Why The Trinity is a False Teaching - Summarized Doctrinal Reasons

[nothead]

That is so illogical. God the father of logic would be offended by such illogical babble. God doesn't bend the rules of logic for anyone not even himself. If you are being intellectually honest you would admit what you just said sounds ridiculous and objectively it is ridiculous. You couldn't get away with that logic anywhere else I don't see why you can get away with it here.

The Son is not God. He is an elohim UNDER his God in ontology and being.

The Holy Spirit is not God en whole, rather the presence of God among men. God is Spirit, and God is Love. But NEITHER Spirit or Love encompass God wholly. The equation is not convertible rather descriptive in BOTH cases. BOTH love and spirit are lesser than God. His ATTRIBUTES are both love and spirit. His SIMPLICITY not ontology at all.

As if God is simple, for us Simple Simons. God is complex as God is. But we simply have to KNOW of His love and spirit to survive and be well. That just about all, fo'...folks.

 

[nothead]

No, Der Alter put that point entirely correctly.

I know Der Alter. How could this be? Jesus is not God and never said he was? Der Alter knows MORE than Jesus or what?

 

[nothead]

not according to the New Testament.

Are you speaking of verses MIStranslated by NT translators or what sir?

Most languages have a He She or IT option, and grammatical gender does not always match reality. Pneuma is neuter. But Parakletos is masculine. Ruach is feminine. The pronouns have to match the grammatical gender no matter what, and no matter the reality. This is generally speaking, sir.

 

[Albion]

As if God is simple, for us Simple Simons. God is complex as God is. But we simply have to KNOW of His love and spirit to survive and be well. That just about all, fo'...folks.

Probably not. Knowing who he is seems important, too, if you're going to worship him and count on him for eternal life.

 

[Albion]

Are you speaking of verses MIStranslated by NT translators or what sir?

I'm referring to the NT's use of a personal pronoun when referring to the Holy Ghost.

 

[Albion]

Jesus is not God and never said he was? Der Alter knows MORE than Jesus or what?

Jesus not only said he was God, but behaved as only God can, and didn't object to being called God and considered by other people to be God. None of this fits with the theory that he was not God.

 

[nothead]

I don't understand what you problem is here. He simply professed a very traditional concept of the Trinity.

Maybe you assume the Trinity is logical in ANY way shape or form?

 

[Albion]

Maybe you assume the Trinity is logical in ANY way shape or form?

I don't consider us capable of fully comprehending God, through logic or by any other means, but we do have what he's revealed to us in his word, and that's what we call the Trinitarian doctrine.

 

[Hoghead1]

I don't consider us capable of fully comprehending God, through logic or by any other means, but we do have what he's revealed to us in his word, and that's what we call the Trinitarian doctrine.

The Trinitarian formulations and doctrines are largely extra-biblical in nature. The Trinity is implied in Scripture, but not spelled out. Trinitarian terms such as "ousia" or "substance " are from Hellenic philosophy, not Scripture.

 

[Hoghead1]

Maybe you assume the Trinity is logical in ANY way shape or form?

There is a definite logic to it, yes, and also a biblical basis, though it is not fully worked out in Scripture.

 

[nothead]

Jesus not only said he was God, but behaved as only God can, and didn't object to being called God and considered by other people to be God. None of this fits with the theory that he was not God.

I'm referring to the NT's use of a personal pronoun when referring to the Holy Ghost.

Yup, in many cases MIStranslated.

Consider the Koine as opposed to the English KJV:

14:17 to to G3588 t_ Acc Sg n THE pneuma pneuma G4151 n_ Acc Sg n spirit ths tEs G3588 t_ Gen Sg f OF-THE alhqeias alEtheias G225 n_ Gen Sg f TRUTH o ho G3739 pr Acc Sg n WHICH o ho G3588 t_ Nom Sg m THE kosmos kosmos G2889 n_ Nom Sg m SYSTEM world ou ou G3756 Part Neg NOT

dunatai dunatai G1410 vi Pres midD/pasD 3 Sg IS-ABLE can labein labein G2983 vn 2Aor Act TO-BE-GETTING oti hoti G3754 Conj that ou ou G3756 Part Neg NOT qewrei theOrei G2334 vi Pres Act 3 Sg it-IS-beholdING auto auto G846 pp Acc Sg n it oude oude G3761 Adv NOT-YET neither ginwskei ginOskei G1097 vi Pres Act 3 Sg IS-KNOWING auto auto G846 pp Acc Sg n it

umeis humeis G5210 pp 2 Nom Pl YOU(p) ye de de G1161 Conj YET ginwskete ginOskete G1097 vi Pres Act 2 Pl ARE-KNOWING auto auto G846 pp Acc Sg n it oti hoti G3754 Conj that par par G3844 Prep BESIDE umin humin G5213 pp 2 Dat Pl to-YOU(p) ye menei menei G3306 vi Pres Act 3 Sg it-IS-REMAINING kai kai G2532 Conj AND en en G1722 Prep IN umin humin G5213 pp 2 Dat Pl YOU(p) ye estai estai G2071 vi Fut vxx 3 Sg SHALL-BE

Even] the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. 1

Sorry, the site does not transpose the actual Koine symbols.

 

[nothead]

There is a definite logic to it, yes, and also a biblical basis, though it is not fully worked out in Scripture.

I dare to disagree. Trinity MADE no sense from the git-go and doth not prethently either.

And it has NOTHING NADA ZILCH to support it in verse, sir.

 

[nothead]

The Trinitarian formulations and doctrines are largely extra-biblical in nature. The Trinity is implied in Scripture, but not spelled out. Trinitarian terms such as "ousia" or "substance " are from Hellenic philosophy, not Scripture.

True dat. Dat totally twue, I mean true.

 

[Albion]

The Trinitarian formulations and doctrines are largely extra-biblical in nature.

We've said this already.

The Trinity is implied in Scripture, but not spelled out.

That's true.

 

[Hoghead1]

I dare to disagree. Trinity MADE no sense from the git-go and doth not prethently either.

What exactly is your case that it is illogical?

 

[nothead]

Jesus not only said he was God, but behaved as only God can, and didn't object to being called God and considered by other people to be God. None of this fits with the theory that he was not God.

Jesus performed miracles, so did Moses. Jesus knew the will and Word of God, so did Moses.

Jesus did not know all things:
1) who would sit at his left and right hands, unless he being mumaboudit.
2) When he would come to rule one thousand years over all oppressors.
3) Who the woman who touched his tzit-tzit was.
4) What the name of Legion was.
5) That he would tarry in the Temple thereby being able to WARN his parents beforehand, that he should not dishonor them.
Instead, as a MAN he fulfilled all Law in this case, by the Great One, to Love God. Shema the one which is UMBRELLA over all other law.

Jesus by all accounts did not beam around like Scotty. God does and has. By whatever "vehicle" He chooses.

Any more sir? I realize you are wont to be loyal to a dead paradigm. But we the people have a revolution on our hands. What is to oppose? Reality itself?

 

[Albion]

Jesus did not know all things

That's right. He was a man just as we are men. He was born in the usual way (as the saying goes). All of this could have been alleviated if he'd come as he will at the Second Coming, but there is a reason he came as he did, with all the limitations that came with it.

 

[nothead]

What exactly is your case that it is illogical?

Numerals itemized:

1) Three who ARE God are naturally thought of as Three Gods. But the Athanasian Creed prohibits the thought. Trinnies are then BEHOLDEN to two conflicting thoughts. Three are God but are NOT three Gods. Whata CROCK!
2) OUSIA and HYPOSTASIS meant the same thingybobber but must be MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE in meaning for Trinity to be true.
Same with the modern "Person" and "Being." By Merriam Webster (a pretty lass) THESE metaphors are SYNONYM.
3) The Trinity ABROGATES the Shema in true meaning and the First Command of the Ten in true meaning. The BASTIONS of the Hebraic faith. Take away THESE commands from God and what do you have, sir? Confusion to the End of Time? DAWGS and SWINE mucking around wallowing in the mire? BLEEPING IDJITS all the day long? Were EITHER of these two precepts brought up at Nicaea ONE WHIT, sir?
4) Oh I could go on, but what the HAY? Does any of this matter? What am I DOING here, anyhoo?

 

[Hoghead1]

The concept too, based on EXTRABIBLICAL terms.

Not quite true. The Bible, the NT, strongly implies a Trinity. The opening to the Book of John is one major example.

 

[nothead]

That's right. He was a man just as we are men. He was born in the usual way (as the saying goes). All of this could have been alleviated if he'd come as he will at the Second Coming, but there is a reason he came as he did, with all the limitations that came with it.

A man all the way. But elohim by virtue of his anointing. Not YHWH Elohim, since this is another referent. AN elohim just over the angels who are ALSO elohim and probably the Cherubim and Seraphim and any OTHER elohim in heaven or the heavens, sir. Thank you sir. Donations are in the fower I mean foyer.