Wife Beating

[Everlasting33]

Shook my head a more than a few times watching this one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nUI3TUd


While not every Muslim obeys the rule of wife beating, it's obvious that a marriage is more like a parent/child relationship: woman knows no better and must be disciplined to obey and keep quiet.

*Let me know if the video does not work. I have refreshed the page and for some reason, its not showing up.

Copy/Paste, "Debate on Wife Beating as instructed in Quran" in youtube search and its the first video on the list.

 

[BlackSabb]

I couldn't watch any more than a few seconds of that religious bastard casually rattling on about the merits of "discipline" and wife beating.

The more you know about Islam and the Koran, the more adamant I am that I don't want Muslims in my western democratic nation. The simple fact is that their "values" (for want of a better word) completely clash with modern democratic values. Their ideology and ways are totally foreign to ours and they do not fit in and belong.

I don't want Muslims immigrating, I don't want mosques and Islamic schools being built. And btw, don't be so stupid and call me a "rascist". I hate the Islamic religion-regardless of who practices it, be it Arab, English, American, British etc.

I know I am right when I say that they do not belong in a free Western democratic nation. I am not ashamed to say that.

And also, I am really impressed by the mentality of people participating in the Ethics and Morality forum-NOT. The amount of absolute stupid threads that go on and on. Stupid subjects such as people neutering themselves, the ethics of men being gyncacologists, thread after thread on yet another variant topic of homosexuality etc. And yet when someone posts a thread on a real ethical dilemma-NO RESPONSES! Is it because you are afraid to face the facts about your precious Islam?

 

[nolongerhome]

I'm not sure why this is being posed as a "Muslim" issue. Wife beating is not specific to that religion, there are plenty of Christians who take sections of the Bible seriously which call for no woman to have authority over men and see the role of the woman in much the same way as the OP described - "more like a parent/child relationship: woman knows no better and must be disciplined to obey and keep quiet."

Domestic violence is unacceptable, no matter what "reasoning" there is for it, religious or otherwise.

 

[Everlasting33]

I'm not sure why this is being posed as a "Muslim" issue. Wife beating is not specific to that religion, there are plenty of Christians who take sections of the Bible seriously which call for no woman to have authority over men and see the role of the woman in much the same way as the OP described - "more like a parent/child relationship: woman knows no better and must be disciplined to obey and keep quiet."

Domestic violence is unacceptable, no matter what "reasoning" there is for it, religious or otherwise.

This is leading toward a red herring fallacy. Point: Muslim leaders are teaching and encouraging "light beatings" of wives who do not obey their husbands.

When beating is mandated by a religious sect, authority figure, or authoritative teaching such as the Quran it is specific and an extension of their beliefs of women and marriage.

 

[Everlasting33]

I couldn't watch any more than a few seconds of that religious bastard casually rattling on about the merits of "discipline" and wife beating.

The more you know about Islam and the Koran, the more adamant I am that I don't want Muslims in my western democratic nation. The simple fact is that their "values" (for want of a better word) completely clash with modern democratic values. Their ideology and ways are totally foreign to ours and they do not fit in and belong.

I don't want Muslims immigrating, I don't want mosques and Islamic schools being built. And btw, don't be so stupid and call me a "rascist". I hate the Islamic religion-regardless of who practices it, be it Arab, English, American, British etc.

I know I am right when I say that they do not belong in a free Western democratic nation. I am not ashamed to say that.

And also, I am really impressed by the mentality of people participating in the Ethics and Morality forum-NOT. The amount of absolute stupid threads that go on and on. Stupid subjects such as people neutering themselves, the ethics of men being gyncacologists, thread after thread on yet another variant topic of homosexuality etc. And yet when someone posts a thread on a real ethical dilemma-NO RESPONSES! Is it because you are afraid to face the facts about your precious Islam?

Totally agree. Last night, I watched this documentary on Netflix:
YouTube - Islam - What the West Needs to Know 1, and it certainly opened my eyes to the fact that Islam is NOT peaceful but rather violent and advocating muder to get domination of Islamic leadership. There is a Muslim member on here who has "Islam treats women well" in his signature. Really? If you look at the texts and what the treatment of women in the Middle East, Islam does not treat women well at all.

What do women like about Islam? I can think of several reasons why a man would find Islam appealing (polygamy, virgins in heaven, control and domination of family).

 

[nolongerhome]

This is leading toward a red herring fallacy. Point: Muslim leaders are teaching and encouraging "light beatings" of wives who do not obey their husbands.

When beating is mandated by a religious sect, authority figure, or authoritative teaching such as the Quran it is specific and an extension of their beliefs of women and marriage.

Home

Like I said, this is not specific to a single religion, I don't see one religion should be singled out when sexist teachings exist in others which are used in exactly the same way to justify the use of violence against a wife.

The fact of the matter is that, no matter how people try to justify domestic violence, it remains domestic violence, and is therefore unnacceptable.

 

[Everlasting33]

Home

Like I said, this is not specific to a single religion, I don't see one religion should be singled out when sexist teachings exist in others which are used in exactly the same way to justify the use of violence against a wife.

The fact of the matter is that, no matter how people try to justify domestic violence, it remains domestic violence, and is therefore unnacceptable.

I agree that as individuals and as a society that we cannot advocate any type of domestic violence, religious or not.

However, while domestic violence is not specific to a single religion, Islam is the only religion I know that encourages and teaches about it.

Do you understand the difference of an authority,a religion telling their people "light beatings" are justified vs a man who gets upset and hits his wife?

 

[Everlasting33]

Another thing: Why is it so difficult to keep a topic on Islam? It seems that whenever one discusses one religion, another is brought up. It takes away from the discussion and it is essentially a red herring.

 

[nolongerhome]

I agree that as individuals and as a society that we cannot advocate any type of domestic violence, religious or not.

However, while domestic violence is not specific to a single religion, Islam is the only religion I know that encourages and teaches about it.

Do you understand the difference of an authority,a religion telling their people "light beatings" are justified vs a man who gets upset and hits his wife?

Another thing: Why is it so difficult to keep a topic on Islam? It seems that whenever one discusses one religion, another is brought up. It takes away from the discussion and it is essentially a red herring.

I just linked you to a Christian group who use Bible teachings about the relations between husband and wife to justify domestic violence. I see little difference between that and a specific Muslim group doing the same. Thankfully the vast majority of Chrisitans and Muslims don't engage in such behaviour and don't consider physical abuse of their spouse as condoned or mandated by their religion.

The reason why I see no reason to "keep the topic on Islam" is because the criticism you are levelling at Islam in particular is one that can be levelled at other religions with similar teachings about the dynamic of authority between a husband and wife. So why criticise Islam only and not the others?

Criticism for anyone who would use a religion to justify domestic violence is justified, regardless of the religion they are following. If it isn't just happening is Islam, why should we just criticise Islam?

Fundamentally, I don't like hypocrisy, and when people start to criticise another religion for things which occur in their own, I feel obliged to point out the hypocrisy.

 

[Everlasting33]

I just linked you to a Christian group who use Bible teachings about the relations between husband and wife to justify domestic violence. I see little difference between that and a specific Muslim group doing the same. The vast majority of Chrisitans and Muslims don't engage in such behaviour.

The reason why I see no reason to "keep the topic on Islam" is because the criticism you are levelling at Islam in particular is one that can be levelled at other religions with similar teachings about the dynamic of authority between a husband and wife. So why criticise Islam only and not the others?

Criticism for anyone who would use a religion to justify domestic violence is justified, regardless of the religion they are following. If it isn't just happening is Islam, why should we just criticise Islam?

I will have to ignore your posts since they are clearly turning this into a battle of christian vs islam.

 

[Beechwell]

I remember a thread about a Christian website advocating beating your wife some time ago. And the question of what "the wife must submit to her husband" (as demanded somewhere in the bible - by Paul probably) means, is a recurring topic on these boards. Some Christians still hold opinions on the matter not so different from those of conservative Islam.

So I think it's beside the point to reduce the matter to pure Islam-bashing, especially since the reality in many Islamic states is already much different than some conservative mullahs would like to believe.

 

[Everlasting33]

Fundamentally, I don't like hypocrisy, and when people start to criticise another religion for things which occur in their own, I feel obliged to point out the hypocrisy.

Don't we all? I mean, who likes hypocrisy? And I published the thread, knowing full well what some Christians believe, but its foolish to think that is reason to negate a discussion on Islam and its teachings.

 

[nolongerhome]

I will have to ignore your posts since they are clearly turning this into a battle of christian vs islam.

If that is what you think you have entirely missed the point.

I have no interest in a battle of Christianity vs Islam and have not been trying to create one. I have no idea how demonstrating that more than one religion has been used to justify domestic violence and that therefore we should not limit criticism to just one religion would make you think that.

The problem here is that I didn't like you making this thread about domestic violence into an excuse for bashing on Islam and Islam alone.

In your OP you posed no question to be considered, you just posted a Youtube video about how bad Islam was and then made some further comments to the same effect, about how a Muslim marriage is about a wife obeying and submitting to her husband. All you have done since is talk about how Islam is a violent religion and complained when I have pointed out that this kind of teaching is not only found in Islam but also in your own religion.

Domestic violence is a serious issue. It should not be tolerated or condoned. I don't appreciate you undermining this fact by simply using this discussion as a means to attack Islam, particularly when similar Christian teachings are also used to justify the same kind of wifely submissiong and domestic violence as a punishment when that submission is not forthcoming.

 

[nolongerhome]

Don't we all? I mean, who likes hypocrisy? And I published the thread, knowing full well what some Christians believe, but its foolish to think that is reason to negate a discussion on Islam and its teachings.

So despite the fact you know this occurs in Christianity, you would rather us just all sit around and talk about how bad Islam is?

Great idea for a thread.

 

[nolongerhome]

I remember a thread about a Christian website advocating beating your wife some time ago. And the question of what "the wife must submit to her husband" (as demanded somewhere in the bible - by Paul probably) means, is a recurring topic on these boards. Some Christians still hold opinions on the matter not so different from those of conservative Islam.

So I think it's beside the point to reduce the matter to pure Islam-bashing, especially since the reality in many Islamic states is already much different than some conservative mullahs would like to believe.

I posted a link to such a website above, here it is again: Welcome to CDD

 

[Everlasting33]

If that is what you think you have entirely missed the point.

I have no interest in a battle of Christianity vs Islam and have not been trying to create one. I have no idea how demonstrating that more than one religion has been used to justify domestic violence and that therefore we should not limit criticism to just one religion would make you think that.

The problem here is that I didn't like you making this thread about domestic violence into an excuse for bashing on Islam and Islam alone.

In your OP you posed no question to be considered, you just posted a Youtube video about how bad Islam was and then made some further comments to the same effect, about how a Muslim marriage is about a wife obeying and submitting to her husband. All you have done since is talk about how Islam is a violent religion and complained when I have pointed out that this kind of teaching is not only found in Islam but also in your own religion.

Domestic violence is a serious issue. It should not be tolerated or condoned. I don't appreciate you undermining this fact by simply using this discussion as a means to attack Islam, particularly when similar Christian teachings are also used to justify the same kind of wifely submissiong and domestic violence as a punishment when that submission is not forthcoming.

After all these years, I am still confused on why atheists/agnostics wish to come on a Christian board, when they obviously object vehemently against its teachings and beliefs. At the core, I really think its their reminder and validation of many things...

but that's for another thread

Anyway, I hope I receive some responses on topic!

 

[nolongerhome]

After all these years, I am still confused on why atheists/agnostics wish to come on a Christian board, when they obviously object vehemently against its teachings and beliefs. At the core, I really think its their reminder and validation of many things...

but that's for another thread

Anyway, I hope I receive some responses on topic!

In other words "What you said is entirely correct and I have no reasonable response for it so I will shift the subject with some amateur psychology".

Smooth move.

 

[Everlasting33]

Great idea for a thread.

Now you have relented to put downs?

 

[nolongerhome]

Now you have relented to put downs?

All you wanted from this thread was for people to just come in and nod their head in agreement with you about how Islam is bad. As soon as I legitimately burst that little bubble, you claimed I was taking the thread off topic and trying to cause a fight between Christianity and Islam. the irony obviously being that that was actually what you planned, you just didn't want anyone to take the side of Islam or question the legitimacy of the Christian position.

That is worthy of a put down.

 

[Chesterton]

Another thing: Why is it so difficult to keep a topic on Islam? It seems that whenever one discusses one religion, another is brought up. It takes away from the discussion and it is essentially a red herring.

It's Standard Operating Procedure in this forum. If you were to mention that someone returned a library book late, three people would respond "Oh yeah? Christians do that too!"