Winter Wheat Video Lecture

Speedwell

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If I created the rock, and the terrain and rolled it myself at a precise angle and velocity I'm sure it's possible to know exactly where it will fall. Which just confirms that intelligence is needed for the system to work. But the analogy is still totally inadequate to explain complex changes in the structure of DNA.
You could not even have that level of complexity without a designer. And now you are trying to propose a random process to enhance this program that is much more complex than the computer you're working on. And you think we need faith to imagine creation!
And it took a whole lot longer and most of the attempts failed.
 
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Hans Blaster

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If I created the rock, and the terrain and rolled it myself at a precise angle and velocity I'm sure it's possible to know exactly where it will fall. Which just confirms that intelligence is needed for the system to work.

I could do the same with very precise measurements of the shape of the rock and the terrain and of the surface properties of each. (How soft is it? will it deform or break.) I need not create the rock or terrain to have such predictive knowledge.

But this is never about the path of a single rock, single drop of water, just as the forces guiding evolutionary pressures are not about a single creature. They are all about the collective trajectory. Of water droplets falling on the ravine and of a herd of creatures pursued by predators or ravaged by drought.
 
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renniks

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I could do the same with very precise measurements of the shape of the rock and the terrain and of the surface properties of each. (How soft is it? will it deform or break.) I need not create the rock or terrain to have such predictive knowledge.

But this is never about the path of a single rock, single drop of water, just as the forces guiding evolutionary pressures are not about a single creature. They are all about the collective trajectory. Of water droplets falling on the ravine and of a herd of creatures pursued by predators or ravaged by drought.
All totally random according to your theories. Chaos doesn't create order. You can not assemble the most simple of machines by random processes, but you believe nature did it by accident.
 
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Speedwell

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All totally random according to your theories. Chaos doesn't create order. You can not assemble the most simple of machines by random processes, but you believe nature did it by accident.
"Random" is not the same as "chaos." Certainly so called "evolutionary algorithms" based on randomly distributed variation and selection are used in industry to design novel products, some of them quite complex.
 
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Subduction Zone

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Lol, you still aren't getting it. If I roll a tire, I'm involved in the process. In evolution there's nothing to roll that tire, there's no tire and no one to make the material to create it.
Oh I understand. It appears that you do not understand how analogies work. You should tell people that. When one focuses on unimportant parts of an analogy it indicates that at best they are trying not to understand.
 
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Subduction Zone

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If I created the rock, and the terrain and rolled it myself at a precise angle and velocity I'm sure it's possible to know exactly where it will fall. Which just confirms that intelligence is needed for the system to work. But the analogy is still totally inadequate to explain complex changes in the structure of DNA.
You could not even have that level of complexity without a designer. And now you are trying to propose a random process to enhance this program that is much more complex than the computer you're working on. And you think we need faith to imagine creation!
See what I mean? You are trying not to understand because that would explain your error to you.
 
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Estrid

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"Random" is not the same as "chaos." Certainly so called "evolutionary algorithms" based on randomly distributed variation and selection are used in industry to design novel products, some of them quite complex.

The creoclaim that order cannot emerge from chaos is
just wrong. There are countless examples.
 
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Estrid

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No, you really are not. Logic is based upon evidence and you do not seem to understand what is and what is not evidence.

Would you like to learn? It will not take long.

It's hard to do meaningful logic based on falsehoods.
 
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Estrid

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Oh I understand. It appears that you do not understand how analogies work. You should tell people that. When one focuses on unimportant parts of an analogy it indicates that at best they are trying not to understand.

So don't use analogies
 
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