why not the apocrypha?

[Albion]

No, this is my own thought process.

Well, if so, it's been argued in almost exactly that way, a million times over, and almost always by the devotees of a few specific denominations.

The Jewish notion is irrelevant, in light of the marcionism heresy.

No, it isn't. The Jewish "notion"--i.e. the Old Testament--didn't just fall into the Christian Bible from out of the sky.

They don't teach any of your essential doctrines

What are my essential doctrines, Michael?

Based on your previous arguments, I sense some historical revisionism

Oh, I don't doubt that if I disagree with the Papacy on anything, it will be considered "historic revisionism" by some people here, even when what I point to IS the historic record. What you're explaining is not historic at all. It's your own theory, as you yourself told me here.

And by the way, if you think that knowing of the impact of the Assyrian captivity upon the Israeli exiles is important--that's the perspective held by Luther and the other Reformers, not the opposite.

 

[FireDragon76]

The New Testament comes from the Holy Spirit, not the Church.

That's a misleading distinction that negates human agency in the process. The NT emerged from within a specific religious community that had a particular history. If we don't consider that fact carefully, then we can end up using the Bilbe in a way that it was never intended to be used.

 

[Thursday]

And I guess it would be accurate likewise to say that the only Christian tradition that takes a hard stance in favor of the apocryphal books being inspired is the Catholic tradition.

And the Orthodox.

Christians considered these books to be scripture until the Reformation. It was then noticed that they were very Catholic, and therefore, they had to be eliminated.

 

[FireDragon76]

The reformers themselves never eliminated those books from the Bible (publishing houses in the 19th century did). Don't over romanticize the actual history, Catholics themselves up until Trent had a variety of views of the so-called Apocryphal books.

The fact is a strictly defined canon is something that could only be a concern of modernity. Early Christians were quite content with ambiguity. Given that there is an emerging consensus that modernity has been transcended, I have to wonder if these arguments are even relevant. The apocryphal and pseudo-apocryphal books are clearly part of the overall received tradition, and influence even those Protestants that reject them as having any authority. A good example would be identification of the serpent in Genesis with Satan- the text itself in the Bible never really affirms this, and its somewhat questionable in the post-Christian Jewish tradition as well.

 

[Job8]

That's a misleading distinction that negates human agency in the process. The NT emerged from within a specific religious community that had a particular history. If we don't consider that fact carefully, then we can end up using the Bilbe in a way that it was never intended to be used.

1. The New Testament is Scripture.

2. Scripture is God-breathed, even though prophets, evangelists and apostles penned it.

3. Every word is a word of God.

4. The books and the parchments were being circulated in all the churches of the Roman empire.

5. Peter groups all of Paul's epistles as Scripture.

6. Christ recognized only the 24 books of the Tanakh as Scripture, and so did the apostles as well as the enemies of Christ.

So while human beings were involved with the writing and circulation of Scripture, we do not say that the Church produced Scripture. God produced Scripture and gave it to the Church (2 Tim 3:14-17).
http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/2-Timothy-3-14/
But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

When Paul wrote these words (c 68 AD) almost all of the New Testament had already been written, and prophetically the rest of the NT was included.

 

[Root of Jesse]

Truth is, both Protestants and Catholics have removed books from the Bible. Ever hear of the "Prayer of Manasseh" among others?

Prayer of Manasseh is a prayer included in the certain editions of the Greek Septuagint, in an appendix to the Latin Vulgate, and in the Apocrypha of the King James Bible. It is considered apocryphal by Catholics, and almost all Jews and Protestants alike. Clement VIII included the book in an appendix to the Vulgate stating that it should continue to be read "lest it perish entirely"