Wondering if you can give me some good reasons why masturbation is a bad thing.

JacktheCatholic said:

Have YOU read the posts here and for that matter enough scripture? Masturbation has been a sin for more than 2,000 years.

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Masturbation has never been a sin. I understand that your religious beliefs require you to say that it is, but that doesn't make them correct.

Dannager said:

Masturbation has never been a sin. I understand that your religious beliefs require you to say that it is, but that doesn't make them correct.

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Exactly and it;s not like we are not reading the posts or the scripture posted. From what it seems like to me at least..we just donlt see how it makes MB sinful.

JacktheCatholic said:

Have YOU read the posts here

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Thats pretty funny, jack, seeing that youve proven that you ARENT actually reading the posts here.

and for that matter enough scripture? Masturbation has been a sin for more than 2,000 years.

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Sorry chap...you keep claiming it, but you havent yet PROVEN the assertion.

Floatingaxe said:

Yes, I've presented God's Word about it several times.

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No...you havent.
You have given UNrelated scriptures that you are using to push your agenda.

As I said, Im neither for nor against because there is no clear answer in Gods word.
But for you or anyone else to pretend there is is just simple dishonesty.

I'm not going to do it here again.

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Because you never did to begin with..

It just falls on deaf ears. No one in this thread appears convicted enough about it to want to change to please Jesus.

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Wrong.
We simply arent going to let you or anyone else invent NEW commandments that DONT exist in Gods word.

Frankly I couldnt care less about a persons private life to care whether they MB or not....but regardless of MY views, Im not about to CREATE unscriptural prohibitions to fit MY personal sense of morality.

You folks do then you get bent out of shape when we DEMAND that you BACK your assertions with CLEAR scripture.

Have fun, kiddies. Don't forget to wash your hands.

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Typical.
I see this all the time.
When someone cant PROVE what theyre saying the personal attacks always come....it is inevitable.

Unsubscribe.

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See ya.

JacktheCatholic said:

She has scripture and surprisingly common sense on her side.

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I see the very same nonsense from those who claim there is scripture against OS.
There is no prohibition regardless of what you and the other poster claim.
She has nothing from Gods word except unrelated passages that she is inserting her own sense of morality IN to....

What do you have on your side?

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A long list of sexual prohibitions in Gods word that oddly enough is absent of anything even remotely resembling prohibtion against MB.
And please, dont bother with this silly necrophylia nonsense again.

Dannager said:

Context, logic, health experts, the principle of reciprocity, and (not that it matters) 90+% of the U.S. population.

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I am sure 90% of thought of Jesus the same as 90% think today towards the Catholic Church.

But what gets me is your claim to be Catholic and yet you dismiss the Catholic teaching. That is like saying you are a dancer even though you never dance. If you were Protestant you could believe whatever you want as they do. As a Catholic you must follow the Catholic Church's teaching and there is no debate. Really... if you do not follow the Catholic Churches teaching then you really are not Catholic.

Do you think your answers are hypocritical like the Pharisees?

HuntingMan said:

Thats pretty funny, jack, seeing that youve proven that you ARENT actually reading the posts here.


Sorry chap...you keep claiming it, but you havent yet PROVEN the assertion.

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You can get rid of your ignorance of Christianity at any library. You will find that the Catholic Church has been the Church since Christ and it's teaching are those of the Apostles and unchanged.

YOU DOUBT?


Then pick up a book at the library and read.

JacktheCatholic said:

You can get rid of your ignorance of Christianity at any library.

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And this applies to this discussion how, exactly?
I see that my theories are pretty much cemented that when folks can no longer prove their case, they resort to personal insults and attacks that have no bearing on the topic at hand.

You will find that the Catholic Church has been the Church since Christ and it's teaching are those of the Apostles and unchanged.

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Firstly this is off topic.
Secondly, you are in complete error.

Im not willing to get into a protestant/catholic urinating contest here because you are not able to prove your cause and are now simply rambling on into incoherance.

YOU DOUBT?

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Whether I do or not is not relevant to THIS topic in THIS thread.

Then pick up a book at the library and read.

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Dont need to.
I spent enough time showing catholics things like the False Decretals in my former time on this forum...I wont return to that behavior for you or any other catholic brother or sister.

You are not going to provoke me into attacking my catholic brothers and sisters and you WILL stay on the topic of THIS thread... or I will simply put you on ignore..capiche?

It's the same with any absolute, some people are conscience-bound to them and some are not.

Masturbation cannot be proved sinful or holy, it is about what we do with our minds and hearts, not our hands. If you have an addiction to it, seek some help, if you feel disgusted by it, keep your notions to yourself and dont condemn others.

Most absolutes are like this. The only helpful absolute is a flexible absolute, otherwise we are driven by the rigidity of Law and not the fluidity of Love and the growth of Life.

HuntingMan said:

And this applies to this discussion how, exactly?

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Because some of your claims are baseless and go against known facts. Is that clear enough for you?

JacktheCatholic said:

Because some of your claims are baseless and go against known facts. Is that clear enough for you?

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Actually chap, YOU are the one making the assertion that MB is 'sin', therefore burden of proof is on YOU to back that claim.

I simply say that you have no scripture to prove your mythical commandment...and you have yet to show anyone here that you have anything other than your catechism that seemingly not even every catholic here follows.

Back your claims with something *I* believe....Gods word. Then we'll talk.
But as I said, Im not getting into a catholic debate with you because you have failed to prove your case and now are just rambling on about irrelevant points concerning your church.

Ahhh, I go away for the weekend and look at all the pages of fun, i mean, posts I miss. lol

Yup, those that like to make up sins to condemn people are still doing a good job.

Those of you who are pointing out that mastubation isn't listed as a sin anyway in God's word are right no.

But as always, if something is a sin to you then it is, so your concious confirms your beliefs. Please don't sin.

Those that are not letting their beliefs be evil spoken of, continue to enjoy life in the Love of our Savior.

dayhiker

JacktheCatholic said:

I am sure 90% of thought of Jesus the same as 90% think today towards the Catholic Church.

But what gets me is your claim to be Catholic and yet you dismiss the Catholic teaching.

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I only dismiss pointless Catholic teaching founded on poor theology.

That is like saying you are a dancer even though you never dance.

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No, it's like saying I'm an American even though I don't approve of the administration's decisions.

If you were Protestant you could believe whatever you want as they do.

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Mind your tongue, JacktheCatholic. The above statement is a big fat red warning flag indicating to me that you're not actually here for an intellectually honest discussion. Shape up or take the vitriol elsewhere.

As a Catholic you must follow the Catholic Church's teaching and there is no debate.

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Nonsense.

Really... if you do not follow the Catholic Churches teaching then you really are not Catholic.

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Again, nonsense.

Do you think your answers are hypocritical like the Pharisees?

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No.

You're done with this line of discussion, JacktheCatholic. Continue down it further and moderators will be involved to bring you back on-topic.

The act of MB starts early around 3 years of age. They will hump and rub just because it feels good, no difference than being tickled. It's a habit ingrained before puberty. Puberty creates sexual urges that so happen by nature to mix with the already habit of MB all children have. Because of these so called sexual urges that God make happen at age 12, we then call the act of MB sinful...it's silly.

What is worse is there are parents that actually punish children for only doing what is natural even before puberty? Obvious, young children with no sexual concept of yet have no clue what they are talking about, but suffer the emotional trauma of such stupidity. MB is already totally natural habit before puberty, why does it become so sinful because God created puberty.

Should God not then be blamed for making us have sexual thoughts and desire against our will? If not, then how does it become sinful when these thoughts mix with MB? You will say lust, but sexual thought and desire is not lust. If it is, then God created it. You will say he did, but we are to ignore these feelings until after marriage. Then why did God play such a cruel trick and place these thoughts in us at around age 12? It seems people think we must be asexual until after marriage, but
without sexual thought and desire, what force would drive us to marry?

Yes, we can sexually sin, when we do harm with the behavior. But calling what God placed in us sin is unbiblical. If you think lust is sexual thought and desire, then you are calling God sinful.

Teaching kids that sexual thought, MB and such is evil is the sin. You confuse their sexuality. You ingrain in their mind that sex is evil. That's the problem with many here.

The number one problem that Christian teens say they deal with is the fact they can't beat MB. I feel for those that have to deal with this unfounded guilt and the impossible burden it places on them.

God is against sexual immorality, not against the natural process that he has made. Sexual thoughts, desires and MB are part of that process and no where in the bible does it say different. Pulling a few verses and lumping all of sexual behavior with sexual immorality is unbiblical. Sadly that is what many do. They can't see the difference.

Stop being afraid of the way God made you. We were not created as married adults. Our fallen nature has nothing to do with our sexuality. With our nature, it can be right or wrong.

Dannager said:

I only dismiss pointless Catholic teaching founded on poor theology.

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Then do not call yourself Catholic for it is a lie if you do not follow the Catholic Church's required teaching.

Doctrine and Dogma are not debatable but hard set truths that you MUST live by as a Catholic or be in Mortal Sin.

"The first effect of mortal sin in man is to avert him from his true last end, and deprive his soul of sanctifying grace. "


This is what happens when you are in mortal sin. This is a strictly adhered to teaching of the Catholic Church and to even debate Doctrine or Dogma is Mortal Sin.

If you do not like it then too bad. This is part of Being Catholic and part of the Church with the fullest teachings of Christ.

This is also with in Forum guidelines since it is the Catholic teaching and very easily shown. Your ignorance and lack of adhering to your churches beliefs is simply the truth as you continue to make clear.

May God be with you.

Shalom

JacktheCatholic said:

Then do not call yourself Catholic for it is a lie if you do not follow the Catholic Church's required teaching.

Doctrine and Dogma are not debatable but hard set truths that you MUST live by as a Catholic or be in Mortal Sin.

"The first effect of mortal sin in man is to avert him from his true last end, and deprive his soul of sanctifying grace. "


This is what happens when you are in mortal sin. This is a strictly adhered to teaching of the Catholic Church and to even debate Doctrine or Dogma is Mortal Sin.

If you do not like it then too bad. This is part of Being Catholic and part of the Church with the fullest teachings of Christ.

This is also with in Forum guidelines since it is the Catholic teaching and very easily shown. Your ignorance and lack of adhering to your churches beliefs is simply the truth as you continue to make clear.

May God be with you.

Shalom

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Interesting.

So let me get this straight.
Anyone who doesnt follow catholic 'doctrine and dogma' is 'in mortal sin' and therefore if they die in this state they what...go to hell ?

If this is the case, then are you proclaiming that EVERY protestant on this forum is currently hellbound since we would HAVE to be in 'mortal sin' because we DO debate and consequently REJECT many doctrines of the CC and by no means 'live by' those teachings (veneration of saints, for example) ?

You ingrain in their mind that sex is evil

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Actually, if you havent already, do some research into Augustines perverse views of sex even between a married man and wife.
That man brought so much nonsense about sex into Christianity from his former godless religion and it has affected all of the church every since.

HuntingMan said:

Actually, if you havent already, do some research into Augustines perverse views of sex even between a married man and wife.
That man brought so much nonsense about sex into Christianity from his former godless religion and it has affected all of the church every since.

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Him and many others.....Just another tool used to control the masses by controlling their behavior. Why people are still controlled by these early radicals and not the bible is beyond me.

I have a complete list of most of these and what they did...most evil people, yet most follow them today.

HuntingMan said:

Interesting.

So let me get this straight.
Anyone who doesnt follow catholic 'doctrine and dogma' is 'in mortal sin' and therefore if they die in this state they what...go to hell ?

If this is the case, then are you proclaiming that EVERY protestant on this forum is currently hellbound since we would HAVE to be in 'mortal sin' because we DO debate and consequently REJECT many doctrines of the CC and by no means 'live by' those teachings (veneration of saints, for example) ?

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Learn to read what is posted because I am writing to a fellow Catholic. It is intended for a Catholic. So if you are not Catholic then just learn a bit about Catholicism. Stop thinking my posts about Ctaholicism are intended for you.