Without goading, it's now 2022. What timetables proved incorrect?

[keras]

Far from reproving the believers for discerning when that day of His coming would arrive, Christ actually scolded those in His generation, calling them "hypocrites" for NOT discerning the signs of the times before His coming which they were given (Luke 12:56 and Matthew 16:3). There is evidence in scripture of both the year and the day, but it is forbidden on this forum to discuss this specifically, so I have not done so.

This is about the most sensible post on this thread.
We Can know when Jesus will Return, now approximately, but later; when the leader of the world government sits in the Temple, the Return will be exactly 1260 days after.

What the nay-sayers of end time prophecy need to keep in mind, is how Jesus called those who should have known about His first Advent: hypocrites. Their failure to see and understand what was plainly Written about His coming as a suffering servant.

Now; we have ample prophecy about His Return as King of Kings and Lord of Lords and of the events before that glorious Day.
Paul says; we Christians should not be in the dark, not be unaware of forthcoming dramatic events. 1 Thessalonians 5:5

 

[DavidPT]

This is about the most sensible post on this thread.
We Can know when Jesus will Return, now approximately, but later; when the leader of the world government sits in the Temple, the Return will be exactly 1260 days after.

What the nay-sayers of end time prophecy need to keep in mind, is how Jesus called those who should have known about His first Advent: hypocrites. Their failure to see and understand what was plainly Written about His coming as a suffering servant.

Now; we have ample prophecy about His Return as King of Kings and Lord of Lords and of the events before that glorious Day.
Paul says; we Christians should not be in the dark, not be unaware of forthcoming dramatic events. 1 Thessalonians 5:5

You are expecting all of these things to be literally fulfilled as described. I'm assuming that when you read 2 Thessalonians 2:4, you take that passage in a literal sense, as if no other sense is a possibility. Then while it's being fulfilled in another sense, instead of you being able to discern that, you are still waiting for it to be fulfilled in a literal sense. And the next thing you know, Jesus has returned and that it turns out you had zero clue as to when that would be after all. It turns out that your theory doesn't work for you after all.

As to 1260 days, 42 months, things like that, we can't know for certain that the amount specified is meant to be taken in the literal sense. The only thing we can know for certain, when a cardinal number is followed by years in the Bible, one can count on it being the literal amount specified since that is the pattern throughout the Bible. But days and months are not the same thing as years. A day, for example, can mean a literal 24 hour day, and it can also mean an era of time. The latter is what a day means in 2 Peter 3:8, an era of time consisting of a literal thousand years.

 

[keras]

You are expecting all of these things to be literally fulfilled as described.

Yes; Why not?
I view all the machinations of the preterists, Spiritualists and just plain ignorists, simply as attempts to avoid the scary prophesied events that we are likely to have to face.
Knowing what the Lord has planned for our future, will be a great help to get safely thru it all.

But days and months are not the same thing as years. A day, for example, can mean a literal 24 hour day, and it can also mean an era of time. The latter is what a day means in 2 Peter 3:8, an era of time consisting of a literal thousand years.

I agree.
But specific time periods such as 42 months and 1260 days, mean what they say.
And the Day of the Lord's fiery wrath is just one literal day of its effects on the earth. Isaiah 9:14, Zechariah 3:9, Revelation 18:8, +

 

[eclipsenow]

No, that was not in my post. I gave the correct time table.

Until it isn't...

 

[eclipsenow]

And the Jehovah Witnesses - do some research on when they thought Armageddon would take place.

This thread is not a research thread into JW's or Mormons or ten-thousand other failed futurist claims. It's asking the question what to do with this phenomena, and why are people attracted to futurism when it has such a terrible legacy of failed predictions? I have seen a few predictions fail here. One was when Barrack Obama was touring Jerusalem and "The Beast" (the armoured car) was approaching the temple mount. That day came and went, and the person couldn't understand why I was reminding her of the penalties on false prophets in the OT. We're not under OT law any more, but grace - but I was trying to get her to see the SERIOUSNESS of making false claims in God's name.

 

[parousia70]

And what do we do with the knowledge that yet more timetables based on a future-schedule reading of Revelation have proved wrong? Yet again? How passionate were the people promoting these timetables? How utterly certain?

To your knowledge, has anyone lost their faith over this?

Here’s an interesting list:

Unfulfilled Christian religious predictions - Wikipedia

As for how faith destroying such failed predictions can be, look no Furthur than the great disappointment of 1844 that destroyed the faith of countless people:

Great Disappointment - Wikipedia

 

[parousia70]

The function role of the messiah, the Christ, is to be the King of Israel. The Anti-Christ, to become the Anti-Christ has to be anointed the King of Israel.

Modern Israel, being a multi ethnic, secular, democratic republic, doesn’t, can’t and won’t anoint anyone “King”.

 

[Christian Gedge]

I am currently working on a brand new antichrist. The next president of the USA. Me get ahead of the end times pack, far too much competition these days.

I thought he was the last one.
Oh, hang on; he was the 'last trump.'

 

[klutedavid]

I thought he was the last one.
Oh, hang on; he was the 'last trump.'

They were the words of the false prophets.

Me true prophet, soon I will speak. Sell your house and send me the money, so I can spread my coming prophecy worldwide. Are you a true believer?

 

[klutedavid]

The pentecostal church I grew up in was of course holding to futurism.

99% of people left the church in lets say 15 years and stopped attending any church. Its hard to pinpoint if it was because of failed pentecostal promises or because of failed futurism promises. Perhaps a bit of both.

I observed that trend first hand. I can assure you that it was the powerful pull of the world. Not only Pentecostals suffered from that worldly effect but nearly all churches and charities.

 

[Douggg]

This thread is not a research thread into JW's or Mormons or ten-thousand other failed futurist claims. It's asking the question what to do with this phenomena, and why are people attracted to futurism when it has such a terrible legacy of failed predictions?

JW's, SDA, etc all have had faliled future timetables of events in Revelation.

In your thread title....
What timetables proved incorrect?

 

[eclipsenow]

JW's, SDA, etc all have had faliled future timetables of events in Revelation.

In your thread title....
What timetables proved incorrect?

Also in the heading, I was more obviously referring to any futurist timetables that JUST became obsolete because it is now 2022. As in, they expired in 2021. As in, I actually wrote:

Without goading, it's now 2022. What timetables proved incorrect?

In other words, I was asking what timetables from this eschatology forum have just been proved wrong. I intend to ask this every year. To make the point I wrote in my opening post more and more and more obvious.

And what do we do with the knowledge that yet more timetables based on a future-schedule reading of Revelation have proved wrong? Yet again? How passionate were the people promoting these timetables? How utterly certain?​

Sound like anyone you know?

Just wait till 2031.

 

[trophy33]

Maybe the thread would be shorter with the question "what timetables proved correct"

Except of 66-70 AD events, none (including Douggg's).

 

[keras]

Just wait till 2031.

All this kind of finger pointing is rather childish.
Obviously any prediction of a date before today, was wrong. But you cannot say that about dates still future.

Hosea 6:2 and Luke 13:32 both point to a 2000 year gap, from Jesus' triumphal entry into Jerusalem as King of the Jews, to His Return to there, as King of Kings and Lord of Lords.
A gap proved by hindsight and now nearly completed.

 

[trophy33]

Obviously any prediction of a date before today, was wrong. But you cannot say that about dates still future...

Hosea 6:2 and Luke 13:32 both point to a 2000 year gap...

The problem (futurist authors do not seem to understand) is that because of all the failures till today, futurists have lost credibility regarding any other predictions. They demonstrated they do not understand the Bible.

When futurists demonstrated they did not understand the verse about the tree (supposedly 1948 Israel) and led great many people into deception, then there is no credibility left for you to say now that Luke 13:32 means this or that.

Any individual, school of thought, company etc have just limited crediblity. You cannot go to a bank every year to ask for another loan, having paid none of those you borrowed before. One day, enough is simply enough and you hit the wall.

 

[eclipsenow]

The problem (futurist authors do not seem to understand) is that because of all the failures till today, futurists have lost credibility regarding any other predictions. They demonstrated they do not understand the Bible.

When futurists demonstrated they did not understand the verse about the tree (supposedly 1948 Israel) and led great many people into deception, then there is no credibility left for you to say now that Luke 13:32 means this or that.

Any individual, school of thought, company etc have just limited crediblity. You cannot go to a bank every year to ask for another loan, having paid none of those you borrowed before. One day, enough is simply enough and you hit the wall.

Well said!
Honestly, some of the 'interpretations' about 'timings' of events are so flimsy they don't have the staying power of a wet paper bag. Yet the flimsier the pretext, the more passionately presented they are. It all reminds me of a Crazy Wall.

 

[Hazelelponi]

The problem (futurist authors do not seem to understand) is that because of all the failures till today, futurists have lost credibility regarding any other predictions. They demonstrated they do not understand the Bible.

When futurists demonstrated they did not understand the verse about the tree (supposedly 1948 Israel) and led great many people into deception, then there is no credibility left for you to say now that Luke 13:32 means this or that.

Any individual, school of thought, company etc have just limited crediblity. You cannot go to a bank every year to ask for another loan, having paid none of those you borrowed before. One day, enough is simply enough and you hit the wall.

It's actually a bar to people coming to Christ in the first place. Those outside of the faith begin to see Christianity through the lens of failed prophecy, and it's not a good look.

Not only that, but it's proven to be so lucrative both financially (endless books, magazine articles, YouTube views etc) as well as having the ability to change people's behaviors - however temporarily - that the secular world, even governments (see climate change), are getting in on the action...

To me all is the largest warning outside scripture (which itself declares such things aren't from God) that this failed date setting is antithetical to the Christian faith.

 

[trophy33]

It's actually a bar to people coming to Christ in the first place. Those outside of the faith begin to see Christianity through the lens of failed prophecy, and it's not a good look.

Not only that, but it's proven to be so lucrative both financially (endless books, magazine articles, YouTube views etc) as well as having the ability to change people's behaviors - however temporarily - that the secular world, even governments (see climate change), are getting in on the action...

To me all is the largest warning outside scripture (which itself declares such things aren't from God) that this failed date setting is antithetical to the Christian faith.

Yes, the money so many futurists got for their books and VHS etc... where is it, did they return it after it did not happen? Perhaps not.

But Bible itself warns against trying to interpret prohecies before they happen:
"But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation..."
1Pt 1:20

Books trying to interpret future prophecies are not Scriptural, from the beginning.

 

[Christian Gedge]

I observed that trend first hand. I can assure you that it was the powerful pull of the world. Not only Pentecostals suffered from that worldly effect but nearly all churches and charities.

Do you think this trend over the last so many decades may be the prophesied ‘falling away’? Or Satans ‘little season?’

 

[trophy33]

Do you think this trend over the last so many decades may be the prophesied ‘falling away’? Or Satans ‘little season?’

Nope. Leaving church because false teachers are promising things that will not happen is not "falling away".

Its only a natural effect of wrong teachings in churches.