How the Democratic Party opposes Christian Principles

[KomissarSteve]

I tend to interpret ""[FONT=&quot]But if by 'God,' one means the set of physical laws that govern the universe, then clearly there is such a God" as meaning that there is at least a semi-conscious order to the universe, in Sagan's view; otherwise, he would not have made a comparison between God and those laws.

Look, I think we're going to just have to agree to disagree on this one. I think Sagan believed in God, even if his view of God was vastly different from my own; you're obviously free to disagree on that point.
[/FONT]

 

[GettinInTune]

I tend to interpret ""[FONT=&quot]But if by 'God,' one means the set of physical laws that govern the universe, then clearly there is such a God" as meaning that there is at least a semi-conscious order to the universe, in Sagan's view; otherwise, he would not have made a comparison between God and those laws.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]
It means what it says. If you view the set of physical laws as god, then of course there is a god. Everyone one would believe in god. I would rather call them the set of physical laws that govern the universe. No where in that quote implied that these physical laws are conscious. Therefore, this god you think Sagan subscribed to is an unconscious entity.

Look, I think we're going to just have to agree to disagree on this one. I think Sagan believed in God, even if his view of God was vastly different from my own; you're obviously free to disagree on that point.

[/FONT]Read Sagan's work and read about him. Don't based and form your opinion on one single quote. I think you are taking it out of context. In order to get a better understanding of Sagan and his beliefs read what he wrote and what others wrote of him. He was a materialist and humanist. If he did believe in this so-called god, it was unconscious.No where in that quote implied consciousness and the last time I checked the physical laws are not conscious.

I ask you again to describe this god that Sagan believed in.

 

[clirus]

GettinInTune quote

It means what it says. If you view the set of physical laws as god, then of course there is a god. Everyone one would believe in god. I would rather call them the set of physical laws that govern the universe. No where in that quote implied that these physical laws are conscious. Therefore, this god you think Sagan subscribed to is an unconscious entity.

Response

Why worship the physical laws when you can worship the creator the physical laws?

Too many people just cannot humble themselves to acknowledge that God does exist, and that God is the creator of all things, spiritual and physical.

Proverbs 9:10 states, "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom; and the knowledge of the holy is understanding."

 

[LilGeorgiaPeach81]

I must agree above, Sagan was a non-believer, and is suffering the consequences of a non-believer. He just tried and tried to dance around admitting that God made the universe, and him too. His legs musta got tired from all that dancing!

 

[GettinInTune]

Why worship the physical laws when you can worship the creator the physical laws?

No one is saying that you should worship the physical laws. It was a metaphor at best. Some people do not believe in God. It is ok if they do not.

Too many people just cannot humble themselves to acknowledge that God does exist, and that God is the creator of all things, spiritual and physical.

It is not about humbling one's self.

Proverbs 9:10 states, "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom; and the knowledge of the holy is understanding."

You must fear the Lord in order to have wisdom?

 

[GettinInTune]

I must agree above, Sagan was a non-believer, and is suffering the consequences of a non-believer. He just tried and tried to dance around admitting that God made the universe, and him too. His legs musta got tired from all that dancing!

Yup, he is suffering the consequences of a non-believer. You are exactly right; our Earth is center stage in a cosmic play between good and evil. Sounds humbling and enlightening.

This is my last post on this thread.

 

[KomissarSteve]

I must agree above, Sagan was a non-believer, and is suffering the consequences of a non-believer. He just tried and tried to dance around admitting that God made the universe, and him too. His legs musta got tired from all that dancing!

You are in no position to determine the state of someone's salvation.

 

[flicka]

You are in no position to determine the state of someone's salvation.

True. But I'm waiting for someone to say "fruit"....

 

[oldbetang]

You are in no position to determine the state of someone's salvation.

No, we wouldn't want to determine the state of someone salvation, would we Mr. Komissar "Falwell is in Hell" Steve?

 

[KomissarSteve]

No, we wouldn't want to determine the state of someone salvation, would we Mr. Komissar "Falwell is in Hell" Steve?

LOL, when and where did I say that?

 

[KomissarSteve]

True. But I'm waiting for someone to say "fruit"....

Check out one of the threads on Craig; I forgot which, but I kept having to say it, for complete lack of a better word.

 

[Nathan Poe]

I must agree above, Sagan was a non-believer, and is suffering the consequences of a non-believer.

he died -- same as believers do.

He just tried and tried to dance around admitting that God made the universe, and him too. His legs musta got tired from all that dancing!

Last I heard, Cancer isn't caused by excessive dancing, although I'm sure some fundies would love people to think so.

 

[KomissarSteve]

he died -- same as believers do.



Last I heard, Cancer isn't caused by excessive dancing, although I'm sure some fundies would love people to think so.

It's God's punishment for believing in evolution.

That, or He'll give us a case of teh gay.

 

[oldbetang]

Originally Posted by oldbetang ​

No, we wouldn't want to determine the state of someone's salvation, would we Mr. Komissar "Falwell is in Hell" Steve?​

​

LOL, when and where did I say that?

Originally Posted by silentreader ​

there you go again claiming that these people (e.g. Jerry Falwell) are leading people astray. and now it is possibly to Hell, not so sure now? Jerry Falwell was used by God, this is evident from personal testimony.​

​

Originally Posted by KomissarSteve

It still is my opinion that he's in Hell.

 

[KomissarSteve]

Originally Posted by oldbetang ​

No, we wouldn't want to determine the state of someone's salvation, would we Mr. Komissar "Falwell is in Hell" Steve?​

​

​

LOL, I wasn't denying it; I just am surprised that I came out and said it so blatantly. I must've been having a really bad day.

 

[clirus]

The Purpose of Government

The purpose of government should be to protect the nation from external and internal evil. The purpose of the government should not be to provide services to the people.

The government providing protection serves all the people. The government providing services provides mostly for those who live the Atheistic Lifestyle (self inflicted suffering). Those who are suffering/needy because of natural causes are the responsibility of the church.

Providing services to the people does nothing more than using taxes to rob the righteous to give to the unrighteous through welfare and healthcare programs.

Providing protection to the people means the government prevents external and internal evil from destroying/capturing the nation and thus eliminating freedom for all the people.

When there are welfare/healthcare programs, there will have to be restrictions on the lives of people because people will always abuse any freebie that is offered. These restrictions means freedom is lost.

Republicans support the protection concept of government by advocating Democracy, Christianity and Capitalism.

Democrats support the services concept of government by advocating Democracy, Atheism and Socialism.

UNIVERSAL HEATH CARE

Universal Health Care is probably the best proof of the failure of the Atheistic Lifestyle that is promoted by the Atheistic Liberal News and Entertainment Industry and the democratic party.

When siting the need for Universal Health Care the first words are that there are 47 million uninsured Americans. 8 million of whom are children. This may be a true statement but why are the children without health insurance? Most of these children are without health insurance because they are illegitimate and living in a single parent home. A single parent home does not have enough income to provide health insurance and the children get sick because the mother is working instead of taking care of the children.

The Christian Lifestyle promotes the Christian Family Concept of a man, a women and the children. The man provides for the family, and the woman nurtures the family. This Christian Family Concept is being destroyed by the pornography and the feminism advocated by the Atheistic Liberal News and Entertainment Industry and the democratic party. The pornography attacks the men, the feminism attacks the women and the children suffer.

This problem will only get worse, unless there is a return to the Christian Family Concept of the Christian Lifestyle.

It amazes me to see someone advocate that the Universal Health Care would be like Medicare. Medicare is the biggest mess ever created by socialists. The costs are impossible to control and the payments into Medicare will constantly increase. Universal Health Care will be much worse than Medicare.

The reason Atheists purpose Universal Health Care is to force the healthy/righteous to pay for the unhealthy/unrighteous. A better way to approach the problem is to quit promoting the unhealthy/unrighteous lifestyle.

There is a clear choice for America on this issue. Democrats advocate Universal Health Care because the people that vote for them live the Atheistic Lifestyle. Republicans do not advocate Universal Health Care because the people that vote for them live the Christian Lifestyle.

Capitalistic Health Care produce unequally good healthcare, but Universal Health Care produces equally bad healthcare.

 

[Nathan Poe]

The purpose of government should be to protect the nation from external and internal evil. The purpose of the government should not be to provide services to the people.

Rubbish. Government serves the people.

The government providing protection serves all the people. The government providing services provides mostly for those who live the Atheistic Lifestyle (self inflicted suffering). Those who are suffering/needy because of natural causes are the responsibility of the church.

And when the church cannot/will not help people?

Providing services to the people does nothing more than using taxes to rob the righteous to give to the unrighteous through welfare and healthcare programs.

The government are the last people I'd trust to judge the righteous from the unrighteous.

Providing protection to the people means the government prevents external and internal evil from destroying/capturing the nation and thus eliminating freedom for all the people.

So instead the government eliminates freedom for all the people?

When there are welfare/healthcare programs, there will have to be restrictions on the lives of people because people will always abuse any freebie that is offered. These restrictions means freedom is lost.

So, take away freedom before they abuse it?

Republicans support the protection concept of government by advocating Democracy, Christianity and Capitalism.

Democrats support the services concept of government by advocating Democracy, Atheism and Socialism.

Double-edged sword, Democracy is...

UNIVERSAL HEATH CARE

Universal Health Care is probably the best proof of the failure of the Atheistic Lifestyle that is promoted by the Atheistic Liberal News and Entertainment Industry and the democratic party.

When siting the need for Universal Health Care the first words are that there are 47 million uninsured Americans. 8 million of whom are children. This may be a true statement but why are the children without health insurance? Most of these children are without health insurance because they are illegitimate and living in a single parent home. A single parent home does not have enough income to provide health insurance and the children get sick because the mother is working instead of taking care of the children.

Are you thus saying that these children don't deserve health care?

The Christian Lifestyle promotes the Christian Family Concept of a man, a women and the children. The man provides for the family, and the woman nurtures the family. This Christian Family Concept is being destroyed by the pornography and the feminism advocated by the Atheistic Liberal News and Entertainment Industry and the democratic party. The pornography attacks the men, the feminism attacks the women and the children suffer.

So your answer is to leave them to rot. How Christian of you.

This problem will only get worse, unless there is a return to the Christian Family Concept of the Christian Lifestyle.

And then the problem will get abominable.

It amazes me to see someone advocate that the Universal Health Care would be like Medicare. Medicare is the biggest mess ever created by socialists. The costs are impossible to control and the payments into Medicare will constantly increase. Universal Health Care will be much worse than Medicare.

Because it will help the people you hate.

The reason Atheists purpose Universal Health Care is to force the healthy/righteous to pay for the unhealthy/unrighteous. A better way to approach the problem is to quit promoting the unhealthy/unrighteous lifestyle.

And leave anyone you consider unrighteous to die.

There is a clear choice for America on this issue. Democrats advocate Universal Health Care because the people that vote for them live the Atheistic Lifestyle. Republicans do not advocate Universal Health Care because the people that vote for them live the Christian Lifestyle.

Death to the infidels, one way or another.

Capitalistic Health Care produce unequally good healthcare, but Universal Health Care produces equally bad healthcare.

And as long as the people who suffer are "unrighteous," what do you care, right, clirus?

 

[thaumaturgy]

Providing services to the people does nothing more than using taxes to rob the righteous to give to the unrighteous through welfare and healthcare programs.

[bible]Deuteronomy 15:7[/bible]

UNIVERSAL HEATH CARE

Universal Health Care is probably the best proof of the failure of the Atheistic Lifestyle that is promoted by the Atheistic Liberal News and Entertainment Industry and the democratic party.

When siting the need for Universal Health Care the first words are that there are 47 million uninsured Americans. 8 million of whom are children. This may be a true statement but why are the children without health insurance? Most of these children are without health insurance because they are illegitimate and living in a single parent home. A single parent home does not have enough income to provide health insurance and the children get sick because the mother is working instead of taking care of the children.

And we all know Republicans never raise taxes to the point that both parents have to work or there isn't any available child care for single working parents. Right?

C'mon. Gimme a break. You can't lay the failed U.S. healthcare system on the laps of the poor.

The Christian Lifestyle promotes the Christian Family Concept of a man, a women and the children.

Do you honestly believe "Democrats" and "atheists" don't get married and don't have stable marriages???

Then maybe you need to read THIS. Note how the horrible "Blue States" in that bastion of gay marriage, Massachusetts have a very low divorce rate!

"
As researchers have noted, the areas of the country where divorce rates are highest are also frequently the areas where many conservative Christians live."

Please, if you are going to slag dems, libruls and other "bad" people, make sure your own house is in order.

[bible]Matthew 7:3[/bible]

The man provides for the family, and the woman nurtures the family. This Christian Family Concept is being destroyed by the pornography and the feminism advocated by the Atheistic Liberal News and Entertainment Industry and the democratic party.

What about Feminism scares you so? Do you actually know any women? I'm assuming you are not a woman. If you are a man, do you realize how offensive you sound when you complain about feminism?

My wife has worked very hard for the ERA. She is my equal in all ways. If she wasn't I wouldn't want to be married to her.

Maybe, as an atheist librul, women don't scare me as much as they do you.

When you treat people with respect, good things tend to happen.

This problem will only get worse, unless there is a return to the Christian Family Concept of the Christian Lifestyle.

You mean like in the U.S. "Red States"?

"Of the 25 cities with the lowest rates of violent crime, 62 percent are in "blue" states and 38 percent are in "red" states."

It amazes me to see someone advocate that the Universal Health Care would be like Medicare. Medicare is the biggest mess ever created by socialists.

What about the "universal-style" VA medical system ? Do you know it is now considered one of the best "universal-style" healtcare systems?

1. New England Journal of Medicine published a study that compared veterans health facilities on 11 measures of quality with fee-for-service Medicare. On all 11 measures, the quality of care in veterans facilities proved to be “significantly better.”'

2. 'The Annals of Internal Medicine recently published a study that compared veterans health facilities with commercial managed-care systems in their treatment of diabetes patients. In seven out of seven measures of quality, the VA provided better care.'

SOURCE

The reason Atheists purpose Universal Health Care is to force the healthy/righteous to pay for the unhealthy/unrighteous. A better way to approach the problem is to quit promoting the unhealthy/unrighteous lifestyle.

At least they seem to be doing God's work better than you would have them!

[bible]Leviticus 19:10[/bible]
[bible]Deuteronomy 15:11[/bible]
[bible]Psalm 41:1[/bible]
[bible]Psalm 82:3[/bible]

I feel sorry for your version of God's love. Apparently you haven't read your bible. Might want to check it out before you have a go at "atheists".

 

[clirus]

All the verses of the Bible call for charity by a person, not charity by the government. A Christian is commanded to remember the poor, but the Christian is not commanded to participate in a government run program that offers assistance to those who have self inflicted misery. The best way to help the self inflicted problems is the change the heart of the person by accepting Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, then the assistance will be effective.

Prevention vs Cure

The Bible favors prevention versus cure. The Republican party favors prevention and the democratic party favors cure. Abortion is a cure to the problem of sexual immorality. Funding for AIDS is the cure for the sin of homosexuality. Welfare is the cure for the sin of pornography that lead to the illegitimate children that leads to the need for welfare.

Republicans and Christians want to prevent people from getting to where they need abortion, AIDS cures and welfare. Abortion, AIDS and welfare are very painful to the people involved.

Cure requires a big government to tax the people so the government can provide money to the afflicted. Even the word cure is misleading because there is never a cure for the knowledge of an abortion, there is no cure for AIDS, and the slavery of welfare is horrible. Life can be sustained, but it is not the life Jesus Christ wants for mankind.

Prevention requires a person accept Jesus Christ because the self restraint required to resist the temptation of Satan is difficult. But the good news is that Jesus is available to all those who will accept Him.

Now I ask you, which is loving your neighbor as yourself, prevention or cure?

 

[thaumaturgy]

All the verses of the Bible call for charity by a person, not charity by the government.

God made his commandments to the people of Israel. It was to be part of their governance.

[bible]Exodus 23:11[/bible]

I can understand why you sincerely don't want this to be the case, but God does appear to want his people to care for the poor. I understand you may not want to take care of the poor but you want to worship God. Unfortunately you would fail in one by doing the other.

But just keep hold of your money and fight every tax levy that comes up. And keep telling yourself that all poor people in the U.S. are poor because of bad things they did and that they deserve it!

That way you can wash your hands of any responsibility.

[bible]Matthew 27:24[/bible]

There was a guy in Christianity who once said:

[bible]Matthew 25:40[/bible]

I think, if I recall, he was somewhat important to Christianity. Maybe you've heard about this guy?

A Christian is commanded to remember the poor, but the Christian is not commanded to participate in a government run program that offers assistance to those who have self inflicted misery.

Just keep telling yourself the poor are there because of bad things they did. Maybe it'll help you through should you ever be laid off from work, have a tough time finding employment, or god-forbid, you work as a FIRE FIGHTER or POLICE OFFICER and have to get individual health insurance in the U.S.

Why Firefighter and police officer? Well because some health insurance companies in the U.S. can and do deny coverage for these jobs. (LA Times, Jan 8,2007, Lisa Girion article)

Do you have asthma? Cancer? Diabetes? Because those can also get you denied coverage in the U.S.

Man, those bad people who went and caught themselves some Cancer or Diabetes, what were they thinking??? They were just having a good time getting cancer and diabetes.

So maybe you need to moderate your stance or you will be judged just as harshly should you fall upon hard times or get a bad disease not of your choosing.

I honestly don't understand Christians who can hold such repellant beliefs. Not just because they are repellent beliefs, but because they go directly against what God and Jesus command on this. There's often little positive stuff in the Old Testament, why deny the really good messages?

The best way to help the self inflicted problems is the change the heart of the person by accepting Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, then the assistance will be effective.

Yeah, are you under the age of 12? Maybe when you see the big world you'll see your fairy tale that only bad things happen to bad people is false.

Until that time, please don't vote.

I beg you as a fellow citizen of the U.S. we don't need your input. We've already got enough problems as it is.

PS: In case you are wondering, my wife and I don't have any kids and we actively voted for tax increases for school improvements when we lived in Massachusetts. In California I have worked for a grass-roots movement to get universal health care, despite the fact it will end up costing me more in taxes.

So, I'll tell you, I'm putting my money where my mouth is. What are you doing? Are you just spouting off on bulletin boards and praying in your church on Sunday?