Why no evidence FOR creation/ID?

[pitabread]

No, because we know what nature was like in history.

But how? You're describing what you believe, but you're not giving the basis for that believe.

I run them through God's checks and balances system.

Which is?

 

[dad]

But how? You're describing what you believe, but you're not giving the basis for that believe.



Which is?

How does what we read about life in history tell us anything was different? I do not see Napoleon living 1000 years? I don't see Queen Victoria's garden growing trees in a few weeks?

 

[pitabread]

How does what we read about life in history tell us anything was different? I do not see Napoleon living 1000 years? I don't see Queen Victoria's garden growing trees in a few weeks?

You don't appear to have an answer...

Oh well, carry on then.

 

[tas8831]

Unless supported by evidence, it is actually unsupported belief that tells you that.

An example of the evidence - we observe a flood. We see the results of this flood, that is, it leaves evidence. Erosion, deposition of soils in a discernible pattern, etc.

We see the same sort of evidence in ancient strata. Obvious conclusion - caused by a flood.


Your only evidence that things were different in the past is a desire to rescue untenable bible lore.

Real common sense does not fly in the face of reason and history. Learn the difference between baseless biased preferential intuition and commons sense.

Interesting projection.

But I know - I also know the difference between common sense and reality (the two very often do not intersect).

Learn the difference between desire and fact.

No. You just think you do. This is one reason you don't post it.

This is interesting.

When you wrote this post, just 2 posts up the chain is this one:

Why no evidence FOR creation/ID?

Since it makes reproduction difficult, I suspect it is an adapting/evolving from something else, rather than the designed created kind.

LOL!

Right...

Always an excuse. I guess that is your "common sense" at work?

:lol:

 

[Divide]

101 pages! There's really some stiff opposition going on here. There's only a small multitude of facts and archaeological proofs of God hence creation. God's creation speaks for itself and all you have to do is open your eyes and look around. What this thread is showing (even being nice and giving the presumption that no proof has been posted, lol!) is a very calculated determined denial of obvious proofs in the world that everyone can and does see. Make no mistake about it, the denial of God's existence is for a reason that they will not state. Every single person on this board knows deep down inside that God is real and did create the world just as He said He did. Some lie to the Christians, others are lying to themselves perhaps and may actually believe the inane things they write. Everybody has the God seed in them. How do I know this? I have felt it my whole life, even when I wasn't walking with God. I know you feel it too. Why else do Atheists hang out on Christian boards?!

You guys crack me up, man. The Christian scriptures say that there will be no excuse. God doesn't lie.

 

[Divide]

double post

 

[tas8831]

There's only a small multitude of facts and archaeological proofs of God hence creation.

Apparently this multitude is so small so as to be invisible.

God's creation speaks for itself and all you have to do is open your eyes and look around.

Meaningless.

What this thread is showing (even being nice and giving the presumption that no proof has been posted, lol!) is a very calculated determined denial of obvious proofs in the world that everyone can and does see.

It is true that no proof has been posted. No evidence, either.

If you look though it, you will see that all the 'proof' amounts to groundless, question begging assertions such as " God's creation speaks for itself and all you have to do is open your eyes and look around. "

Make no mistake about it, the denial of God's existence is for a reason that they will not state. Every single person on this board knows deep down inside that God is real and did create the world just as He said He did. Some lie to the Christians, others are lying to themselves perhaps and may actually believe the inane things they write. Everybody has the God seed in them. How do I know this? I have felt it my whole life, even when I wasn't walking with God. I know you feel it too.

It is amazing how so many evangelical types pretend to know the psychology of those that do not share their ancient middle eastern faith. Such hubris - and all to justify their superstitious numerology.

Why else do Atheists hang out on Christian boards?!

Perhaps because people like you, collectively, seek to force your religion upon all others?

The Christian scriptures say that there will be no excuse. God doesn't lie.

Except when He does.

Jeremiah 20:7

 

[Brightmoon]

That’s exactly why I don’t accept creationist blather about science, because God doesn’t lie and neither does the natural phenomena hHe created. So the common creationist tactic of ignoring verifiable evidence FROM NATURE just looks to me like blatant denial and then lying about what others have figured out.

 

[Brightmoon]

It’s not just atheists who object to creationists pseudoscience

 

[Brightmoon]

It’s not just atheists who object to creationists pseudoscience nonsense

 

[Brightmoon]

It’s not just atheists who object to creationist’s pseudoscience nonsense

 

[Brightmoon]

It’s not just atheists who object to creationist’s pseudoscience nonsense, deletions and lies

 

[Divide]

Apparently this multitude is so small so as to be invisible.


Meaningless.




It is true that no proof has been posted. No evidence, either.

If you look though it, you will see that all the 'proof' amounts to groundless, question begging assertions such as " God's creation speaks for itself and all you have to do is open your eyes and look around. "



It is amazing how so many evangelical types pretend to know the psychology of those that do not share their ancient middle eastern faith. Such hubris - and all to justify their superstitious numerology.



Perhaps because people like you, collectively, seek to force your religion upon all others?

Except when He does.

Jeremiah 20:7

Oh, I'm done debating you guys. You don't settle for anything less than a conversion to your religion, lol. My post was merely a...or so it seems to me...So believe anything you want to choose! That's what I see in this thread though. You must really like what you're in to.

 

[Brightmoon]

Actually, you’re wrong. We don’t just believe what we want. We accept what the verifiable evidence shows. And if that pushes some previously accepted biblical story into the realm of fable or myth then so be it. The story is still important as far as religion and sociology is concerned . Belief in the biblical Adam and Eve story explains why the domestic violence rate is so historically high In so called civilised countries. And there are psychological truth in some of these stories as well. We all leave the garden of Eden at around age 3 or 4 when we find out that living organisms can die.

 

[Brightmoon]

We don’t have to believe that the Bible is a history . In fact , it’s wrong a lot of times . Archeology and life science have demonstrated that many times

 

[tas8831]

I do not see Napoleon living 1000 years?

Right - so no reason to think anyone lived that long.

I don't see Queen Victoria's garden growing trees in a few weeks?

Because that is not how things grow.

You seem to think that ancient middle eastern myths are on par with known science and reality.

Therein lies your problem.

 

[dad]

You don't appear to have an answer...

Oh well, carry on then.

The answer you ignored was that nothing in contemporary history tells us that the basic realities and laws of physics were unlike they now are. One cannot say the same for earliest ancient history, and Genesis. In fact there are distinct differences recorded.

 

[dad]

An example of the evidence - we observe a flood. We see the results of this flood, that is, it leaves evidence. Erosion, deposition of soils in a discernible pattern, etc.

Irrelevant when talking about a flood that occurred before mountain building/uplift/rapid continental drift/nature change/...etc.

We see the same sort of evidence in ancient strata. Obvious conclusion - caused by a flood.

We see stuff from space and under the earth in the KT layer. Flood waters also came from there. Obvious conclusion: there may be a connection.

Your only evidence that things were different in the past is a desire to rescue untenable bible lore.

Also ancient history, and the absolute ignorance of science on the matter either way.

But I know - I also know the difference between common sense and reality (the two very often do not intersect).

Using the word reality does not bring it any closer to your religion.

Why no evidence FOR creation/ID?

Ancient genetics is unknown. IN a different nature they would have to be different to some extent. You simply look at today and assume they were the same always. That is religion. Not evidence relating to the far past or origins.

 

[dad]

An example of the evidence - we observe a flood. We see the results of this flood, that is, it leaves evidence. Erosion, deposition of soils in a discernible pattern, etc.

Irrelevant when talking about a flood that occurred before mountain building/uplift/rapid continental drift/nature change/...etc.

We see the same sort of evidence in ancient strata. Obvious conclusion - caused by a flood.

We see stuff from space and under the earth in the KT layer. Flood waters also came from there. Obvious conclusion: there may be a connection.

Your only evidence that things were different in the past is a desire to rescue untenable bible lore.

Also ancient history, and the absolute ignorance of science on the matter either way.

But I know - I also know the difference between common sense and reality (the two very often do not intersect).

Using the word reality does not bring it any closer to your religion.

Why no evidence FOR creation/ID?

Ancient genetics is unknown. IN a different nature they would have to be different to some extent. You simply look at today and assume they were the same always. That is religion. Not evidence relating to the far past or origins.

 

[dad]

An example of the evidence - we observe a flood. We see the results of this flood, that is, it leaves evidence. Erosion, deposition of soils in a discernible pattern, etc.

Irrelevant when talking about a flood that occurred before mountain building/uplift/rapid continental drift/nature change/...etc.

We see the same sort of evidence in ancient strata. Obvious conclusion - caused by a flood.

We see stuff from space and under the earth in the KT layer. Flood waters also came from there. Obvious conclusion: there may be a connection.

Your only evidence that things were different in the past is a desire to rescue untenable bible lore.

Also ancient history, and the absolute ignorance of science on the matter either way.

But I know - I also know the difference between common sense and reality (the two very often do not intersect).

Using the word reality does not bring it any closer to your religion.

Why no evidence FOR creation/ID?

Ancient genetics is unknown. IN a different nature they would have to be different to some extent. You simply look at today and assume they were the same always. That is religion. Not evidence relating to the far past or origins.

 

[tas8831]

Irrelevant when talking about a flood that occurred before mountain building/uplift/rapid continental drift/nature change/...etc.

Question begging fallacy. You need to provide empirical support for your proposed timeline.

I do not accept that these events (flooding, mountain building, etc.) occurred in a prescribed temporal fashion, since we can see that they are ongoing and occur simultaneously.

You seem to be proposing events that would have had dire consequences for the planet - how much energy, for example, would "rapid continental drift" taken, and how much heat would have been released?

Let me make a prediction - Jehovah just turned off all physical 'laws' and constants - to include the creationist favorites the laws of thermodynamics - to accomplish his murderous tasks?

We see stuff from space and under the earth in the KT layer.

Yes - iridium, common in asteroids, not so common earth. Evidence for an asteroid strike.

There is no such thing as "under the earth."

Flood waters also came from there.

Question begging plus - came from where?

Obvious conclusion: there may be a connection.

You are relying on current states to support your silly different states past ideology.

Hilarious!

Also ancient history, and the absolute ignorance of science on the matter either way.

So you admit your absolute ignorance of science,that is a start.

Using the word reality does not bring it any closer to your religion.

Projection.

I no longer have a religion - but I do find it telling how frequently creationists try to bring science down to the level of religion such that they then feel that they are on equal footing.

Ancient genetics is unknown.

Cop out.

What is your rationale - again, other than your desire for it to be so to prop up your failing beliefs - that what was presented was flawed?

I could just claim that the bible can be dismissed because words had different meanings back then - different definitions past - and our modern interpretation of the scrolls of Scripture are irredeemably flawed.

Prove me wrong.

IN a different nature they would have to be different to some extent.

Question begging fallacy yet again.

You merely assume what you need to be true. You've never presented any intelligence or sensible rationale, much less evidence, for your position. It is without merit. Plus different definitions past undermine your position.

You simply look at today and assume they were the same always.

You simply look at today's word usage and assume it was always the same. Different definitions past.

That is religion. Not evidence relating to the far past or origins.

You ignored/cannot understand the simple logic of same states always. Your made-up ideas are mere facade-saving nonsense.

 

[pitabread]

The answer you ignored was that nothing in contemporary history tells us that the basic realities and laws of physics were unlike they now are.

To which I responded, but how do you know that? To which you responded with a bunch of questions.

If you start answering questions with questions, then it suggests you don't have an answer.

 

[dad]

Question begging fallacy. You need to provide empirical support for your proposed timeline.

So do you, and all you have is belief in a same state past.

I do not accept that these events (flooding, mountain building, etc.) occurred in a prescribed temporal fashion, since we can see that they are ongoing and occur simultaneously.

No. We don't see that. We some tiny residual movements or actions. I didn't see an Everest pop up this month.

You seem to be proposing events that would have had dire consequences for the planet - how much energy, for example, would "rapid continental drift" taken, and how much heat would have been released?

Not much heat in the former nature. That is a feature of this nature, that we expect heat from great friction.

Let me make a prediction - Jehovah just turned off all physical 'laws' and constants - to include the creationist favorites the laws of thermodynamics - to accomplish his murderous tasks?

Your accusatory tone toward God betrays the bedrock for you belief system. If there was no laws as we know them, how or why could they be turned off?

Yes - iridium, common in asteroids, not so common earth. Evidence for an asteroid strike.

Says your religion. However flood waters also came from space.

There is no such thing as "under the earth."

Sure...it is all on the surface!?

You are relying on current states to support your silly different states past ideology.

False. Just because some layers were laid down i the former state does not mean they would be that way now in this one! Ridiculous.

I no longer have a religion - but I do find it telling how frequently creationists try to bring science down to the level of religion such that they then feel that they are on equal footing.

Wrong. Not all beliefs are equal at all.

I could just claim that the bible can be dismissed because words had different meanings back then - different definitions past - and our modern interpretation of the scrolls of Scripture are irredeemably flawed.

You could...and maybe someone might care.

You merely assume what you need to be true. You've never presented any intelligence or sensible rationale, much less evidence, for your position. It is without merit. Plus different definitions past undermine your position.

You merely assume the same nature in the past that your belief system needs to be true. You've never presented any intelligence or sensible rationale, much less evidence, for your position. It is without merit. Plus different definitions past undermine your position.

 

[dad]

To which I responded, but how do you know that? To which you responded with a bunch of questions.

If you start answering questions with questions, then it suggests you don't have an answer.

Looks like the issue got lost in the weeds. If you see some reason contemporary history shows a different nature, just post the goods.