation 20 must include the dead in Christ from 1 thess 4:16 and 1 Cor 15: 52. I believe that the resurrections in John are 1000 years apart. Those that rise to life eternal are resurrected at his second coming because at that point the dead in Christ are given immortal bodies. The 2nd resurrection are for the rest of the dead. Those that were not resurrected 1000 years prior. They are not saints. That is the resurrection of damnation.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Well, i was hoping to find more scripture to prove that you can attain eternal life and not be saved to the Kingdom but i suppose ill just post what ive found.

REV. 20 [4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. [5] But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. [6] Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

We know from 1 Cor.15 that those who are resurrected in the 1st resurrection are ONLY those who are the dead in Christ.

JOHN 5 [28]Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, [29] And shall come forth; THEY THAT HAVE DONE GOOD, unto the resurrection of life; and THEY THAT HAVE DONE EVIL, unto the resurrection of damnation.

John5 must be speaking of the 2nd resurrection which happens after the 1000 yr period of rest. The Great White Throne. Youll notice theres nothing in the above scripture about belief in Christ or God. Also at that time the good and the bad (and the ugly) shall come forth from their graves.

REV. 20 [11]And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. [12] And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and THE BOOKS WERE OPENED: and another book was opened, which is THE BOOK OF LIFE: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, ACCORDING TO THEIR WORKS. [13] And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. [14] And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. [15] And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Again, no mention of belief in Jesus or God. They are simply judged by their works. The book of life is opened at this time and also the book which we want no part of is opened.

MATTHEW 19 [16]And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, WHAT GOOD THING SHALL I DO, THAT I MAY HAVE ETERNAL LIFE? [17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. [18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, [19] Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

The works these people will be judged by is that portion of the ten commandments that pertain to your interaction with man. Jesus tells us that, so you can take it to the bank.The man asked Jesus how he should attain eternal life. Jesus did not mention even one of the ten commandments that deal with your interaction with God. Had Jesus been asked, how shall I be saved? Jesus would have given a totally different answer. But if these scriptures say what they appear to say the American Indian or whomever, has a chance to attain eternal life while never having heard of Jesus.

You could be 100% correct. I understand the logic and i am leaning toward believing this totally.

 

[WailingWall]

Just one question on your interpretation of John. It is a smart thing to conclude that the resurrection that John speaks of is the second resurrection except for one thing. Those who are resurrected to life would have been those that are dead in Christ. The dead in Christ would have been resurrected and changed along with those that are alive at his coming before the 1000 years.

I believe that those of the 1st resurrection are only those that believe in Jesus and observe to keep the 10 commandments. Including the sabbath. They will be "saved" to the kingdom for the 1000 yr period of rest. The "those that have done good" that are mention in John 5 are those who kept that portion of the 10 commandments that deal with your actions toward man. They may never had heard of Jesus and wont be judged till the great white throne after the 1000 yr period of rest.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

I believe that those of the 1st resurrection are only those that believe in Jesus and observe to keep the 10 commandments. Including the sabbath. They will be "saved" to the kingdom for the 1000 yr period of rest. The "those that have done good" that are mention in John 5 are those who kept that portion of the 10 commandments that deal with your actions toward man. They may never had heard of Jesus and wont be judged till the great white throne after the 1000 yr period of rest.

I believe that you are correct. I see it now. Probably those are the "ignorant" that Gods has winked at. He will use the sincerity of their hearts towards their fellow men to make his judgment. Good Stuff WailingWall

 

[New_Wineskin]

No one seems to want to deal with our american indians.

That wasn't a part of your OP . Without mentioning it in the OP , why would there be responses ?

Could they find eternal life without Jesus? Its really a simple question. What are your thoughts.

My thoughts are that they were in the same boat as those in Noah's time and Abraham's time . Being on the other side of the world didn't prevent them from having a relationship with the Lord .

 

[Rick Otto]

I agree.

 

[Idea]

I have one great wish. I wanna be saved. But I have questions.

1. Must i keep Gods 10 commandments in order to be saved? Includind His sabbath.

2. Must i keep Gods Holy Days in order to be saved?

3. Must i keep the testimony of Jesus in order to be saved?

4. Can i attain eternal life and not be saved?

I would love to hear from as many as see this post. What do you think about all 4 questions. Or any that you might have knowlegde of. We are all here for one reason. We seek the Lord. HE says you will not seek ME in vain. That is one thing we all must believe. HE said it, i believe it! No matter our differences.

From your questions it seems you do not understand what it means to be saved, and what eternal life is.

Who do you admire? who do you want to be?

A gluttonous slob who cannot do anything for Himself, who has no honor, has earned no respect? Or would you be someone more noble?

Faith and works not Faith vs works… works… puppets, machines, robots with no free will gain no respect. we all have the choice to take ownership of our life or not.

Two truths:
Joy does not come from outside, for whatever happens to us it is within
Light does not come to us from without. Light is in us, even if we have no eyes.
- Jacques Lusseyran
(WW2 Blind Hero of the French Resistance - Buchenwald survivor)

John4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

Luke21:19 In your patience possess ye your souls.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

From your questions it seems you do not understand what it means to be saved, and what eternal life is.

Who do you admire? who do you want to be?

A gluttonous slob who cannot do anything for Himself, who has no honor, has earned no respect? Or would you be someone more noble?

Faith and works not Faith vs works… works… puppets, machines, robots with no free will gain no respect. we all have the choice to take ownership of our life or not.

Two truths:
Joy does not come from outside, for whatever happens to us it is within
Light does not come to us from without. Light is in us, even if we have no eyes.
- Jacques Lusseyran
(WW2 Blind Hero of the French Resistance - Buchenwald survivor)

John4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

Luke21:19 In your patience possess ye your souls.

Just because those questions were asked it does not mean that the OP does not know the things you mentioned. You judge quickly. People ask questions to make a point. Don't you know that? I think that you being very rude to the OP.

 

[Catholic Christian]

Believe on the Lord Jesus christ and thou shalt be saved..

James 2:19: "...the demons also believe, and shudder."