Would a Utah State Dollar be a good idea?

DennisTate

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Billionaire George Soros is calling for the devaluation of the USA dollar.

A Utah State Dollar could in theory so well back up the USA Dollar…. that the upheaval in the lives of Americans is kept to a minimum in the event that he gets his wish.
 

DennisTate

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Rabbi Jesus/ Yeshua advocated that we "agree with our adversary" and frankly…… George Soros has a few good points in his theories.




George Soros says that America must give up the dollar and accept world currency .examiner.com/article/george-soros-says-that-america-must-give-up-the-dollar-and-accept-world-currency

Now George Soros is going for the jugular as he has come out against the world's reserve currency and is advocating Americans stop their resistance to a world currency and singular global economy.

In an article this morning from The Economic Collapse, Soros discusses the need for a managed decline of the dollar and a move towards a global currency.

See video to the left of George Soros's interview on the need to move from the dollar to a global currency

(In the video)
Soros also seemed a bit uncomfortable as he discussed "an orderly decline" of the U.S. dollar.

Soros has been saying the the U.S. dollar needs to go down for quite a while now, and he speaks of the coming fall of the dollar as if it is inevitable.
 
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DennisTate

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I must admit that a Utah State Dollar has many advantages over a currency unit that could be put out there by a church:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7701455/
North American churches should each have their own currency!
I am of the belief that each large church in North America should discuss the printing up of their own church currency unit such as has been done by a group of socially active citizens in Calgary, Canada with their CalgaryDollars.ca

Here is a good article on how important local currencies were during the Great Depression:


Whatcom Watch Online - Story Display

City in Austria Printed Local Currency

Worgl, like many other European towns and cities, was hit hard by the Great Depression. There was mass unemployment; four of the five local factories had closed, and the people were starving in the streets. Nobody had any money to buy anything. One of the features of an economic depression is that there is not enough money in circulation to ensure that people can meet their basic needs, and in the 1930s, the shortage of currency in many countries of the world became catastrophic.

The mayor of Worgl, together with local businessmen, decided to try to break this economic impasse by creating their own local currency. They printed and issued 60,000 Austrian shillings worth of local currency. These shillings could only be spent in Worgl, so they remained in the local community and were exchanged over and over again.

The positive impact was immediate and surprising to everyone. In only six weeks, unemployment disappeared, all the factories had reopened and everyone had food. For the inhabitants of Worgl, the economic depression was gone. This dramatic transformation became known as the “miracle of Worgl.” Surrounding towns, inspired by the success of Worgl, immediately started printing their own local currencies.

Sadly, the miracle did not last long. When the Austrian Central Bank heard about Worgl’s local currency, they initiated legal proceedings against the mayor and local businessmen. According to Austrian banking law, it was illegal for anyone except the Austrian Central Bank to issue money. The bank won the court case, and the mayor was ordered to shut down the local currency, which he did, under threat of imprisonment. The town then returned to the devastating economic depression of the 1930s, with all the human pain and suffering associated with this catastrophe. Factories closed, and once again, the people starved.

Alternative Currency in the U.S.

Irving Fisher, an American professor of economics at Yale University, visited Worgl before the local currency was suppressed and witnessed the ‘miracle’ firsthand. When he returned to the United States, Fisher spread the word by traveling and lecturing across the country, advocating the use of the Worgl ‘scrip’ everywhere. Inspired by his vision, hundreds of communities began issuing their own currency, and by 1934 there were over 1,000 local communities using ‘scrip’ throughout the U.S.

Every one of these communities experienced a tremendous rejuvenation of their local economies. They thrived while others suffered. Fisher then met with President Franklin D. Roosevelt, proposing the implementation of government-sanctioned local ‘scrip’ in every community in America. When FDR consulted with his top financial advisors and bankers, however, he was advised to shut all the ‘scrip’ systems down, which he did. Instead, he borrowed large amounts of money from bankers, at interest, and used it to pay for the Reconstruction Finance Corporation and the other work-creation projects, which collectively came to be known as the ‘New Deal.’ So ended the last widespread use of a local currency within the U.S.

Surely everybody who reads this article would agree that we have many advantages over the people who lived in Worgl, Austria during the Great Depression?!

If they can do it....why can't we?

Here in Canada the only problem that we have to watch out for is that we must pay the same rate of taxation if we earn Calgary Dollars as if we had earned Canadian dollars....so we have to keep our level of bartering at the point where our tax bill doesn't get to high.....but if we volunteered our time and our church earned a local currency from another church....it could be amazing where this could lead!
 
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Fireball1244

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States are not Constitutionally capable of issuing their own legal currency.

Some localities issue "barter notes," but those are not legal currency, no one has to accept them. A currency that no one has to accept is of little value.
 
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jayem

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This is Article I, Section 10:

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.

A state can't coin its own money. But it can require that only gold and silver be used as legal tender. The original language in the Constitution actually requires it. (Though I think SCOTUS rulings and federal law have allowed for fiat currency.) I'm sure that a modern gold/silver-based currency wouldn't involve coins. You're probably keep your stash of gold and silver in a depository, and you'd pay with a electronic transfer of ownership for the amount of your debt. A potential problem is that gold and silver values fluctuate so much. So prices might also fluctuate. Imagine if the price of all the goods and services you bought swung up and down daily--or even hourly--like gasoline does.
 
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DennisTate

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This is Article I, Section 10:

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.

A state can't coin its own money. But it can require that only gold and silver be used as legal tender. The original language in the Constitution actually requires it. (Though I think SCOTUS rulings and federal law have allowed for fiat currency.) I'm sure that a modern gold/silver-based currency wouldn't involve coins. You're probably keep your stash of gold and silver in a depository, and you'd pay with a electronic transfer of ownership for the amount of your debt. A potential problem is that gold and silver values fluctuate so much. So prices might also fluctuate. Imagine if the price of all the goods and services you bought swung up and down daily--or even hourly--like gasoline does.


Wow!!!!!

I didn't know about this!

I wonder if this dates back to the fact that the thirteen original states all had their own currencies back around 1750?
 
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DennisTate

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Yes, states should immediately constitute their own currency to break away from the slave driven normal. Immediately.


I agree Pyramid33…….

Apparently each of the 13 original states had their own "scrip" back in 1750….. but it worked so well….. that pressure would be placed on politicians to make sure that it didn't happen again…..



America Created It's
Own Money In 1750
How Benjamin Franklin Made
New England Prosperous
By Congressman Charles G. Binderup
Copyright © 1941
6-9-5

The following historical story is taken from a radio address given by Congressman Charles G. Binderup of Nebraska, some 50 years ago and was reprinted in Unrobing the Ghosts of Wall Street:

Colonies More Prosperous Than The Home Country

Before the American War for Independence in 1776, the colonized part of what is today the United States of America was a possession of England. It was called New England, and was made up of 13 colonies, which became the first 13 states of the great Republic. Around 1750, this New England was very prosperous. Benjamin Franklin was able to write:

"There was abundance in the Colonies, and peace was reigning on every border. It was difficult, and even impossible, to find a happier and more prosperous nation on all the surface of the globe. Comfort was prevailing in every home. The people, in general, kept the highest moral standards, and education was widely spread."

When Benjamin Franklin went over to England to represent the interests of the Colonies, he saw a completely different situation: the working population of this country was gnawed by hunger and poverty. "The streets are covered with beggars and tramps," he wrote. He asked his English friends how England, with all its wealth, could have so much poverty among its working classes.

His friends replied that England was a prey to a terrible condition: it had too many workers! The rich said they were already overburdened with taxes, and could not pay more to relieve the needs and poverty of this mass of workers. Several rich Englishmen of that time actually believed, along with Mathus, that wars and plague were necessary to rid the country from man-power surpluses.

Franklin's friends then asked him how the American Colonies managed to collect enough money to support their poor houses, and how they could overcome this plague of pauperism. Franklin replied:

"We have no poor houses in the Colonies; and if we had some, there would be nobody to put in them, since there is, in the Colonies, not a single unemployed person, neither beggars nor tramps."

Thanks To Free Money Issued By The Nation

His friends could not believe their ears, and even less understand this fact, since when the English poor houses and jails became too cluttered, England shipped these poor wretches and down-and- outs, like cattle, and discharged, on the quays of the Colonies, those who had survived the poverty, dirtiness and privations of the journey. At that time, England was throwing into jail those who could not pay their debts. They therefore asked Franklin how he could explain the remarkable prosperity of the New England Colonies. Franklin replied:

"That is simple. In the Colonies, we issue our own paper money. It is called 'Colonial Scrip.' We issue it in proper proportion to make the goods and pass easily from the producers to the consumers. In this manner, creating ourselves our own paper money, we control its purchasing power and we have no interest to pay to no one."

The Bankers Impose Poverty

The information came to the knowledge of the English Bankers, and held their attention. They immediately took the necessary steps to have the British Parliament to pass a law that prohibited the Colonies from using their scrip money, and then ordered them to use only the gold and silver money that was provided in sufficient quantity by the English bankers. Then began in America the plague of debt-money, which has never since brought so many curses to the American people.

The first law was passed in 1751, and then completed by a more restrictive law in 1763. Franklin reported that one year after the implementation of this prohibition on Colonial money, the streets of the Colonies were filled with unemployment and beggars, just like in England, because there was not enough money to pay for the goods and work. The circulating medium of exchange had been reduced by half.

Franklin added that this was the original cause of the American Revolution - and not the tax on tea nor the Stamp Act, as it has been taught again and again in history books. The financiers always manage to have removed from school books all that can throw light on their own schemes, and damage the glow that protects their power.


Franklin, who was one of the chief architects of the American independence, wrote it clearly:

"The Colonies would gladly have borne the little tax on tea and other matters had it not been the poverty caused by the bad influence of the English bankers on the Parliament, which has caused in the Colonies hatred of England and the Revolutionary War."

This point of view of Franklin was confirmed by great statesmen of his era: John Adams, Jefferson, and several others. A remarkable English historian, John Twells, wrote, speaking of the money of the Colonies, the Colonial Scrip:

"It was the monetary system under which America's Colonies flourished to such an extent that Edmund Burke was able to write about them: 'Nothing in the history of the world resembles their progress. It was a sound and beneficial system, and its effects led to the happiness of the people.'" John Twells adds:

"In a bad hour, the British Parliament took away from America its representative money, forbade any further issue of bills of credit, these bills ceasing to be legal tender, and ordered that all taxes should be paid in coins. Consider now the consequences: this restriction of the medium of exchange paralyzed all the industrial energies of the people. Ruin took place in these once flourishing Colonies; most rigorous distress visited every family and every business, discontent became desperation, and reached a point, to use the words of Dr. Johnson, when human nature rises up and assets its rights."

Another writer, Peter Cooper, expresses himself along the same lines. After having said how Franklin had explained to the London Parliament the cause of the prosperity of the Colonies, he wrote:

"After Franklin gave explanations on the true cause of the prosperity of the Colonies, the Parliament exacted laws forbidding the use of this money in the payment of taxes. This decision brought so many drawbacks and so much poverty to the people that it was the main cause of the Revolution. The suppression of the Colonial money was a much more important reason for the general uprising than the Tea and Stamp Act."

Today, in America as well as in Europe, we are under the regime of the Scrip of the Bankers instead of the scrip of the nation. Hence the public debts, everlasting interest charges, taxes that plunder purchasing power, with the only result being a consolidation of the financial dictatorship.

There is only one cure for America's ultimate financial collapse and that is for Congress to exercise Clause 30 of the "Federal" Reserve Act, buy the outstanding shares of stock, shut down this unconstitutional system and sell off their assets to reimburse the people of this nation for this unspeakable theft of their wealth. This is the first installment of postings on this issue, new ones will be put up as soon as manpower allows.

preteristcentral.com/gov-money.htm
 
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DennisTate

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I'm aware otherwise. Colorado is free to give marijauna for any price it choose's. Free trade.

Do you mean as a pain killer for people who have a terminal illness?
 
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DennisTate

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There is a warning here to most residents of Utah......
that in my opinion should not be ignored.........

I wanted to put this here so that I could find this again easily.... the warning is around the thirty two minute mark.......

 
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DennisTate

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This will give you a hint about the nature of the warning.......
on at least one level......


Did Paul consider himself a "sinner", are we supposed to think of ourselves as sinners...?


Like Paul.... I am a sinner......
and some of my most serious sins, (plural)..... are like that of Paul and of the type and nature of
the Scribes and Pharisees who played around the edge of the cliff of the unpardonable sin......
blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

I allowed my church.... to become like an idol.......
and I bought into the idea that my church was the best of all churches.....
and I and my fellow church members got into the idea that knowledge......
(and we did have knowledge.... we do deserve some credit for that at least).......

...... put us so high above all other Christians......
that we doubted if other Christians.... members of other denominations.....
even had the Holy Spirit at all.........
 
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dgiharris

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there is a reason why a soap bubble is round..

there is a reason why there is strength in unity...

If States developed their own currency it would undermine the Dollar.

Part of the value of the dollar is the collective delusion we all share regarding its security and value. Because we all share this group delusion the dollar has "X" amount of value. This delusion is very fragile, it wouldn't take much to completely shatter the illusion.

States developing their own currency would quickly do just that, it would undermine the foundation of the dollar. And as such, would be a horrifically bad idea...
 
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DennisTate

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there is a reason why a soap bubble is round..

there is a reason why there is strength in unity...

If States developed their own currency it would undermine the Dollar.

Part of the value of the dollar is the collective delusion we all share regarding its security and value. Because we all share this group delusion the dollar has "X" amount of value. This delusion is very fragile, it wouldn't take much to completely shatter the illusion.

States developing their own currency would quickly do just that, it would undermine the foundation of the dollar. And as such, would be a horrifically bad idea...

This is a valid point.....
that is certainly one important part of the formula but
certain things are happening that could make a State currency that is backed up by
volunteerism by Latter Day Saints very useful over the coming two to five years.


https://totalwealthresearch.com/ric...-gamble-bet-u-s-collapse-warns-cia-economist/


Buffett’s $55 Billion Gamble is a Bet on U.S. Collapse, Warns CIA Economist
 
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DennisTate

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there is a reason why a soap bubble is round..

there is a reason why there is strength in unity...

If States developed their own currency it would undermine the Dollar.

Part of the value of the dollar is the collective delusion we all share regarding its security and value. Because we all share this group delusion the dollar has "X" amount of value. This delusion is very fragile, it wouldn't take much to completely shatter the illusion.

States developing their own currency would quickly do just that, it would undermine the foundation of the dollar. And as such, would be a horrifically bad idea...

Basically.... I am not laughing at Pastor Shane Warren's dream because it fits so well with the fact that there are 4.3 Trillion USA Petro-dollars out there at this time that a lot of influential people are talking about using to attempt to devalue the dollar...... I believe their plan will fail but this is an important issue to pray about and be prepared for.

 
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DennisTate

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The prediction by retired fireman Mark Taylor from 2011 implies that the George Soros / Warren Buffet plan will fail ..... but it is still a serious issue.


Retired fireman Mark Taylor:
"Commander in Chief

April, 28th 2011

The Spirit of God says, I have chosen this man, Donald Trump, for such a time as this. For as Benjamin Netanyahu is to Israel, so shall this man be to the United States of America! For I will use this man to bring honor, respect and restoration to America. America will be respected once again as the most powerful and prosperous nation on earth, (other than Israel). The dollar will be the strongest it has ever been in the history of the United States, and will once again be the currency by which all others are judged. The Spirit of God says, the enemy will quake and shake and fear this man I have anointed [1].

They will even quake and shake when he announces he is running for president, it will be like the shot heard across the world. The enemy will say what shall we do now? This man knows all our tricks and schemes. We have been robbing America for decades, what shall we do to stop this? The Spirit says HA! No one shall stop this that l have started! For the enemy has stolen from America for decades and it stops now! For I will use this man to reap the harvest that the United States has sown for and plunder from the enemy what he has stolen and return it 7 fold back to the United States [2].

The enemy will say Israel, Israel, what about Israel? For Israel will be protected by America once again. The Spirit says yes! America will once again stand hand-in-hand with Israel, and the two shall be as one. For the ties between Israel and America will be stronger than ever, and Israel will flourish like never before. The Spirit of God says, I will protect America and Israel, for this next president will be a man of his word [3], when he speaks the world will listen and know that there is something greater in him than all the others before him [4]. This man’s word is his bond and the world and America will know this and the enemy will fear this, for this man will be fearless [5].

The Spirit says, when the financial harvest begins so shall it parallel in the spiritual for America [6].

The Spirit of God says, in this next election they will spend billions to keep this president in; it will be like flushing their money down the toilet. Let them waist their money, for it comes from and it is being used by evil forces at work, but they will not succeed, for this next election will be a clean sweep [7] for the man I have chosen. They will say things about this man (the enemy), but it will not affect him, and they shall say it rolls off of him like the duck, for as the feathers of a duck protect it, so shall my feathers protect this next president [8].

Even mainstream news media will be captivated by this man and the abilities that I have gifted him with, and they will even begin to agree with him [9] says the Spirit of God." (Mark Taylor)


 
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ThatRobGuy

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Anyone who thinks that a state-level currency or a commodities-backed currency is a good idea needs to take a look at history and not base their opinions off of 5 minute diatribes by people on Ron Paul's Facebook feed.

Are there problems with the Fed? Yes, however, that doesn't mean that any old alternative must be "better" by default.
 
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dgiharris

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Anyone who thinks that a state-level currency or a commodities-backed currency is a good idea needs to take a look at history and not base their opinions off of 5 minute diatribes by people on Ron Paul's Facebook feed.

Are there problems with the Fed? Yes, however, that doesn't mean that any old alternative must be "better" by default.

I feel like this country has been beset by a type of "argument" that apparently tends to work well on the masses. Apparently, all you have to do is point out a problem with something and by default ANYTHING you come up with that opposes that something just must be better.

Nevermind that the thing you came up with has more problems than a screen door on a submarine... No, all that matters is that the original thing you are arguing against has problems...

I also feel that the masses can't think at the macro level. Too often, people envision their small little circle of friends and neighborhood and can't think beyond that. A local based currency is a cute idea, I give you my personal currency good for tacos and donuts and you give me your personal currency good for an oil change at your auto shop.

But as you "scale up" you run into problems really really quickly.

Tell me, how well would a Florida based currency have worked when the hurricane swept through them? What about a Kansas based currency when they hit a drought? What about a Nevada based currency when that state is in the middle of fighting for water with California? What about when one State feels that the other State is overvaluing their currency or vice versa?

And I'm not even scratching the surface for why State based currencies would be a bad idea. Seriously, all the energy you are putting into this notion of State or Church based currencies would be better served arguing for crypto currency like Bitcoins.

Now that is an argument worth having and it is kinda exciting to watch bitcoins develop and try to forge a seat at the table vs the entrenched and well established blue haired banking industry...
 
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DennisTate

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I hope Mr. Soros realizes the magnitude of the forces he's challenging. I can only wonder what objectives he has in mind by doing this.

He and many other globalists believe that the USA Dollar must be replaced as the world's reserve currency in order for them to introduce other aspects of a one world government.
 
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