Why

[HumbleSiPilot77]

Looks like Jack's been talking to Calvinists and got all confused...

 

[JacksLadder]

Looks like Jack's been talking to Calvinists and got all confused...

It just distresses me a bit that God would create autonomous beings and before he dose he knows that a lot of them are going to suffer eternally just for his own self fulfillment. It seems that a loving God would only have a temporary hell.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

You do realize that you are not a robot. For instance you could end your life by any means as you are reading this... You do or do not know if you would though... In any case, God has the foreknowledge of it, and you have the freewill to do so. God didn't create you so you would suffer eternal torment, He has given you the freewill to choose between.

 

[JacksLadder]

I guess it just seems like giving kids matches and a can of gasoline.

 

[Dorothea]

This is kind of addressed to everybody that's replied. I have a question. Army Matt said in his post, if I interpreted it correctly, that even in hell one can have the opportunity to repent and be saved.

When I was in grad school for English lit, I did work on these middle English poems about the "harrowing of Hell." In one of them, an especially beautiful one, the writer gave the image of Christ planting the cross in hell so that anyone who would ever look on it and believe could be saved even then. I know that somehow the phrase "Christ descended into hell" has been removed from the Apostles' Creed because of the notion that Christ doing saving work in hell somehow detracts from the work he did on the cross. ?? I'm speaking of Protestant theology, here. Most Protestants I know don't even know that this was one a part of the creed.

Anyways, my question is: is it an Orthodox belief that everyone has the potential--even from hell--to be saved?

I agree basically with what everyone else said. I'd just like to add a few things I've learned on this subject. That when we physically die and our souls leave our bodies, the only thing there is God and His love permeates everywhere. Light is everywhere. You cannot escape it, for he is in everything and everywhere. So, His love will feel comforting and joyous to those who love Him, and burning and hard to bare or withstand to those who hate Him. That is the experience of heaven and hell.

As far as the Saints interceding for us here on earth. I learned through a lecture and podcast that this interceding goes on until His Second Coming. After we have resurrected and reunited with our bodies in a glorified state, the intercessions stop and wherever one is at that time (those already in Paradise or Hades - i.e. - those who feel His light and love as joyous or those who feel His love as burning torment) will be there for eternity.

 

[Antony in Tx]

"I guess it just seems like giving kids matches and a can of gasoline."


So you think that God is unwise...is that what you are saying? I just leave it up to Him that He is wise beyond my comprehension and it is my job to listen to Him as to how I should live. Even though I know that I fail miserably at carrying that out, I trust Him when He tells us that He loves us without condition.

 

[JacksLadder]

At least St.Gregory gives me faith that all might be saved I guess I will meditate on his writtings so I don't end up down in the dumps.

 

[Dorothea]

At least St.Gregory gives me faith that all might be saved I guess I will meditate on his stirrings so I don't end up down in the dumps.

Yes, don't be down in the dumps. He's a merciful God.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

At least St.Gregory gives me faith that all might be saved I guess I will meditate on his writtings so I don't end up down in the dumps.

I question your motive, do you want ALL to be saved? Because that seems to be the issue here from what you are posting. That is playing close with Universalism and heresy.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

I guess it just seems like giving kids matches and a can of gasoline.

If so be it, He also gave you a mind where you can make the decision... The point is, how do you come out of it...

 

[TheCunctator]

At least St.Gregory gives me faith that all might be saved I guess I will meditate on his writtings so I don't end up down in the dumps.

I think that is what everyone hopes for. I would love to see that happened. Maybe with a mega-purging process for those who rejected Christ.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I guess it just seems like giving kids matches and a can of gasoline.

no, it's more like kids being near matches and gasoline, and a present (not absent)Father saying no, and trying to teach the kids about the dangers of gas and matches.

 

[TristanCross]

Why would God create people with free will who he knows before they are made will be sent to hell? Why not just create those who through free will are going to choose God?

I would ask a different question. I would ask God, "Why am I and others like me condemned even though them and I tried our best to follow you? Have mercy, Lord, I am worldly!"

 

[JacksLadder]

I just think a temporary hell makes more sense and is more fair to everybody.

 

[Protoevangel]

So you know better than God what's fair? Wow!

 

[TristanCross]

I just think a temporary hell makes more sense and is more fair to everybody.

In Orthodoxy, the source of Heaven and Hell are the same: God. Those who lived for God will be warmed by the Lord's presence, while those who sought after worldly things and were selfish will be tormented by His presence. In the end, it is man's own fault if he experiences hell. Also, being Orthodox or a Christian at all does not guarantee salvation. My own destiny is hell.

For more information, look up "Eastern Orthodox Christian Theology" on Wikipedia and scroll down to the "Hell" section.

 

[JacksLadder]

So in Orthodoxy God's presence is a neutral state neither good nor bad?

 

[JacksLadder]

So you know better than God what's fair? Wow!

You sound like a Calvinist

 

[Protoevangel]

You sound like a Calvinist

Now you're just trying to be hurtful.


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[Gwendolyn]

My own destiny is hell.

Your destiny is not determined until you are dead.
While still you live, you have the ability to repent.