Why I Think Christmas is Not Biblical (Please read OP before posting).

[Kaon]

Which shows a double standard because Jesus never told his disciples to write a Bible and only follow it.

That isn't a double standard, it is a circumstance. The Disciples were charged with spreading the Word of God to everyone who would hear it; they (as humans) chose the vector.


And, it is a deflection from the fact that no one has stated one place where Christmas was listed by the Word of God Himself as a holy day for us to celebrate.

You are making false equivalencies; the disciples were directly told to spread the Word of God. Name one place where there is an insinuation of a directive for us to follow or observe the birthday of Christ.

 

[Eloy Craft]

Well, then why would you risk the harm of celebrating a non-sanctioned day so close to paganism?

Koan, what harm is risked? Who decides what is not Holy?what is too close to Paganism and how is that boundary determined?

 

[Natsumi Lam]

Psychics also love Christmas, too. The question is.... why?

Because it falls on one of the most powerful..in the minds of some... winter solstice.

 

[Kaon]

Koan, what harm is risked? Who decides what is not Holy?what is too close to Paganism and how is that boundary determined?

The harm is paganism, fornicating with other God's (knowingly or unknowingly), and pollution of the entire lot.

The Word of God decides what isn't holy, but He also expects you to judge correctly the spirit and fruit of everything.

You want to celebrate a day that alleges to be the birth of Christ, but neither Christ nor the Word of God ever mentioned His birth day, let alone say to celebrate it. Yet, pagans and heathens celebrated the Day Christians adopted as the birth of Christ - celebrated hundreds of years before the Church ecumenical powers added the Day to holy days of God. It wasn't for Christ, it was for a sun god.

How could you ask what is the harm? You think other Christians are wasting their time trying to opine about Christmas with such opposition? Most of us "God haters" vehemently celebrated Christmas, and likely also used the same arguments you did in order to rationalize our practices.

But, as I said, I am not going to try to convince adults to believe anything. I said exactly what I meant several times; I didn't write a "dissertations" to responses just to have to parrot the same thing, or to play a role/aimlessly debate while at the same time being in the camp of a God hater from my own alleged brethren. If it isn't Chiristian holiday history, it is promoting obedience to God that get that label.

 

[Eloy Craft]

he harm is paganism, fornicating with other God's (knowingly or unknowingly), and pollution of the entire lot.

Christ didn't leave us orphans. For me, paganism is not something to be feared in the slightest.

The Word of God decides what isn't holy, but He also expects you to judge correctly the spirit and fruit of everything.

Jesus instituted a Church to decide . Decisicions only happen when people make them. The second part of your answer implies that any one can decide what is not Holy. So that mans no one is.

You want to celebrate a day that alleges to be the birth of Christ, but neither Christ nor the Word of God ever mentioned His birth day, let alone say to celebrate it. Yet, pagans and heathens celebrated the Day Christians adopted as the birth of Christ - celebrated hundreds of years before the Church ecumenical powers added the Day to holy days of God. It wasn't for Christ, it was for a sun god.

Jesus was born. The bible reveals that. Simeon the Prophet and Anna the Prophetess sure celebrated the birth day of Our Savior. Not to mention the Wise men and the Angels in heaven and the shepards in the fields.
Luke 2
28 Simeon took him in his arms and praised God, saying,

29 “Master, now you are dismissing your servant in peace,
according to your word;
30 for my eyes have seen your salvation,
31 which you have prepared in the presence of all peoples,
32 a light for revelation to the Gentiles
and for glory to your people Israel.”



38 At that moment she came, and began to praise God and to speak about the child to all who were looking for the redemption of Jerusalem.

How could you ask what is the harm? You think other Christians are wasting their time trying to opine about Christmas with such opposition? Most of us "God haters" vehemently celebrated Christmas, and likely also used the same arguments you did in order to rationalize our practices.

I haven't the slightest fear of being harmed by ancient myth. I'm not ignorant of it either. The symbols of pagan myth have been converted to Christ since The first proto-Gospel in Genesis. The serpents tail that it swallows turns into a foot and crushes it's head. No more thinking that time is a cyclic phenomenon. Revealed is what causes history to repeat. Why do you fear Paganism?

But, as I said, I am not going to try to convince adults to believe anything. I said exactly what I meant several times; I didn't write a "dissertations" to responses just to have to parrot the same thing, or to play a role/aimlessly debate while at the same time being in the camp of a God hater from my own alleged brethren. If it isn't Chiristian holiday history, it is promoting obedience to God that get that label.

I'm sorry that you feel that way.Koan,

 

[AnnaDeborah]

When I was saying unbelievers I was referring to atheists/agnostics who celebrate Christmas. In other words, please show me where I said that certain Christians are unbelievers. If I said certain believers or Christians are unbelievers, I will be happy to edit my post.

You stated "Traditional churches is a collection of believers and unbelievers worshiping God together. But what fellowship does light have with darkness?"

I do not know any atheist or agnostic who worships God or who would claim to be part of the church. Such action would be ridiculous. Why would anyone 'worship' a God they didn't believe in?! Church is the family of believers, the body of Christ. By stating that church is a collection of believers and unbelievers 'worshipping God together', you are stating that some members of the family are not actually part of the family.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You stated "Traditional churches is a collection of believers and unbelievers worshiping God together. But what fellowship does light have with darkness?"

I do not know any atheist or agnostic who worships God or who would claim to be part of the church. Such action would be ridiculous. Why would anyone 'worship' a God they didn't believe in?! Church is the family of believers, the body of Christ. By stating that church is a collection of believers and unbelievers 'worshipping God together', you are stating that some members of the family are not actually part of the family.

So no person at a church has ever had people sitting in the church that has not visited that church to accept Jesus and or no person has kept going to that church every week (month after month or year after year) who does not accept Jesus and who does repent of their sins? A person needs to repent or they will perish. Many go to a church every week to hear the sermon and sometimes even praise God, but they do not respond to the altar call yet (or even at all). They did not accept Jesus yet. They are still an unbeliever if they do not accept Christ.

 

[salt-n-light]

I strive not to celebrate any holiday based now on Romans 12:2.

That's cool.

You have that freedom not to celebrate anything, just like you have the freedom not to eat anything, or do anything.

Although odd decision to make out of only one scripture that doesn't state anything about holidays nor anything related to it. But again, you have that freedom to.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You have that freedom not to celebrate anything, just like you have the freedom not to eat anything, or do anything.

Although odd decision to make out of only one scripture that doesn't state anything about holidays nor anything related to it.

No. Do you think Christians can celebrate God in the nude? There is a church that does that. Do they have a liberty in Christ do that? Surely not.

Besides, you cannot remove the bad things out of Christmas that are unbiblical. You cannot remove the Black Friday fights tied to Christmas, you cannot remove the compelled giving (a violation of 2 Corinthians 9:7) that focuses on materialism and greed (by receiving and buying more than you can afford to compete with other family members in their giving), you cannot remove parents lying to their children about Santa, you cannot remove the Christmas tree that sounds like a violation in just reading Jeremiah 10:2-4.

People are going to violate Scripture as a part of this holiday. Your participating in this holiday in some form shows your approval of that. Unless you don't have a problem with the things I mentioned. If that is the case, then I would suggest you ask God by prayer to show you (if you are open to hearing the truth or in the event that you may be wrong).

 

[salt-n-light]

No. Do you think Christians can celebrate God in the nude? You cannot remove the bad things out of Christmas that are unbiblical. You cannot remove the Black Friday fights tied to Christmas, you cannot remove the compelled giving (a violation of 2 Corinthians 9:7), you cannot remove parents lying to their children about Santa, you cannot remove the Christmas tree that sounds like a violation in just reading Jeremiah 10:2-4.

Yes, I do celebrate God in the nude, in the shower when I sing along with some gospel music. And also whenever I get married and have sex, I will also be nude and unashamed in front of my husband. Also if I have to see a gynecologist, I have to be exposed down there for them to do their job. Mammograms, my boobies are out. So all about context.

Black Friday is only a holiday in the US, and have nothing to do with belief nor Christmas, nor even Thanksgiving but economics. I can't control other people's choices when it comes to Christmas either. But I rather use any opportunity I can get to spread the gospel, without compromising my own standing with God. It's beyond " don't do this, don't do that" it's "why am I doing it, and how to go about it". It takes understanding the Word in it's totally, and not just taking one and making it a hard rule.

You chose to do it by not celebrating, and that's fine, don't need to defend yourself.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Because it falls on one of the most powerful..in the minds of some... winter solstice.

Right, which is why we should be ye holy (1 Peter 1:16), and separate (2 Corinthians 6:17) so they do not think we are also celebrating such a day. For we are told in Scripture to abstain from having any appearance of evil (1 Thessalonians 5:22).

 

[Natsumi Lam]

Right, which is why we should be ye holy (1 Peter 1:16), and separate (2 Corinthians 6:17) so they do not think we are also celebrating such a day. For we are told in Scripture to abstain from having any appearance of evil (1 Thessalonians 5:22).

You asked about why psychics value this holiday .

I answered why.

What do these verses have to do with why psychics value that time of year.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You asked about why psychics value this holiday .

I answered why.

What do these verses have to do with why psychics value that time of year.

You didn’t understand my recent response in what I was trying to say with Scripture. What about being holy and separate? The Bible tells us to be holy and separate. How exactly do you see those verses?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yes, I do celebrate God in the nude, in the shower when I sing along with some gospel music. And also whenever I get married and have sex, I will also be nude and unashamed in front of my husband. Also if I have to see a gynecologist, I have to be exposed down there for them to do their job. Mammograms, my boobies are out. So all about context.

Black Friday is only a holiday in the US, and have nothing to do with belief nor Christmas, nor even Thanksgiving but economics. I can't control other people's choices when it comes to Christmas either. But I rather use any opportunity I can get to spread the gospel, without compromising my own standing with God. It's beyond " don't do this, don't do that" it's "why am I doing it, and how to go about it". It takes understanding the Word in it's totally, and not just taking one and making it a hard rule.

You chose to do it by not celebrating, and that's fine, don't need to defend yourself.

Okay. First, TMI. Too much personal information I didn’t need to know.

Second, I was talking in context to weekly fellowship with other believers. We are told not to forsake the assembling with other believers. So again, would you go to a bible study in the nude with many other believers?

Three, I will have to address the rest of what you have written later. I gotta run.

Blessings to you in the Lord.

 

[Natsumi Lam]

You didn’t understand my recent response in what I was trying to say with Scripture. What about being holy and separate? The Bible tells us to be holy and separate. How exactly do you see those verses?

I see it says to be holy and seperate.

We were talking about pagans and why they celebrate the holiday.

So the verses are not applicable to the subject.

 

[Kerensa]

Jason, the verses you keep quoting about being holy and separate and "not conformed to this world" are not, in their context, talking specifically about which holidays or festivals to keep, or not. Christmas hadn't even been invented at the time Paul and the other NT writers were writing, only a few decades after Jesus, so how could they have been talking about Christmas? There are many ways in which followers of Christ might interpret being "separate" or "unspotted from the world" or "not conformed", from going into a monastery or hermitage, to living an ordinary life in the world yet not of it. There is no one single definite way of interpreting any of those verses and they cannot logically be used as an absolute argument against celebrating Christmas or other festivals when, in context, they say nothing about that.

(And as multiple posters have already pointed out to you, Jer. 10:2-4 is about carving and decorating idols to worship, NOT about Christmas trees — which again, weren't invented at the time Jeremiah was writing. Context is vital!!)

As salt-n-light says, you've made your choice not to celebrate Christmas and you don't need to defend it. That is what keeps this discussion dragging on. Nobody has said you are wrong to choose not to celebrate Christmas or that you don't have a right to that choice. You do, absolutely. It's just that you keep on and on insisting that it's not merely a matter of your own interpretation (which in fact it is), but that Christmas itself is indefensible and cannot be separated from its supposedly inherent evils, and therefore all other Christians who do celebrate it are wrong to do so. You're not going to get anywhere with fallacious arguments like that. Those of us who do find Christmas to be a special and holy time for us as Christians will keep right on celebrating it as such, and it really is up to God — not you — to decide whether or not this is offensive to Him.

 

[Kaon]

Christ didn't leave us orphans. For me, paganism is not something to be feared in the slightest.
Jesus instituted a Church to decide . Decisicions only happen when people make them. The second part of your answer implies that any one can decide what is not Holy. So that mans no one is.
Jesus was born. The bible reveals that. Simeon the Prophet and Anna the Prophetess sure celebrated the birth day of Our Savior. Not to mention the Wise men and the Angels in heaven and the shepards in the fields.
Luke 2
28 Simeon took him in his arms and praised God, saying,

29 “Master, now you are dismissing your servant in peace,
according to your word;
30 for my eyes have seen your salvation,
31 which you have prepared in the presence of all peoples,
32 a light for revelation to the Gentiles
and for glory to your people Israel.”



38 At that moment she came, and began to praise God and to speak about the child to all who were looking for the redemption of Jerusalem.



I haven't the slightest fear of being harmed by ancient myth. I'm not ignorant of it either. The symbols of pagan myth have been converted to Christ since The first proto-Gospel in Genesis. The serpents tail that it swallows turns into a foot and crushes it's head. No more thinking that time is a cyclic phenomenon. Revealed is what causes history to repeat. Why do you fear Paganism?
I'm sorry that you feel that way.Koan,

O.k.

Kaon*

 

[salt-n-light]

Okay. First, TMI. Too much personal information I didn’t need to know.

Second, I was talking in context to weekly fellowship with other believers. We are told not to forsake the assembling with other believers. So again, would you go to a bible study in the nude with many other believers?

Three, I will have to address the rest of what you have written later. I gotta run.

Blessings to you in the Lord.

That’s not TMI, that’s common knowledge. People have sex in marriage ,and shower, and have check-ups. I guess not so common.

Why would I go nude, and why that have to do with Christmas?

And why so much effort to address people that are not even against your choice? Maybe the issue for you is less about Christmas and more about self-pride.

 

[Kaon]

Why has no one stated a bible verse where the Most High God told us to celebrate the birth of Christ, where the Word of God Himself is noted to celebrate His birth day, or even a mention of when His birthday is?

That would clear up a lot of these pages - and properly align the God haters and truth.



Can no one point to one place where the Word of God Himself gave the date of His birth, or told us to celebrate His birth date?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

That’s not TMI, that’s common knowledge. People have sex in marriage ,and shower, and have check-ups. I guess not so common.

Why would I go nude, and why that have to do with Christmas?

And why so much effort to address people that are not even against your choice? Maybe the issue for you is less about Christmas and more about self-pride.

I am aware of the realities of life, you just didn't need to give me personal details about your self in regards to your own life like that to make the point. I just would never say that personally (and I would have spoken in generic terms of people in every day life situations to get that point across), but that is just me. Something like that is too personal to say on the internet for me. But that is your choice to speak as you will. Just know that if you are speaking with me: I would prefer that you would not share that kind of thing because I feel it is inappropriate.

Anyways, my point is that there are people who go to CHURCH fellowship with many believers and not just one's own spouse and they are nude. This is obviously inappropriate and not Christian. You would not go to a church like that because it is not biblical to do that and it violates basic morality, as well. My point is that Christmas is no different because it is also unbiblical in certain ways and violates morality if you were to partake in the holiday to it's fullest extent (or if you were to go all out). In other words, somebody can say they are going to go to Mardi Gras but they were not going to go nude, etc. but that still does not change the problem of others going nude. One is still condoning others being publicly nude if a person is celebrating Mardi Gras with them. Christmas and parents lying to their children is a part of Christmas. Black Friday fights is a part of Christmas (Yes, I realize it is mostly the US), but the reality of this holiday still cannot be changed. It's a part of the holiday. People do that as a result of this holiday. To celebrate in this holiday when one knows people are always going to lie and fight each year on Christmas is telling of the kind of fruit that this holiday produces. A person has to turn a blind eye to these things in order to celebrate it; And for what? To celebrate Jesus or to celebrate so as to have a good time?