Why is Christ not dead / in Hell

[Kaon]

We have access to almost anything today; The Most High isn't preventing any knowledge. He speaks through more than a canon made by men of ecumenical authority.

Otherwise, we may as well praise the Pharisee again and be lost.

 

[EmSw]

He was wounded because he was hated. Just like the OT said he would be in Isaiah.

Isaiah 53:5 says He was wounded for our transgressions. That is what Isaiah says, not because He was hated.

 

[marineimaging]

I give up. Where does it say Jesus took all of our sins to hell?

Wrong bible. Look again. You will find it. Oh, and pray before you look for it. Having an earnest heart and true desire to find the truth will help tremendously in looking for it..., yourself.

 

[RDKirk]

The full price of sin is either endless death or endless torture (that being the price WE pay).

No, that's only you saying so, and you're questioning why what Jesus has done does not fit your determination of what reality should be.

You'd be better off accepting what scripture says is the reality of what happened as what was effective reality.

There are two deaths, and Jesus paid the price to resurrect us from the first death. Our faith saves us from the second death.

 

[bling]

Jesus never said his death was an atoning sacrifice or some sort of payment. That speculation came later in the new Gospel about Jesus.


Jesus showed that faith is he only requirement for salvation.

Not quite true.
Matt. 20:28 just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
The word "for" in the Greek most likely means "payment for" since ransom is a payment. The question is who the kidnapper was who was paid the ransom? (look at my pervious post).

 

[RDKirk]

If Jesus paid the penalty of physical dying for us, why do we still die physically?

He paid a penalty that would have left us permanently physically dead. Before Jesus' death, all the dead remained dead without hope of resurrection.

 

[bling]

Wrong bible. Look again. You will find it. Oh, and pray before you look for it. Having an earnest heart and true desire to find the truth will help tremendously in looking for it..., yourself.

Jesus said "it is finished" before His actual physical death and only went to the place of the dead (translated sometimes as "hell") after Christ's death on the cross, but it does not say: "Christ carried all our sins to hell", but talks about preaching in hell to those who died.

 

[Landon Caeli]

Isaiah 53:5 says He was wounded for our transgressions. That is what Isaiah says, not because He was hated.

And that might matter to someone for whatever reason, and that's fine.

...Why you asked a question you apparently knew the answer to seems odd however.

 

[bling]

He paid a penalty that would have left us permanently physically dead. Before Jesus' death, all the dead remained dead without hope of resurrection.

Where does it say in scripture: "all the dead remained dead without hope of resurrection.", since God was God of those who were dead, meaning they still lived somewhere?

 

[RDKirk]

Where does it say in scripture: "all the dead remained dead without hope of resurrection.", since God was God of those who were dead, meaning they still lived somewhere?

Jesus was the first of any man born of woman resurrected to eternal life. Without that having happened, there would be no hope of anyone being resurrected to eternal life.

And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy.-- Colossians 1:18

And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins. Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost. -- 1 Corinthians 15

 

[AlexDTX]

He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction... (2 Thessalonians 1)

Yes, their punishment will be to give them what they wanted: everlasting death, aka, the second death.

 

[marineimaging]

Jesus said "it is finished" before His actual physical death and only went to the place of the dead (translated sometimes as "hell") after Christ's death on the cross, but it does not say: "Christ carried all our sins to hell", but talks about preaching in hell to those who died.

First of all I used to be one of those who needed all the answers to fit into a nice and tidy bundle before I would board the train. No more. I have come to accept that I will never know enough to be rewarded with salvation. That said, even though the idea that he went to hell is widely debated, until it is proven to be wrong I will follow a teaching that stands to reason and is not contradicted in scripture. This is not contradicted in scripture and furthermore, what I consider very clear is that Jesus died for our sins taking the punishment that we deserve and was buried and rose from the dead. That would indicate that the sins we bear, again, which He took upon his shoulders, were deposited in hell where they belong. Notwithstanding, let's say that Jesus didn't go to leave our sins in hell. That doesn't change that he took the punishment for us and that in doing so He returned to give us the offer of eternal salvation if we believe in Him. The beauty of this is that I will know the truth when I die and that is all that is important to me.

 

[RDKirk]

First of all I used to be one of those who needed all the answers to fit into a nice and tidy bundle before I would board the train. No more. I have come to accept that I will never know enough to be rewarded with salvation..

The most important point in this thread and of most of the threads of these forums.

 

[Der Alte]

I give up. Where does it say Jesus took all of our sins to hell?

Jesus did not take all our sins to hell since Jesus did not go to hell. Unless by hell people mean simply the grave.
.....I think many people think this verse is talking about Jesus going to hell.

1 Peter 3:18-20
(18) For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
(19) By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
(20) Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.​

"spirits in prison" does not refer to "hell." "Hell" is never called "prison" in the Bible and "prison" is never called "hell." If Jesus was preaching to dead spirits in hell, how is it that the only people saved were Noah and his family who were not dead in hell but alive on the earth when they were saved?
.....What does prison refer to in 1 Peter 3:19? In Luk 4:18 Jesus, quoting Isaiah 3:22, announces His earthly ministry.

Luke 4:18
(18) The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,​

Jesus' ministry did not include going to hell and preaching. The word translated "captives" literally means "prisoners of war."

 

[RDKirk]

Then Jesus had nothing to do with keeping us from eternal death, right?

Salvation from eternal death lies in faith in Jesus and in nothing else. So, then, Jesus has everything to do with keeping us from eternal death.

 

[bling]

First of all I used to be one of those who needed all the answers to fit into a nice and tidy bundle before I would board the train. No more. I have come to accept that I will never know enough to be rewarded with salvation. That said, even though the idea that he went to hell is widely debated, until it is proven to be wrong I will follow a teaching that stands to reason and is not contradicted in scripture. This is not contradicted in scripture and furthermore, what I consider very clear is that Jesus died for our sins taking the punishment that we deserve and was buried and rose from the dead. That would indicate that the sins we bear, again, which He took upon his shoulders, were deposited in hell where they belong. Notwithstanding, let's say that Jesus didn't go to leave our sins in hell. That doesn't change that he took the punishment for us and that in doing so He returned to give us the offer of eternal salvation if we believe in Him. The beauty of this is that I will know the truth when I die and that is all that is important to me.

You might read my post 196, but that does not address atonement fully. Atonement is one of those things much better experienced than explained. I could write a book on atonement and still do not feel I fully understand it. God does not "punish or see to the punishment of the innocent". God forgave your sins.

 

[Landon Caeli]

Jesus did not take all our sins to hell since Jesus did not go to hell. Unless by hell people mean simply the grave.
.....I think many people think this verse is talking about Jesus going to hell.

1 Peter 3:18-20
(18) For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
(19) By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
(20) Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.​

"spirits in prison" does not refer to "hell." "Hell" is never called "prison" in the Bible and "prison" is never called "hell." If Jesus was preaching to dead spirits in hell, how is it that the only people saved were Noah and his family who were not dead in hell but alive on the earth when they were saved?
.....What does prison refer to in 1 Peter 3:19? In Luk 4:18 Jesus, quoting Isaiah 3:22, announces His earthly ministry.

Luke 4:18
(18) The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,​

Jesus' ministry did not include going to hell and preaching. The word translated "captives" literally means "prisoners of war."

Either way, as far as the OP is concerned, can we at least agree that what Jesus went through was sufficient enough? The bible said the LORD was pleased and satisfied -what else could be required beyond that?

 

[dreadnought]

So, a person is able to leave the lake of fire?

If he repents, I believe.

 

[RDKirk]

Either way, as far as the OP is concerned, can we at least agree that what Jesus went through was sufficient enough? The bible said the LORD was pleased and satisfied -what else could be required beyond that?

And anyone who proposes that was not sufficient simply doesn't understand the issue.

 

[Der Alte]

begin

Men told you which books were inspired; John said there isn't enough to contain what the Redeemer said.
Yet, canonicity has been a driving force in determining His Word - again, books put together by men.
No man has authority over me, and I am entitled to see ALL text and rightly judge what is the truth with my own God given mind and spirit.

end

Didn't answer my question, did you? Sure anybody can believe anything they want that doesn't make it scripture.
.....The LDS have added a whole book to the Bible and called it scripture. You going to consider those scripture too? God inspired the prophets and disciples to write the scripture and I'm sure He ensured that we have the scripture in the Bible He intended to be in the canon.