Saved!

[WailingWall]

Everyone seems to be saying the same thing. In order to attain eternal life you must be saved. Scriptures say your saved through faith in Jesus. So what about those people who never heard of Jesus because of their circumstances. Like i mentioned before, the american indian who were pre pilgrim. They never had a chance to hear about Jesus. Are they thrown in hell?

 

[WailingWall]

Are you asking whether it is possible to attain eternal life if you haven't ever heard of Jesus?

Yes, thats what im asking.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Yes, thats what im asking.

Act 17:30

(BBE) Those times when men had no knowledge were overlooked by God; but now he gives orders to all men in every place to undergo a change of heart:

(ESV) The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent,

(ISV) Though God has overlooked those times of ignorance, he now commands everyone everywhere to repent,

(KJVR) And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

(LITV) Truly, then, God overlooking the times of ignorance, now strictly commands all men everywhere to repent,

(MKJV) Truly, then, God overlooking the times of ignorance, now He strictly commands all men everywhere to repent,

(RV) The times of ignorance therefore God overlooked; but now he commandeth men that they should all everywhere repent:

God knows how he are going to deal with the ignorant ones.

 

[Rick Otto]

Yes, thats what im asking.

I think it would have to be. If the OT saints have eternal life, it is in that sense possible. But they did know about The Christ, born of a virgin (in contrast to Adam's seed),that satan would bruise His heel, & that He would crush the serpent's head. All figurative speech for a divine incarnation, fatal wounding, & victorius comeback.
So broaden your idea of who Jesus was & is, & what knowing (understanding) Him means.
If you know The Way, The Truth, & The Life, you know Jesus.

 

[WailingWall]

I think it would have to be. If the OT saints have eternal life, it is in that sense possible. But they did know about The Christ, born of a virgin (in contrast to Adam's seed),that satan would bruise His heel, & that He would crush the serpent's head.

Yeah, i believe they knew

1 Cor. 10:1-4
Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; [2] And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; [3] And did all eat the same spiritual meat; [4] And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

 

[Catholic Christian]

Paul tells us: "For [God] will reward every man according to his works: to those who by perseverance in working good seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. There will be . . . glory and honor and peace for every one who does good, the Jew first and also the Greek. For God shows no partiality" (Rom. 2:6–11; cf. Gal. 6:6–10).

In the second century, the technical Latin term for "merit" was introduced as a synonym for the Greek word for "reward." Thus merit and reward are two sides of the same coin.

Protestants often misunderstand the Catholic teaching on merit, thinking that Catholics believe that one must do good works to come to God and be saved. This is exactly the opposite of what the Church teaches. The Council of Trent stressed: "[N]one of those things which precede justification, whether faith or works, merit the grace of justification; for if it is by grace, it is not now by works; otherwise, as the Apostle [Paul] says, grace is no more grace" (Decree on Justification 8, citing Rom. 11:6).

The Catholic Church teaches only Christ is capable of meriting in the strict sense—mere man cannot (Catechism of the Catholic Church 2007). The most merit humans can have is condign—when, under the impetus of God’s grace, they perform acts which please him and which he has promised to reward (Rom. 2:6–11, Gal. 6:6–10). Thus God’s grace and his promise form the foundation for all human merit (CCC 2008).

Virtually all of this is agreed to by Protestants, who recognize that, under the impetus of God’s grace, Christians do perform acts which are pleasing to God and which God has promised to reward, meaning that they fit the definition of merit. When faced with this, Protestants are forced to admit the truth of the Catholic position—although, contrary to Paul’s command (2 Tim. 2:14), they may still dispute the terminology.

Thus the Lutheran Book of Concord admits: "We are not putting forward an empty quibble about the term ‘reward.’ . . . We grant that eternal life is a reward because it is something that is owed—not because of our merits [in the strict sense] but because of the promise [of God]. We have shown above that justification is strictly a gift of God; it is a thing promised. To this gift the promise of eternal life has been added" (p. 162).

For what the early Christians said about all this, go here:
http://www.catholic.com/library/Reward_and_Merit.asp

 

[mattlock73]

I have one great wish. I wanna be saved. But I have questions.

1. Must i keep Gods 10 commandments in order to be saved? Includind His sabbath.

Salvation is given by grace through faith so that no man may boast. We are all sinners, and as long as we inhabit this flesh, we will continue to fight sin. The law was not made to make on righteous, but to show man that he could not obtain righteousness on his own. He has need of a Saviour. The only two commandments you should worry about keeping are the two that Jesus Himself gave us:
1) Love the Lord your God with all your heart
2) Love your neighbor as yourself.

If you follow those, you will never go wrong because they encompass the essence of all the rest of the law.

2. Must i keep Gods Holy Days in order to be saved?

Again, love your God with all your heart. What that means to you may be different from what that means to others. If you are asking me, "do I have to go to church to be saved?" Then IMHO, the answer is no you don't. Jesus is not found in a certain building on certain days of the week. But you do have to fellowship/study in order to grow spiritually which is also commanded of us once we are saved. The best place to find this is in a church.

3. Must i keep the testimony of Jesus in order to be saved?

I am not sure what you mean by that but I will give it a go. If you mean do you have be perfect the way that Christ was perfect, no. That isn't a free pass to do whatever you want though. The goal is to conform to the image of Christ, although we will never achieve it, once must strive for it.

4. Can i attain eternal life and not be saved?

Yes, but it's not going to be the kind of eternal life you would wish on your worst enemy. Remember Jesus' words... I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes to the Father but through me. For those that have not heard of Christ, the line is definitely a little more blurry. Rom 1 says all men are without excuse yet Rom 2:12 seems to give a little wiggle room in that.

I would love to hear from as many as see this post. What do you think about all 4 questions. Or any that you might have knowledge of. We are all here for one reason. We seek the Lord. HE says you will not seek ME in vain. That is one thing we all must believe. HE said it, i believe it! No matter our differences.

Amen!

 

[WailingWall]

I am not what I ought to be. I am not what I want to be. I am not what I hope to be. But still, I am not what I used to be. And by the grace of God, I am what I am

Yikes. The spirit is willing...

So be it

 

[WailingWall]

No one seems to want to deal with our american indians. Could they find eternal life without Jesus? Its really a simple question. What are your thoughts.

 

[mattlock73]

I am not what I ought to be. I am not what I want to be. I am not what I hope to be. But still, I am not what I used to be. And by the grace of God, I am what I am

Yikes. The spirit is willing...

So be it

What it means is that we are not perfect, but we are striving for it and continue to grow through God's grace.

 

[mattlock73]

No one seems to want to deal with our american indians. Could they find eternal life without Jesus? Its really a simple question. What are your thoughts.

There is another thread called is Jesus the only way which may help with some insights on the topic.

 

[zeke37]

I have one great wish. I wanna be saved. But I have questions.

1. Must i keep Gods 10 commandments in order to be saved? Includind His sabbath.

we must try...but remember that Christ actually became our Sabbath...we rest in Him...but that said, we may celebrate the Sabbath any way that we want to....personally, I rest in Christ every day...

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Heb 3:11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)

Heb 3:18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?

Heb 4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works. 5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.

Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

(important to rest the body too!)

2. Must i keep Gods Holy Days in order to be saved?

what are the Holy Days to you? To me they are Pentecost, Tabernacles and Passover(not easter)....done in what I consider to be a Christian way...here is an example of why we should keep the Passover

Col 2:16Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

1Cor 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

3. Must i keep the testimony of Jesus in order to be saved?

Yes....keeping His testimony is part of believing in Him...because that is part of it...we are to spread the Word of God, and hopefully that is put on a believers heart...

4. Can i attain eternal life and not be saved?
no...there is no life in the lake of Fire...only eternal destruction of the soul...


2Thes 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;


Mat 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

I would love to hear from as many as see this post. What do you think about all 4 questions. Or any that you might have knowledge of. We are all here for one reason. We seek the Lord. HE says you will not seek ME in vain. That is one thing we all must believe. HE said it, i believe it! No matter our differences.

that is very true...

in His service
c

 

[karen freeinchristman]

No one seems to want to deal with our american indians. Could they find eternal life without Jesus? Its really a simple question. What are your thoughts.

Did you miss this post?

Act 17:30

(RV) The times of ignorance therefore God overlooked; but now he commandeth men that they should all everywhere repent:

God knows how he are going to deal with the ignorant ones.

Basically, Wailing Wall, we don't know how God will deal with 'ignorant ones'. It's not only the pre-Pilgrim American Indians, it's also those who have heard the gospel, but heard it presented wrongly or by someone who is not actually spirit-filled and leads the person farther astray. What then? What about the people today who have not heard? What about babies and children who die before hearing the gospel?
You keep asking the question as if you already know the answer and we are all stupid. God alone knows how he will 'deal' with these people.

 

[MarkEvan]

The american Indians......................well Romans 2 has already been mentioned, there it says that people who have not had the law (nowadays I guess you would say have not had the gospel) will be judged by their consience and it will accuse or perhapse excuse them before God, let me make this all clear though............this would not be able to happen without Jesus and His sacrifice.
Romans 2 appears to be saying that someone in the position of having never heard, might serve the living God (remember a fool says in his heart there is no God - so all men have no reason to believe there isn`t one) through his adherance to the moral law, this in essence is what christianity is...............serving God.



Mark

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Ok i really need to ask something. What is the testimony of Jesus.

 

[WailingWall]

What about babies and children who die before hearing the gospel?
You keep asking the question as if you already know the answer and we are all stupid. God alone knows how he will 'deal' with these people.

Hi Karen
I do not know the answer. I was hoping someone had some scriptures to help explain. I have found some scriptures that MIGHT explain but im still searching for more. Do you really think i believe you are stupid, or are you just having a bad hair day. If so, youll find it does no good to attack other people, itll only make you feel worse.

 

[WailingWall]

Ok i really need to ask something. What is the testimony of Jesus.

Pretty much everything thats written in the new testament. Putting of the flesh, commandments kept at a higher spiritual level, by your words you will be judged, and so on. Although to tell ya the truth PK, for the most part ive found that what was said in the new testament had already been said in the old.

 

[stumpjumper]

Although to tell ya the truth PK, for the most part ive found that what was said in the new testament had already been said in the old.

Well I think the Gospel is the fulfillment of the Hebrew Bible. I don't believe it is just a second or another way of saying the same thing, though.

The Gospel is a universal message while the Old Covenant was God working through a chosen people to bring the Gospel to the world.

I think that people will be judged by the amount of light they have received and how they responded to that light.

 

[johnd]

You have a "Christian" icon
And I presume you believe in the authority of scripture as the word of God. (Psalm 119, Psalm 138:2)

I have one great wish. I wanna be saved. But I have questions.

1. Must i keep Gods 10 commandments in order to be saved? Including His sabbath.

Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

2. Must i keep Gods Holy Days in order to be saved?

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

3. Must i keep the testimony of Jesus in order to be saved?

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

4. Can i attain eternal life and not be saved?

1 John 2:25 And this is the promise that he hath promised us, even eternal life.

1 John 5:11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Hebrews 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

 

[christianmomof3]

Here is a site that explains salvation very well
http://www.godssalvation.org/
it has several pages so read through it
I love the diagram on this page
http://www.godssalvation.org/diagram/index.html
this one is good too
http://www.regenerated.net/

I pray that you will turn your heart to the Lord and find all the answers that you are seeking in Him. He is all of the answers.