Why does Paganism scare Christians?

[Zoness]

There aren't many religions that would earn a prize for religious tolerance so the Abrahamic ones are not alone. Often Buddhism is held up as super ecumenical and tolerant of other religions but even it has a mixed history there. We have our "only my form of Buddhism is true and everyone who practices a different version is going to Avici hell for millions of kalpas and then will be reborn as an animal " people too. There usually wasn't too much in the way of paganphobia though. Many forms of Buddhism even found ways to work in local gods or spirits as protectors of the Dharma.

I think people just assume Buddhism is ecumenical because belief in it is less compulsory than the claims made in Christianity and Islam. Most people don't think of it as asserting "believe X or go to hell!!" even though Buddhism and Hinduism don't always have a pretty history, like any religion.

 

[ContraMundum]

A common impression I get from many Christians concerning Paganism is that us pagans are a sex cult that loves to murder babies. Overall it is fear and confusion as it seems that so many Christians cannot handle the fact that Pagans exist and do not engage in Satanic activities, primarily because Pagans do not believe in Satan.
What are the perceptions you have on the Neo-Paganism movement?

I've never met a Christian who gives the neo-pagan movement a second thought. No one I know cares a hoot about it. I certainly don't.

 

[awitch]

I've never met a Christian who gives the neo-pagan movement a second thought. No one I know cares a hoot about it. I certainly don't.

There's certainly no reason why anyone should. We have no political influence, we don't cost taxpayers millions of dollars by proselytizing in schools or pushing for religious monuments or having tax-exempt houses of worship every other block. Our charity work leans towards environmental cleanup and the homeless instead of lobbying to deny rights to citizens, we don't fight the consensus of the scientific community, and that panic in the 80s turned out to be nothing but lies.

 

[Zoness]

There's certainly no reason why anyone should. We have no political influence, we don't cost taxpayers millions of dollars by proselytizing in schools or pushing for religious monuments or having tax-exempt houses of worship every other block. Our charity work leans towards environmental cleanup and the homeless instead of lobbying to deny rights to citizens, we don't fight the consensus of the scientific community, and that panic in the 80s turned out to be nothing but lies.

Awitch is correct on every point; nobody cares about Neopagans because Neopagans aren't actively manipulating the political landscape of their native countries.

 

[ContraMundum]

There's certainly no reason why anyone should. We have no political influence, we don't cost taxpayers millions of dollars by proselytizing in schools or pushing for religious monuments or having tax-exempt houses of worship every other block. Our charity work leans towards environmental cleanup and the homeless instead of lobbying to deny rights to citizens, we don't fight the consensus of the scientific community, and that panic in the 80s turned out to be nothing but lies.

Bitter much?

When neo-pagans can match the charity work of the church, come back and have a gripe about the politics of your nation, or your imagined fighting of consensus and all that other minority party publicity that you apparently think runs your country. If you think the church is that much of an influence, I've got a bridge to sell you. Hint: don't believe your own propaganda.

 

[ContraMundum]

Awitch is correct on every point; nobody cares about Neopagans because Neopagans aren't actively manipulating the political landscape of their native countries.

Neo-pagans have no influence because they have no real contribution to religion for the current age. Sorry to say it, but that's why paganism died the first time- there's just not enough truth or wisdom on offer that hasn't been surpassed by major religions already or wasn't already in their possession. What makes neo-pagans think society is now willing to accept something civilisation already rejected en masse?

 

[Zoness]

Neo-pagans have no influence because they have no real contribution to religion for the current age. Sorry to say it, but that's why paganism died the first time- there's just not enough truth or wisdom on offer that hasn't been surpassed by major religions already or wasn't already in their possession. What makes neo-pagans think society is now willing to accept something civilisation already rejected en masse?

That's why paganism died the first time? Not the mass extermination of it by Christians? I doubt that very much.

That said, Neopaganism itself is a very recent movement; barely older than 75 years for many branches so it has a long way to go before it will be considered in the same tier as other religions. It's not big on conversion, though so of course there will be limitations of its influence.

 

[Redac]

Neo-pagans have no influence because they have no real contribution to religion for the current age. Sorry to say it, but that's why paganism died the first time- there's just not enough truth or wisdom on offer that hasn't been surpassed by major religions already or wasn't already in their possession. What makes neo-pagans think society is now willing to accept something civilisation already rejected en masse?

Paganism didn't die out originally because people analyzed it and rejected it as insufficient; it was stamped out by Christian rulers. To quote one of your own lines back to you:

don't believe your own propaganda.

 

[awitch]

Neo-pagans have no influence because they have no real contribution to religion for the current age.

No, we have no political influence because we generally believe in the separation of church and state. Unlike people of many other religions, we don't expect everyone to be required by law to follow our personally chosen religious beliefs.

What makes neo-pagans think society is now willing to accept something civilisation already rejected en masse?

The Constitution.

 

[ContraMundum]

That's why paganism died the first time? Not the mass extermination of it by Christians? I doubt that very much.

Bodycount religion? Really? You're going to try that one out? LOL

Do yourself a favour. Put down whatever book you got that from and read the primary sources. Add to that a bit of common sense and independent critical thought and you'll soon work out that paganism died in different parts of the world mainly because of missionary activity, and not by mass extermination, which is frankly easily refuted by real, non-revisionist accepted history and doesn't make sense when you crunch the numbers. Populations remained about the same pre and post conversion to the Faith. If entire pagan populations were "exterminated", who would be left to comprise the Christians? It's just silly.

That said, Neopaganism itself is a very recent movement; barely older than 75 years for many branches so it has a long way to go before it will be considered in the same tier as other religions. It's not big on conversion, though so of course there will be limitations of its influence.

I see neo-paganism as basically a completely invented and very human religion for people who find Christianity, Islam and Judaism too hard and who basically don't think they need to change. I think most people feel that way that I know as well. I don't see it as having any real impact and pretty much believe it will disappear into the murky brew fallaciously called the New Age- which is so over and will die with the last of the hippies.

 

[ContraMundum]

No, we have no political influence because we generally believe in the separation of church and state. Unlike people of many other religions, we don't expect everyone to be required by law to follow our personally chosen religious beliefs.



The Constitution.

You realize you just contradicted yourself? "We don't believe in church and state but the State says...."

Nor is it logical that because the Constitution allows freedom of religion that automatically people will flock to it?

 

[morningstar2651]

Bitter much?

When neo-pagans can match the charity work of the church, come back and have a gripe about the politics of your nation, or your imagined fighting of consensus and all that other minority party publicity that you apparently think runs your country. If you think the church is that much of an influence, I've got a bridge to sell you. Hint: don't believe your own propaganda.

Disbelief in the scientific consensus on evolution and global warming were selling points of the Republican candidates in the 2012 election. It wasn't imaginary. It's real.

2012 Election: Where GOP Presidential Candidates Stand On Evolution (PHOTOS)

Thank you for reminding me of one of the many reasons I will never convert to Christianity. I'd rather burn in Hell for all eternity than sit in a pew next to someone who treats people the way you do.

 

[morningstar2651]

Bodycount religion? Really? You're going to try that one out? LOL

Do yourself a favour. Put down whatever book you got that from and read the primary sources. Add to that a bit of common sense and independent critical thought and you'll soon work out that paganism died in different parts of the world mainly because of missionary activity, and not by mass extermination, which is frankly easily refuted by real, non-revisionist accepted history and doesn't make sense when you crunch the numbers. Populations remained about the same pre and post conversion to the Faith. If entire pagan populations were "exterminated", who would be left to comprise the Christians? It's just silly.



I see neo-paganism as basically a completely invented and very human religion for people who find Christianity, Islam and Judaism too hard and who basically don't think they need to change. I think most people feel that way that I know as well. I don't see it as having any real impact and pretty much believe it will disappear into the murky brew fallaciously called the New Age- which is so over and will die with the last of the hippies.

Christianity is a completely invented religion for "very human" people who thought being a Jew was too hard. They cut the 613 commandments down to 10.

 

[morningstar2651]

You realize you just contradicted yourself? "We don't believe in church and state but the State says...."

Nor is it logical that because the Constitution allows freedom of religion that automatically people will flock to it?

Do you read these before you post them? This one made no sense. Please try again.

 

[ContraMundum]

Disbelief in the scientific consensus on evolution and global warming were selling points of the Republican candidates in the 2012 election. It wasn't imaginary. It's real.

2012 Election: Where GOP Presidential Candidates Stand On Evolution (PHOTOS)

But it's only meaningful in your imagination. Has your country stopped making scientific discoveries because people in power question currently evolutionary theory (or more likely, claim to do so to get votes)? No. Stop the hysteria.

Thank you for reminding me of one of the many reasons I will never convert to Christianity. I'd rather burn in Hell for all eternity than sit in a pew next to someone who treats people the way you do.

Nice. Bitter much? How come you have a Christian in your avatar then? Dee Snider has said he was a Christian before senators and many times since.

I think you just want Christians that do what you want them to- bow to you and shut up. Sorry I'm not bowing to you or tickling your ears. I tell it like it is. Judge me all you like. I've got plenty of friends and support int he real world.

 

[Sword of the Lord]

This sort of sets a double standard since the early church spent it's time killing pagans and professed to have a good god and now they creates lies about pagans and still call their god good. Astonishing really how double standards like these get set

Maybe Christian Forums isn't the best place for you then? See ya.

 

[ContraMundum]

Christianity is a completely invented religion for "very human" people who thought being a Jew was too hard. They cut the 613 commandments down to 10.

At least know what you're talking about before you post junk like that. Every theology I know of in Christianity understands the 10 commandments as a summary of the 613, and also understands that the 613 are not possible to follow in this day and age. Furthermore, Jesus raises the bar on the 613 and makes following His teaching much harder. Stuff like pray for you enemies, give people the shirt off your back, don't even look at a person with lustful intentions....pretty hard.

 

[ContraMundum]

Do you read these before you post them? This one made no sense. Please try again.

Makes perfect sense.

 

[morningstar2651]

Here is some "missionary work" that ContraMundum referred to.

Northern Crusades - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia The east Baltic world was transformed by military conquest: first the Livs, Latgallians and Estonians, then the Semigallians, Curonians, Prussians and the Finns underwent defeat, baptism, military occupation and sometimes extermination by groups of Danes, Germans and Swedes.

Forced conversion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia It is Our will that all the peoples who are ruled by the administration of Our Clemency shall practice that religion which the divine Peter the Apostle transmitted to the Romans....The rest, whom We adjudge demented and insane, shall sustain the infamy of heretical dogmas, their meeting places shall not receive the name of churches, and they shall be smitten first by divine vengeance and secondly by the retribution of Our own initiative"

Goa Inquisition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Capitulatio de partibus Saxoniae - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia If any one of the race of the Saxons hereafter concealed among them shall have wished to hide himself unbaptized, and shall have scorned to come to baptism and shall have wished to remain a pagan, let him be punished by death.

 

[morningstar2651]

Here is some "missionary work" that ContraMundum referred to.

Northern Crusades - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia The east Baltic world was transformed by military conquest: first the Livs, Latgallians and Estonians, then the Semigallians, Curonians, Prussians and the Finns underwent defeat, baptism, military occupation and sometimes extermination by groups of Danes, Germans and Swedes.

Forced conversion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia It is Our will that all the peoples who are ruled by the administration of Our Clemency shall practice that religion which the divine Peter the Apostle transmitted to the Romans....The rest, whom We adjudge demented and insane, shall sustain the infamy of heretical dogmas, their meeting places shall not receive the name of churches, and they shall be smitten first by divine vengeance and secondly by the retribution of Our own initiative"

Goa Inquisition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Capitulatio de partibus Saxoniae - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia If any one of the race of the Saxons hereafter concealed among them shall have wished to hide himself unbaptized, and shall have scorned to come to baptism and shall have wished to remain a pagan, let him be punished by death.