Would the rebuilding of the Jerusalem Third Temple stabilize the climate???

[dfw69]

I think you missed my point.

I was saying that if Jesus isn't the Messiah, then Christianity isn't true.

-CryptoLutheran

Would you still hold Christianity true if a time comes that a messiah is hailed in Jerusalem and Christianity is put down and the whole world professes the messianic age has come?

 

[dfw69]

HE WOULDN'T BE THE MESSIAH

What if your peers still held him as messiah?

And all leaders of modern Judaism hailed him as messiah?

 

[ViaCrucis]

Would you still hold Christianity true if a time comes that a messiah is hailed in Jerusalem and Christianity is put down and the whole world professes the messianic age has come?

Yes. I really couldn't care less if someone was hailed as a messiah--it's happened hundreds of times before, it'll happen hundred of times again. If, hypothetically, a Nicholae Carpathia becomes championed as a messiah (etc etc) I'm not going to forsake Jesus.

What I'm talking about is if the Messiah actually comes, and Jesus isn't the Messiah. I'm not talking about some messianic claimant, not even a super duper messianic claimant.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[LoAmmi]

What if your peers still held him as messiah?

And all leaders of modern Judaism hailed him as messiah?

They wouldn't. He would have failed to meet the criteria to be messiah. The messianic age is a transformed age where:

All Jews keep the law perfectly.

All people everywhere have knowledge of G-d without being told.

All people come to the Jews to learn.


This can't happen with a false messiah. Period. It can't happen. ALL PEOPLE means EVERYBODY, including you.

 

[dfw69]

Right, I was raised on a steady diet of Dispensationalism, so I'm familiar with the general outline. It was taught in my home, by every adult I knew, at every church I belonged to, my school from K-8th grade, and I read the books and argued it 'til I was blue in the face when I discovered there were people on the internet who didn't believe it.

I just don't think there's any validity to it.

-CryptoLutheran

Future history may prove otherwise my brother...

 

[dfw69]

Yes. I really couldn't care less if someone was hailed as a messiah--it's happened hundreds of times before, it'll happen hundred of times again. If, hypothetically, a Nicholae Carpathia becomes championed as a messiah (etc etc) I'm not going to forsake Jesus.

What I'm talking about is if the Messiah actually comes, and Jesus isn't the Messiah. I'm not talking about some messianic claimant, not even a super duper messianic claimant.

-CryptoLutheran

Never has it been proclaim in the world that the messianic age has come... Not yet ..

 

[LoAmmi]

Never has it been proclaim in the world that the messianic age has come... Not yet ..

It isn't going to be proclaimed. It's going to be obvious to everybody. Like if suddenly the sky turned neon green everywhere at once. It would be obvious to anybody who could see that the sky had changed and saying it was blue would be incorrect. That's what it's supposed to be like.

If a group of people has to go around telling everybody it's happened, it has failed one of the fundamental prophecies!

 

[dfw69]

They wouldn't. He would have failed to meet the criteria to be messiah. The messianic age is a transformed age where:

All Jews keep the law perfectly.

All people everywhere have knowledge of G-d without being told.

All people come to the Jews to learn.


This can't happen with a false messiah. Period. It can't happen. ALL PEOPLE means EVERYBODY, including you.

You under estimate the deception of the coming false messianic age

But Jesus warns that Jew and gentile persecution arises... If you believe it to be true you will live... If you doubt... You will be persecuted... I'm just relating the message

 

[dfw69]

It isn't going to be proclaimed. It's going to be obvious to everybody. Like if suddenly the sky turned neon green everywhere at once. It would be obvious to anybody who could see that the sky had changed and saying it was blue would be incorrect. That's what it's supposed to be like.

If a group of people has to go around telling everybody it's happened, it has failed one of the fundamental prophecies!

So when the false messianic age happens... Then I believe you will see clearly and deny ....

 

[LoAmmi]

So when the false messianic age happens... Then I believe you will see clearly and deny ....

Or it won't happen and it will be clear to you that you were wrong. It's possible.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Future history may prove otherwise my brother...

Anything is possible. But I don't see any reason to believe in any of what you mentioned, not without having to turn Scripture upside-down and take much of it completely out of context.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[dfw69]

Anything is possible. But I don't see any reason to believe in any of what you mentioned, not without having to turn Scripture upside-down and take much of it completely out of context.

-CryptoLutheran

Your amil.. I'm futurist.. When do we ever agree?..

 

[dfw69]

Or it won't happen and it will be clear to you that you were wrong. It's possible.

 

[Zoness]

Dispensationalism is probably the least likely of the Christian apocalyptic views. When I was a Christian, I believed it for the same way ViaCrucis did, it was spoon fed to me. Then I realized that I had been basically lied to about it being "ancient revealed truth" when really it didn't start to gain steam until the 20th century from 19th century writings. That was my first major turn-off.

I then identified as Preterist and then, if I ever returned to Christianity I would probably identify still as Preterist or Historicist. They made the most logical sense to me.

 

[DennisTate]

Would you still hold Christianity true if a time comes that a messiah is hailed in Jerusalem and Christianity is put down and the whole world professes the messianic age has come?

Yes......because if and when a recognizable modern King David type is raised up for the Jewish people....it will be Rabbi Jesus/Yehoshua causing this to happen!!


Luke 24:25 "Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:"


Jeremiah 30:9 "But they shall serve the LORD their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them."


In a sense Rabbi Jesus/Yehoshua seemed at least somewhat disappointed with his disciples that they failed to recognize John the Baptist as the fulfillment of Elijah.....Will the David type who is raised up for the Jewish people happen in a similar manner?????

Matthew 17 (Blue Letter Bible: KJV - King James Version)
Matthew 17:10 "And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come?
And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.
But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.
Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist."

 

[DennisTate]

What if your peers still held him as messiah?

And all leaders of modern Judaism hailed him as messiah?

The word Messiah/Mashiach/Moshiach simply means "anointed king."

King Saul was an "anointed king" chosen by God!

King David was an "anointed king" chosen by God!

So was King Solomon, King Rehoboam, King Jereboam, King Hezekiah and King Josiah!

The Christian Bible predicts that the true King David type who is raised up for the Jewish people in the latter days will call Rabbi Jesus/Yehoshua Lord!!!


Matthew 22 (Blue Letter Bible: KJV - King James Version)

Mat 22:36 Master, which [is] the great commandment in the law?

Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

This is the first and great commandment.
And the second [is] like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
While the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them,
Saying, What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, [The Son] of David.
He saith unto them, How then doth David in spirit call him Lord, saying,
The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?
If David then call him Lord, how is he his son?"


It is logical that the real King David would recognize a valid fulfillment of Psalm 22 when he reads about it!!

 

[DennisTate]

They wouldn't. He would have failed to meet the criteria to be messiah. The messianic age is a transformed age where:

All Jews keep the law perfectly.

All people everywhere have knowledge of G-d without being told.

All people come to the Jews to learn.


This can't happen with a false messiah. Period. It can't happen. ALL PEOPLE means EVERYBODY, including you.

But also isn't there a Gentile Messiah who is guided by God who doesn't really know God like Moses knew God...but this person is inspired and will play a significant role in setting the stage for the rebuilding of the Jerusalem Third TEmple Complex as well as be instrumental somehow in breaking chains and setting captives free???


Isaiah 45 (Blue Letter Bible: KJV - King James Version)

Isaiah 45:1 ¶ Thus saith the LORD to his anointed, to Cyrus, whose right hand I have holden, to subdue nations before him; and I will loose the loins of kings, to open before him the two leaved gates; and the gates shall not be shut;...........
Isa 45:5 I [am] the LORD, and [there is] none else, [there is] no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
Isa 45:13 I have raised him up in righteousness, and I will direct all his ways: he shall build my city, and he shall let go my captives, not for price nor reward, saith the LORD of hosts."

 

[DennisTate]

If Messiah comes, and it's not Jesus, and the Temple is rebuilt, then yeah it's going to mean I'm going to be in the market for a new religion.

-CryptoLutheran

ViaCrucis....I must disagree with this understanding. The rebuilding of the Jerusalem Third TEmple will fulfill many predictions by Rabbi Jesus/Yehoshua who obviously believed in all the prophecies of the Jewish Bible...including the most difficult ones for example Psalm 22 and Isaiah 53!!!!!!

So if he believed in these difficult prophecies....he also of course believed in the coming of the time when the weakest inhabitant of Jerusalem would be comparable to King David.....and the King David who would be raised up would be comparable to archangel Michael who made havoc of the armies of Assyria in the time of King Hezekiah!!!!!!

This will be at a time when if a Jew or restored Israelite lived to be merely one hundred years of age....they must have really had problems???!!

"No longer will babies die when only a few days old. No longer will adults die before they have lived a full life. No longer will people be considered old at one hundred! Only the cursed will die that young!" (Isaiah 65:20)

 

[DennisTate]

This is what you believe and I don't doubt we are the temple


This is what I believe...

The future temple will be built by a false messiah ... It's the 3rd temple... And Christians will be persecuted when this happens

They will think this kingdom shall never end for the messianic age has come and 10 kingdoms of the world will be behind this age

But at some point the man of sin comes and destroys this false messianic age... And Israel will cry our to god ....and that temple will be destroyed because of the idol worship

Then the true messiah comes and all. Israel will be saved and he will reign 1000 years and the millennial temple will be built.... 4th temple

The other possibility is that the Jerusalem Third Temple is built by a King Cyrus type who is led by God and then 42 months later an Antiochus type takes over and kicks the true worshippers out of the Temple Mount area!!!!

In our era of elections swinging all over the place....this should not be a difficult concept to understand!!!



Isaiah 66 (Blue Letter Bible: KJV - King James Version)

Isaiah 66:5 ¶ Hear the word of the LORD, ye that tremble at his word; Your brethren that hated you, that cast you out for my name's sake, said, Let the LORD be glorified: but he shall appear to your joy, and they shall be ashamed.

A voice of noise from the city, a voice from the temple, a voice of the LORD that rendereth recompence to his enemies."

Something about this verse makes me wonder if perhaps Zechariah 14 cannot be fulfilled until AFTER....the Third TEmple is built???!!!

 

[DennisTate]

Your heart may be in the right place loammi... But what would you do when your messiah comes persecuting through noachide law and Torah law?

Pastor David Herzog was shown a vision that at the time that the USA goes through serious economic troubles the nation of Israel is blamed as well as Jewish Americans. They are persecuted and must flee from America in significant numbers first to Canada and then on to Israel.

I suppose there is some way around this happening because the vast majority of prophecies are conditional and can be altered by a turning toward God....but this is a possibility that we should take seriously!




David Herzog 2012 - Sid Roth - It's Supernatural

Guest: David Herzog
July 30 - August 5, 2012

When David Herzog shares how to enter God's Glory Zone miracles, signs and wonders are plentiful--instant weight loss, bald heads grow hair, the sick are healed, people are transported into the heavenly realm! David wants to help you enter into the Glory Zone where anything is possible!

Jeremiah 16:14 ¶ "Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that it shall no more be said, The LORD liveth, that brought up the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt;
But, The LORD liveth, that brought up the children of Israel from the land of the north, and from all the lands whither he had driven them: and I will bring them again into their land that I gave unto their fathers."