Yes, but what if we are not wrong?

[agua]

If God cares about everyone, why wouldn't he enable everyone?

In the same manner that Yahweh revealed the heart condition of Pharoah ( the condition that pre-existed and made Pharoah blind to the truth ), Yahweh allows all people to come to Him in humility. These humble seekers are the ones Yahweh enables to find Him.

 

[JackofSpades]

So, what if it turns out to be all true and you will most likely burn, not being able to assume God's love?

I would say: "I do really hope that I somehow actually deserve this, unlikely as it seems. Because if I don't, that would mean that you're just a vain, sadist dictator having a powertrip and sooner or later you're going to turn your back on everyone on that paradise place aswell and take back everything you promised to them."

 

[Wryetui]

In the same manner that Yahweh revealed the heart condition of Pharoah ( the condition that pre-existed and made Pharoah blind to the truth ), Yahweh allows all people to come to Him in humility. These humble seekers are the ones Yahweh enables to find Him.

Exactly. What does Christ say? "Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God.", He gives us the manner in which we can see God, not in a rational way, there are no rational proofs or reasons for believing in God, God reveals Himself in the heart of the humble, you atheists say that you are tired of hearing christians saying "I can't prove God's existence, I just feel Him in my heart", there lies God, there lies Christ.

 

[agua]

Exactly. What does Christ say? "Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God.", He gives us the manner in which we can see God, not in a rational way, there are no rational proofs or reasons for believing in God, God reveals Himself in the heart of the humble, you atheists say that you are tired of hearing christians saying "I can't prove God's existence, I just feel Him in my heart", there lies God, there lies Christ.

I disagree that faith isn't rational; in fact I suggest it is evidence based as per Hebrews 11. ( and my personal experinces of course )

As you suggest; Yahweh reveals Himself ( progressively more ) as the humble human seeks Him.

 

[Wryetui]

I disagree that faith isn't rational; in fact I suggest it is evidence based as per Hebrews 11. ( and my personal experinces of course )

As you suggest; Yahweh reveals Himself ( progressively more ) as the humble human seeks Him.

I was referring as in a mathematic or scientific way, God isn't 1+1=2, God isn't the capital of the UK is London, God isn't a rock we hold in our hands, God must be felt in the heart.

 

[bhsmte]

I disagree that faith isn't rational; in fact I suggest it is evidence based as per Hebrews 11. ( and my personal experinces of course )

As you suggest; Yahweh reveals Himself ( progressively more ) as the humble human seeks Him.

I guess that would depend on how one rationalizes, as people tend to adjust rationalization, according to their psyche.

And in regards to evidence; your personal experiences I would never question, but external objective evidence that points directly to a God, I have yet to see.

 

[True Scotsman]

No, it is not that way

You don't burn in hell for not believing in God. You "burn" in hell because of what sin has did to us, because it has rotten our soul, and has degraded it, it is a reality, our soul is like it is because of sin, and what it has done to us. You are sending yourself to hell, like if you are diseased and refuse by any ways the medication, what can the doctor do your you? Christ, He is the great doctor of humanity, you don't burn in hell because He punishes you for not believing in Him, He is the God of love, not just a selfish human like us, He doesn't need our praises to Him, but we need Him as our doctor. God has seen what sin did to us, so He sent His only Son so we can be healed by Him, if we refuse that healing, if we refuse that medication, is the doctor guilty because the patients refused His medication, even if that medication costed Him His life?

No it is not, you won't blame a doctor in a hospital for a patient's life if that doctor gave him the meds he needed but he refused to take them, so why do you blame God because you are sending yourself to Hell?

I would blame the doctor if he was the one who created the disease.

 

[bhsmte]

In the same manner that Yahweh revealed the heart condition of Pharoah ( the condition that pre-existed and made Pharoah blind to the truth ), Yahweh allows all people to come to Him in humility. These humble seekers are the ones Yahweh enables to find Him.

Speaking of rationalization, this would be an example of how we rationalize differently, in regards to what can be reconciled as credible.

 

[bhsmte]

No, it is not that way

You don't burn in hell for not believing in God. You "burn" in hell because of what sin has did to us, because it has rotten our soul, and has degraded it, it is a reality, our soul is like it is because of sin, and what it has done to us. You are sending yourself to hell, like if you are diseased and refuse by any ways the medication, what can the doctor do your you? Christ, He is the great doctor of humanity, you don't burn in hell because He punishes you for not believing in Him, He is the God of love, not just a selfish human like us, He doesn't need our praises to Him, but we need Him as our doctor. God has seen what sin did to us, so He sent His only Son so we can be healed by Him, if we refuse that healing, if we refuse that medication, is the doctor guilty because the patients refused His medication, even if that medication costed Him His life?

This is full of contradictions.

No it is not, you won't blame a doctor in a hospital for a patient's life if that doctor gave him the meds he needed but he refused to take them, so why do you blame God because you are sending yourself to Hell?

Well, one can show objectively, the doctor provided the treatment the patient needed. Can you show objectively, without relying on your interpretation of scripture, that a God gave everyone what they needed?

 

[agua]

I was referring as in a mathematic or scientific way, God isn't 1+1=2, God isn't the capital of the UK is London, God isn't a rock we hold in our hands, God must be felt in the heart.

I still disagree Yahweh is felt in the heart yes, but also experienced with the mind/intellect as per Hebrews 11 and my personal experiences.

It's ok that we disgree though, I disagree with most christian I know on this matter.

 

[agua]

I guess that would depend on how one rationalizes, as people tend to adjust rationalization, according to their psyche.

And in regards to evidence; your personal experiences I would never question, but external objective evidence that points directly to a God, I have yet to see.

We've discussed this before Bhsmte, and your burden upon evidence is your choice.

Speaking of rationalization, this would be an example of how we rationalize differently, in regards to what can be reconciled as credible.

I don't see this in the way the scriptures teach us how Pharoah's heart condition decided his recations to Yahweh, and consequently how this applies to all humans. I think we may be mixing exegesis with credibilty, again.

 

[bhsmte]

We've discussed this before Bhsmte, and your burden upon evidence is your choice.




I don't see this in the way the scriptures teach us how Pharoah's heart condition decided his recations to Yahweh, and consequently how this applies to all humans. I think we may be mixing exegesis with credibilty, again.

Agree.

My investigation into the NT, has told me it's credibility is in serious question.

I understand though, why it is important for your beliefs.

 

[agua]

Agree.

My investigation into the NT, has told me it's credibility is in serious question.

I understand though, why it is important for your beliefs.

Yes thank you. To be fair; you may also accept that I understand why deciding the NT is incredible is important to your beliefs.

On another nore Bhsmte, do you give the Torah, and it's contents, credibilty ?

 

[Wryetui]

I would blame the doctor if he was the one who created the disease.

God did not created the disease, God did not created sin, God did not created death.

 

[bhsmte]

Yes thank you. To be fair; you may also accept that I understand why deciding the NT is incredible is important to your beliefs.

On another nore Bhsmte, do you give the Torah, and it's contents, credibilty ?

From a historicity standpoint, no.

The Torah, not unlike the NT, is mainly a work of theology, not a work of historical accuracy.

 

[bhsmte]

God did not created the disease, God did not created sin, God did not created death.

In your opinion, what did God create?

 

[Wryetui]

A perfect world: "God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning--the sixth day.", but we ruined it.

 

[True Scotsman]

God did not created the disease, God did not created sin, God did not created death.

According to the myth, he created everything with perfect foreknowledge of what would happen, did he not? So he is responsible. And if I am sending myself to Hell then I choose not to send myself there. Problem solved.

 

[bhsmte]

A perfect world: "God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning--the sixth day.", but we ruined it.

Are you including man as being created perfect in this perfect world, or was man created flawed?

You see, if man was created perfect, why would he sin? If the capability to sin in God's eyes was in man, than he wasn't create perfect than was he?

 

[Wryetui]

Man fall because of his choice, not because God lead him into it. The capacity of choice is within every one of us and there is nothing bad in it, as there is nothing bad in a knife, it depends how you use it.