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LoveGodsWord

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LoveGodsword, has lots of things to say, but has to dance and skip to never really say why he teaches law observance and at the same time says he teaches no such thing. But for certain, LoveGodsword does and cannot, teach faith, as SDA is about sabbath necessity and also about abstaining from what they perceive as unclean.

For me, he must increase and I must decrease. I only point all to the Word of God because it is there we find the one who loves us that we may love him. I know him and am known by him. All that he shows me I see and must show to all because I am blind. He tells me it is those that say they see that do not see. These are they that have once known him or do not know him. There is only life in the living Word. These are his Words and not my own. Freely I give because freely I have received. I must speak in the light and what I hear preach in the housetops. Many will not hear because they do not know Him. He is the Word of God and those that believe him are those that he has chosen. They follow him because they love him and are loved by him. Many are called but few are chosen. There is nothing hidden that shall not be revealed come judgment day. For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for he giveth not the Spirit by measure but many do not hear when they close their eyes to see and their ears to hear.

Take Care.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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This is an example of a very terrible misunderstanding of Scripture.

First, James said NOTHING about "dead faith" of devils. In fact, he never said anything about "faith of demons" either. He did SAY that the demons BELIEVE that God is One.

Is that salvation? No. Why do they BELIEVE that? Is their belief from faith, or experience? It's from experience, since all angels were created IN heaven.

Believing from experience is different than believing from trust or faith.

James' whole point in ch 2 is found in v.18. His point is that the ONLY WAY to demonstrate your faith to others is by works/deeds.

God knows, but man need evidence.

A "dead faith" only means a believer cannot demonstrate their faith to others.

Sorry dear friend but I respectfully disagree. According to the scriptures faith without works is dead. This is why it is the dead faith of devils because the devils believe but do not follow what Gods' Word says. Therefore if you teach that you can have Gods' salvation without doing what God's Word says this is the dead faith of devils because the devils believe but do not follow. This is why James says faith without work's is dead which is the same faith of the devils who believe in God but do not follow what God's Word says. (James 2:17-26).
 
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LoveGodsWord

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This is just a very broken record.

You WON'T even address 1 Peter 1:23 - For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

What it is about being born again of IMPERISHABLE SEED that can perish that you can't explain?

Anyhow, your avoidance of this verse reveals the problem with your loss of salvation views.

All you can do is repeat that you disagree with me. Big deal. Since you don't and won't and
can't explain the verses I share, it is clear that your views are unbiblical.

The truth CAN always explain verses, which agree with every other verse.

And I've shared verses that absolutely refute your misunderstanding of your verses.

Please don't bother telling me you disagree. I'm pretty sure no one cares. Since you won't deal with my verses, and explain what they do teach, disagreement means nothing.

If you have the truth, it would be EASY to explain what my verses teach.

Sorry dear friend but I do not believe you. As shown through the posts and the scriptures already shared with you, there is no scripture that you have posted that shows that we can "depart the faith" and continue in a life of known unrepentant sin and still expect to receive everlasting life. That is a teaching that is against the scriptures according to *Hebrews 6:4-8 and Hebrews 10:26-31. Gods' salvation is conditional on believing and following Gods' Word to the very end. Your claims however have been refuted with scripture and you have simply chosen to not to respond to the scriptures shared with you that are in disagreement with your teachings which is why we should agree to disagree. You do not need to make any cases with me and I respect your right to your opinion even though I believe I have shown why I do not agree with you from the scriptures. According to the very words of Jesus we all answer only to God come judgement day for the words of God we accept or reject according to John 12:47-48. Thanks for sharing your view though.

Take care.
 
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FreeGrace2

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According to the scriptures faith without works is dead.
Are you not aware of how the Bible uses the word "dead"? There are many examples of the word being used in a figurative sense. And one word translated "dead" actually means unproductive, barren, etc.

A dead faith is simply a faith that cannot be demonstrated by deeds. iow, it is barren.

James did NOT suggest or insinuate that a faith without works is not a saving faith. But too many people lack the discernment to understand what he was saying.

This is why it is the dead faith of devils
OK, I'm stopping your post right here. I ALREADY explained the fallacy of these words because they are FALSE. James did NOT even say "dead faith of devils", so why do you keep repeating such a WRONG idea?

James talked about demons who believe that God is One. And I explained the DIFFERENCE between faith and believing. Didn't you read it?

If you did, please comment. If you didn't, why do you bother responding if you aren't interested in an honest discussion of all my points?

because the devils believe but do not follow what Gods' Word says.
This is just ridiculous. What do you think the devils believe anyway?

Your answer will reveal just how far away from God's Word your views are.
 
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FreeGrace2

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FreeGrace2 said:
This is just a very broken record.

You WON'T even address 1 Peter 1:23 - For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

What it is about being born again of IMPERISHABLE SEED that can perish that you can't explain?

Anyhow, your avoidance of this verse reveals the problem with your loss of salvation views.
Sorry dear friend but I do not believe you.
I don't care what you don't believe. And you never clarify your statements. Like, "don't believe...what". What is it that you don't believe? You never say. Or your broken record of "I disagree with you". Like that matters, or something.

As shown through the posts and the scriptures already shared with you, there is no scripture that you have posted that shows that we can "depart the faith" and continue in a life of known unrepentant sin and still expect to receive everlasting life.
What you have repeatedly failed to show is ANY verse that SAYS a recipient of eternal life can perish. Where are these kind of verses?

Jesus was clear: recipients of eternal life shall never perish. End of story. Once given the gift of eternal life, the recipient shall never perish.

But, your theory is that lifestyle makes a difference and some recipients WILL perish, if they do X, Y, or Z. Your theories do not agree with what Jesus said.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Are you not aware of how the Bible uses the word "dead"? There are many examples of the word being used in a figurative sense. And one word translated "dead" actually means unproductive, barren, etc.

A dead faith is simply a faith that cannot be demonstrated by deeds. iow, it is barren.

James did NOT suggest or insinuate that a faith without works is not a saving faith. But too many people lack the discernment to understand what he was saying.


OK, I'm stopping your post right here. I ALREADY explained the fallacy of these words because they are FALSE. James did NOT even say "dead faith of devils", so why do you keep repeating such a WRONG idea?

James talked about demons who believe that God is One. And I explained the DIFFERENCE between faith and believing. Didn't you read it?

If you did, please comment. If you didn't, why do you bother responding if you aren't interested in an honest discussion of all my points?


This is just ridiculous. What do you think the devils believe anyway?

Your answer will reveal just how far away from God's Word your views are.
Yes faith without works being dead simply means that it is not saving faith but the dead faith of devils because faith leads us to follow what God's Word says. As posted and shown through the scriptures already we are saved by grace through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God and not of works lest any man should boast *Ephesians 2:8-9. Obedience to God's law is not how we are saved because all of us have already broken the law and are under it's penalty of condemnation and death *Romans 3:9-23; 2 Corinthians 3:3-11. So it is by God's grace through faith that we are saved through Gods forgiveness of our sins. According to the scriptures, obedience to Gods' law therefore is the fruit of genuine faith of one that is already been given Gods promise of salvation and the fruit of God's work in us *Philippians 2:13 as we believe and follow his word *John 10:26-27. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *James 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *Matthew 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50; Hebrews 10:26-27. Therefore we do not abolish God's law through faith like some people teach but God's law is established in the heart by faith that works by love *Romans 3:31; 1 John 5:3-4; Romans 13:8-10. According to the scriptures, sin (breaking God' commandments and not believing and following God's Word) is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 John 3:6-10; Revelation 12:17; Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14. Therefore says Jesus you shall know them (who is from God and who is not) by their fruit. *Matthew 7:16-20; John 15:1-6; 1 John 2:3-4. Anything else according to James in James 2:17-26 is the dead faith of devils.

Now what it is here that you are in disagreement with and if we are in agreement then what is your argument? - You have none because we are in agreement.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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FreeGrace2 said:
This is just a very broken record.

You WON'T even address 1 Peter 1:23 - For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

What it is about being born again of IMPERISHABLE SEED that can perish that you can't explain?

Anyhow, your avoidance of this verse reveals the problem with your loss of salvation views.

I don't care what you don't believe. And you never clarify your statements. Like, "don't believe...what". What is it that you don't believe? You never say. Or your broken record of "I disagree with you". Like that matters, or something.


What you have repeatedly failed to show is ANY verse that SAYS a recipient of eternal life can perish. Where are these kind of verses?

Jesus was clear: recipients of eternal life shall never perish. End of story. Once given the gift of eternal life, the recipient shall never perish.

But, your theory is that lifestyle makes a difference and some recipients WILL perish, if they do X, Y, or Z. Your theories do not agree with what Jesus said.
Your post content here is unresponsive repetition we are not in agreement over as shown already from scripture and explained why once more in the post you are part quoting from in post # 623 linked. You have been shown why I disagree with you with detailed scripture responses but you leave these out of your replays and do not address them. Sorry I do not believe you as shown from the scriptures already so we will agree to disagree and remain friends. Perhaps you can pray about it.

1 Peter 1:23 is easy. "For you have been born again not of seed which is perishable, but imperishable, that is, through the living and enduring word of God."

The Word of God lives forever. It is that simple. Not so those who choose to reject it. We are born again as we have faith in Gods' Word (believing). Those who depart the faith choose to put out and reject Gods' Word and choose unbelief and sin over the Word of God that lives and endures forever.

Take Care.
 
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Clare73

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No one is born again at Christ death unless they believe and follow what Gods' Word says.
That's: unless they believe in and on Christ and his death (blood, Romans 3:25) for the remittance of their sin.
 
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Clare73

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It seems you think that the law mentioned in Hebrews 7 is talking about Gods' 10 commandments? Prove it? I bet you cannot because the chapter context and subject matter is to the laws of the Levitical Priesthood.

Here is the context and subject matter you left out which is the changing of the law of the Levitical Priesthood because Jesus was of the tribe of Judah (only Levites could be Priests under old covenant law)...
Which you left out, indeed!
Hebrews 7: 11-18 [11], If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, for under it the people received the law,

And what law did the people receive? . . .the people received the Mosaic law, not the laws for the priesthood.

And what happened to that law which the people received? . . .it was set aside (Hebrews 7:18a).

Which law was set aside? . . .the one that was weak and useless to make anything perfect (Hebrews 7:18b). . .the same law of Romans 8:3 that was powerless, which in Romans 8:3 is the Mosaic law given to the people.

So what law was changed with the change of the priesthood? . . .the law which the priesthood administered to the people (Hebrews 7:11), the law that was given to the people under the priesthood, (Hebrews 7:11), and not the laws of the priesthood.

Please explain the meaning of the parenthetical, "for on the basis of (under) the priesthood, the law was given to the people," being true to its words, context and to apostolic teaching (Hebrews 7:11).

And now comes the grand run-around. . .wait for it!



 
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LoveGodsWord

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LoveGodsWord said: No one is born again at Christ death unless they believe and follow what Gods' Word says.
Your response here...
That's unless they believe in and on Christ and his death (blood, Romans 3:25) for the remittance of their sin.
Which means to believe and follow what Gods' Word says as it is written "Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God *Romans 10:17

Take Care
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Which you left out, indeed!


And what law did the people receive? . . .the people received the Mosaic law, not the laws for the priesthood.

And what happened to that law which the people received? . . .it was set aside (Hebrews 7:18a).

Which law was set aside? . . .the one that was weak and useless to make anything perfect (Hebrews 7:18b). . .the same law of Romans 8:3 that was powerless, which in Romans 8:3 is the Mosaic law given to the people.

So what law was changed with the change of the priesthood? . . .the law which the priesthood administered to the people (Hebrews 7:11), the law that was given to the people under the priesthood, (Hebrews 7:11), and not the laws of the priesthood.

Please explain the meaning of the parenthetical, "for on the basis of (under) the priesthood, the law was given to the people," being true to its words, context and to apostolic teaching (Hebrews 7:11).

And now comes the grand run-around. . .wait for it!

Sorry I respectfully disagree as shown by the scripture and chapter context and subject matter your disregarding. It seems you think that the law mentioned in Hebrews 7 is talking about Gods' 10 commandments? Prove it? I bet you cannot because the chapter context and subject matter is to the laws of the Levitical Priesthood.

Here is the context and subject matter you left out which is the changing of the law of the Levitical Priesthood because Jesus was of the tribe of Judah (only Levites could be Priests under old covenant law)...

Hebrews 7: 11-18 [11], If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, for under it the people received the law, what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron? [12], For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law. [13], For he of whom these things are spoken pertains to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar. [14], For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning priesthood. [15], And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there rises another priest, [16], Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life. [17], For he testifies, You are a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec. [18], For there is truly a cancellation of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.

Hebrews 7:28, For the law makes men high priests which have infirmity; but the word of the oath, which was since the law, makes the Son, who is consecrated for ever more.

Hebrews 9:9 Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience

The changing of the law in Hebrews 7 is the changing of the law of the Priesthood and the old covenant laws for remission of sins and animal sacrifices not Gods' 10 commandments. Your disregarding chapter context and subject matter as your friend was earlier and reading into the scriptures (eisegesis) what the scriptures do not say or do not teach. Under the Levitical Priesthood the people received the laws for remission of sins through animal sacrifices and sin offerings for blood atonement (see Hebrews 8; Hebrews 9 and Hebrews 10).

Hebrews 7:11? Under the Levitical Priesthood the people received the laws for remission of sins through animal sacrifices and sin offerings for blood atonement (see Hebrews 8; Hebrews 9 and Hebrews 10) not God's 10 commandments. This is the context and subject matter your disregarding in Hebrews. Also, think it through, the people did not receive Gods' 10 commandments from the Levitical Priesthood or Aaron did they? They received it directly from God and through Moses (tables of stone). Your claim that Hebrews 7 is talking about Gods' 10 commandments is simply not biblical or supported by scripture. As shown through scripture context and subject matter, the runaround is your side not mine so we may have to agree to disagree.

Take Care
 
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Clare73

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Your response here...

Which means to believe and follow what Gods' Word says as it is written "Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God *Romans 10:17

Take Care
Which presents Jesus and his atoning work (blood, Romans 3:25) not words on a page, as the object of faith for salvation.
 
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Clare73

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Sorry I respectfully disagree as shown by the scripture and chapter context and subject matter your disregarding. It seems you think that
the law mentioned in Hebrews 7 is talking about Gods' 10 commandments?
The whole Mosaic law.

To both demonstrate your assertion and to respond to my request, it falls to you to demonstrate that the weak and useless law, making nothing perfect (Hebrews 7:18-19) and given to the people (Hebrews 7:11), was the law for the priests, rather than the same powerless law of Romans 8:3, which is the whole Mosaic law.
 
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FreeGrace2

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Yes faith without works being dead simply means that it is not saving faith but the dead faith of devils because faith leads us to follow what God's Word says.
Why do you continue to make the mistake of talking about "the faith of devils" when James NEVER used that word? Why are you just making up stuff?

I explained the difference between belief from experience and faith from trust. But apparently you aren't interested.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Which presents Jesus and his atoning work (blood, Romans 3:25) not words on a page, as the object of faith for salvation.
Think it through. If you do not know God's Word you do not know of Christ or His atoning blood (Romans 10:17). Which means we receive God's salvation by believing and following what Gods' Word says as it is written "Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God *Romans 10:17

Take Care
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Why do you continue to make the mistake of talking about "the faith of devils" when James NEVER used that word? Why are you just making up stuff?

I explained the difference between belief from experience and faith from trust. But apparently you aren't interested.

There is no mistake my side as shown in the scripture and the posts that you refuse to address that disagree with you. You of course are free to believe as you wish. That would be between you and God to work through. Sorry I do not believe you as shown why from the scriptures.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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The whole Mosaic law.

To both demonstrate your assertion and to respond to my request, it falls to you to demonstrate that the weak and useless law, making nothing perfect (Hebrews 7:18-19) and given to the people (Hebrews 7:11), was the law for the priests, rather than the same powerless law of Romans 8:3, which is the whole Mosaic law.
Ignored. This is because your post is non-responsive to the post you are quoting from. As shown from the scriptures, in the linked post you are quoting from your disregarding scripture context and subject matter of Hebrews 7 (see post # 631 linked)
 
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