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Would you glorify God if Calvinism was true?

Would you glorify Him?

  • Yes

    Votes: 9 69.2%
  • No

    Votes: 4 30.8%

  • Total voters
    13

BNR32FAN

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I just thought I’d take a poll on how many Christians would glorify God if they arrived in heaven only to find out that Calvinism is true and their children or their loved ones were thrown into the lake of fire because they weren’t arbitrarily chosen before creation?
 

Hoping2

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I just thought I’d take a poll on how many Christians would glorify God if they arrived in heaven only to find out that Calvinism is true and their children or their loved ones were thrown into the lake of fire because they weren’t arbitrarily chosen before creation?
I have never been able to get a Calvinist to show me how he knows he was one of the 'lucky' ones God picked.
It is faith in a doctrine, and not faith in God.
 
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BNR32FAN

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I have never been able to get a Calvinist to show me how he knows he was one of the 'lucky' ones God picked.
It is faith in a doctrine, and not faith in God.
Well it’s faith in hoping you were picked, faith in Christ becomes irrelevant.
 
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Neogaia777

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I just thought I’d take a poll on how many Christians would glorify God if they arrived in heaven only to find out that Calvinism is true and their children or their loved ones were thrown into the lake of fire because they weren’t arbitrarily chosen before creation?
I don't think I subscribe to all the beliefs of Calvinism, as I've never actually studied it, or been exposed to them/it, etc. But I do not believe in true free will, and I believe in God's absolute sovereignty over free will, and I believe God has already chosen the fate/destination of all already, and fully did this already from before the foundations of the world, and before anything or any of us was ever even thought of or was made, etc.

But I think Calvinism believes it is only few who will be saved maybe, and if that is the case, then I'd have to tell them that I don't know if I believe that, etc, because even Jesus himself didn't know who or how many it would be for 100% sure, and he also didn't ever make the mistake of abandoning all hope that it could be very, very many, or maybe even possibly all possibly, if the Father so chooses, etc, or already has chosen/decided from before the foundations of the world, etc, and I don't believe in putting people into different "more special than someone else" elite categories or groups like just the few elect or whatever when it comes to who or how many or whatever is going to wind up being saved in or by the end of it all either, etc, because there is always a lot of a lot of danger in any organization or any individual people doing that, etc. Only God the Father has always known that and not ever have any of us known that and not even Jesus fully knew that while he was here so how can any of us say we know that, etc.

But and/or anyway, I will always accept God's judgement in or by the end of it all anyways always regardless, etc. It just that I don't think any of us can say for sure that we for sure already right now know that, etc. Who specifically, or whether it would be many or few or whatever, etc. I don't think any of us right now still here is allowed to right now know that until we're no longer here but are there instead, etc.

God Bless.
 
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Clare73

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I just thought I’d take a poll on how many Christians would glorify God if they arrived in heaven only to find out that Calvinism is true and their children or their loved ones were thrown into the lake of fire because they weren’t arbitrarily chosen before creation?
It's not "Calvinism", it's Apostle "Paulism."

God "chose us before the foundation of the world" (Eph 1:4). . ."not according to what we have done" (Tit 3:5).

Do you not believe the teaching (Eph 1:4, Tit 3:5) of Christ (Lk 10:16)?
 

Clare73

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I have never been able to get a Calvinist to show me how he knows he was one of the 'lucky' ones God picked.
You don't have to be a "Calvinist" to know that.

"The Holy Spirit bears witness (himself testifies) with our spirit that we are God's children" (Ro 8:15-16) born of God, not just born of man (Jn 1:13).
It is faith in a doctrine, and not faith in God.
Doctrine is the content of saving faith, while Jesus is the object of saving faith.

There is no saving faith without faith in Biblical doctrine (1 Tim 4:16).
 
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BNR32FAN

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It's not "Calvinism", it's Apostle "Paulism."

God "chose us before the foundation of the world" (Eph 1:4). . ."not according to what we have done" (Tit 3:5).

Do you not believe the teaching (Eph 1:4, Tit 3:5) of Christ (Lk 10:16)?
Titus 3:5 says not by works. And of course we all know 1 Peter 1:1-2 “who are chosen according to His foreknowledge.” And I know your circular logic regarding that verse, that He chose us according to His foreknowledge of what He would do, not what we would do but that just creates a circular fallacy. Let me explain, let’s say before creation God says should I write Steve’s name in the book of life? We’ll let Me look into the future and see what I’m going to do with Steve. That’s not predestination, that’s actually God looking into the future to see what He’s going to choose to do with Steve later on. So then His choice of what He’s going to do with Steve before creation is based on Him looking into the future to see what He is going to choose to do with Steve later on which means that it actually isn’t based on His foreknowledge at all, because it’s based on what He was going to do with Steve after creation, not before. So…
 
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Neogaia777

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Titus 3:5 says not by works. And of course we all know 1 Peter 1:1-2 “who are chosen according to His foreknowledge.” And I know your circular logic regarding that verse, that He chose us according to His foreknowledge of what He would do, not what we would do but that just creates a circular fallacy. Let me explain, let’s say before creation God says should I write Steve’s name in the book of life? We’ll let Me look into the future and see what I’m going to do with Steve. That’s not predestination, that’s actually God looking into the future to see what He’s going to choose to do with Steve later on. So then His choice of what He’s going to do with Steve before creation is based on Him looking into the future to see what He is going to choose to do with Steve later on which means that it actually isn’t based on His foreknowledge at all, because it’s based on what He was going to do with Steve after creation, not before. So…
Are you suggesting that He might change what He was going to do with Steve later on maybe? Because if so, then you might maybe have to try and explain to just as to how or "why" He would do that? Or why He would change His decision as to what to do with Steve later on when He had already made up His mind about that decision from long, long ago before that already, etc?

God Bless.
 
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Clare73

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Titus 3:5 says not by works. And of course we all know 1 Peter 1:1-2 “who are chosen according to His foreknowledge.” And I know your circular logic regarding that verse, that He chose us according to His foreknowledge of what He would do, not what we would do
Good job. . .this is where the problem lies.

God does not choose us (future) according to his foreknowledge (prognosis) of what he will do at that future time.
God chose us according to his foreknowledge of his decree before the worlds began to choose us.

God's foreknowledge of his own works is based on nothing but his former decrees to do them.
but that just creates a circular fallacy. Let me explain, let’s say before creation God says should I write Steve’s name in the book of life? We’ll let Me look into the future and see what I’m going to do with Steve. That’s not predestination, that’s actually God looking into the future to see what He’s going to choose to do with Steve later on. So then His choice of what He’s going to do with Steve before creation is based on Him looking into the future to see what He is going to choose to do with Steve later on which means that it actually isn’t based on His foreknowledge at all, because it’s based on what He was going to do with Steve after creation, not before. So…
 
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BNR32FAN

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God chose us according to his foreknowledge of his decree before the worlds began to choose us.

God's foreknowledge of his own works is based on nothing but his former decrees to do them.
What did God decree and when?
 
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BNR32FAN

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God does not choose us (future) according to his foreknowledge of what he will do at that future time.
God chose us according to his foreknowledge of his decree before the worlds began to choose us.

God's foreknowledge of his own works is based on nothing but his former decrees to do them.
Are you saying that God chose us before He decreed to save us?
 
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Gregory Thompson

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I just thought I’d take a poll on how many Christians would glorify God if they arrived in heaven only to find out that Calvinism is true and their children or their loved ones were thrown into the lake of fire because they weren’t arbitrarily chosen before creation?
Third option, it wouldn't matter because I wouldn't remember.
 
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Neogaia777

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Are you saying that God chose us before He decreed to save us?
Those two are the exact same thing, and the only difference is the wording that is used by us, etc, but to God, they are the exact same thing, etc. They both happened at the exact same time and before this world or universe was made, and when God was very first considering how to make all of us, which was before all of the determinism of this universe/reality was very first set in motion, and/or was created/made.
 
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Clare73

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Are you saying that God chose us before He decreed to save us?
The decree is to salvation, the choosing is to salvation, they are the same thing.
They are chosen to salvation according to the decree to salvation.
The decree and the choosing are all one event.
 
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BNR32FAN

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Before it all, he decreed it all.
Ok I just wanted to make sure because if the decree came before His choosing of who would be in the book of life, that’s not foreknowledge. That’s just knowledge of the decree He made in the past. See, foreknowledge is seeing something in the future, not the past.
 
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BNR32FAN

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The choosing is to salvation.
“Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who reside as aliens, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, who are chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, by the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to obey Jesus Christ and be sprinkled with His blood: May grace and peace be yours in the fullest measure.”
‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭1‬:‭1‬-‭2‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

No the passage says that they are chosen according to His foreknowledge which means that He decided to CHOOSE them or PICK them apart from others who were not chosen. Not that He decided to save some people but that He decided WHO He was going to save.
 
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BNR32FAN

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Those two are the exact same thing, and the only difference is the wording that is used by us, etc, but to God, they are the exact same thing, etc. They both happened at the exact same time and before this world or universe was made, and when God was very first considering how to make all of us, which was before all of the determinism of this universe/reality was very first set in motion, and/or was created/made.
Yeah I know, can you explain what she’s trying to say?
 
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Neogaia777

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Yeah I know, can you explain what she’s trying to say?
I hope she's trying to say some things that are similar to what I am trying to say, but maybe you can give me a specific question or two but toward me as to what you think she's trying to say, and maybe where you might be taking some issues with some of it maybe?
 
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BNR32FAN

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I hope she's trying to say some things that are similar to what I am trying to say, but maybe you can give me a specific question or two but toward me as to what you think she's trying to say, and maybe where you might be taking some issues with some of it maybe?
Well we’re talking about whether God was influenced in any way in His decision of whose names will be written in the book of life. My answer is that God wrote the names in the book of life according to His foreknowledge of those who would abide in Christ and endure to the end. Unfortunately I can’t quite say what she believes because I don’t understand it.
 
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