Why does God not just show himself?

[davedjy]

God relies on us?!? :LAUGH:

Exactly...He doesn't rely on us...but it pleases Him when we serve Him and are sold out completely for Him.

 

[Zeena]

Ther's only ONE who is pleasing to the Lord, and as we are covered by His Blood and His body God is pleased with us!

Philippians 3:9-11
And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith: 10That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; 11If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

God doesn't need us, He WANTS us!

 

[Calminian]

Exactly...He doesn't rely on us...but it pleases Him when we serve Him and are sold out completely for Him.

I think you are on the right track. Many christians speak of a blind faith or "free faith" but scripture actually puts it in the context of seeking. In fact the most famous faith verse of all states,

Heb. 11:6 And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.

Scripture is replete with commands to seek.

Now it is true that many in history have seen God's signs and wonders and yet refused to believe. Miracles don't guarantee anything. Good arguments don't guarantee anything. But it's false to say they never accomplish anything. Many in the O.T. and N.T. were converted through miracles. Many rejected Christ after seeing miracles, but let's not forget many believed because of them.

John 4:46 He came therefore again to Cana of Galilee where He had made the water wine. And there was a certain royal official, whose son was sick at Capernaum. 47 When he heard that Jesus had come out of Judea into Galilee, he went to Him, and was requesting Him to come down and heal his son; for he was at the point of death. 48 Jesus therefore said to him, “Unless you people see signs and wonders, you simply will not believe.” 49 The royal official said to Him, “Sir, come down before my child dies.” 50 Jesus said to him, “Go your way; your son lives.” The man believed the word that Jesus spoke to him, and he started off. 51 And as he was now going down, his slaves met him, saying that his son was living. 52 So he inquired of them the hour when he began to get better. They said therefore to him, “Yesterday at the seventh hour the fever left him.” 53 So the father knew that it was at that hour in which Jesus said to him, “Your son lives”; and he himself believed, and his whole household. 54 This is again a second sign that Jesus performed, when He had come out of Judea into Galilee.


When Paul reasoned at Mars Hill many rejected his arguments, but many others were persuaded. God uses good answers!

My point is there's a balance. God does not want blind faith which doesn't need to be sought. He wants us to seek. Seeking and blind faith are mutually exclusive.

And by the way, the whole idea of blind faith would have been foreign to the biblical writers, anyway. It's a modern notion that's crept into the church. Here's a great article by the great JP Holding.

Fallacious Faith
Correcting an All-too-Common Misconception

It's a must read for everyone, christian or non.

 

[davedjy]

Ther's only ONE who is pleasing to the Lord, and as we are covered by His Blood and His body God is pleased with us!


God doesn't need us, He WANTS us!

I agree w/the last part, that God wants us, but we are supposed to seek after God and be pleasing to Him! I'm not sure where it is, but it talks about touching the heart of God when we obey Him, and are pleasing to Him. This shouldn't be confused w/that other verse that says "all our righteousness is of filthy rags". Contextually, that just means that we could never be "good enough" to get into heaven on our own accord, and we are in need of a Savior to wash us of our sin so we can have eternal life and communion w/Jesus.

Ephesians 5:8-13

8For you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Live as children of light 9(for the fruit of the light consists in all goodness, righteousness and truth) 10and find out what pleases the Lord. 11Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.

I think you are on the right track. Many christians speak of a blind faith or "free faith" but scripture actually puts it in the context of seeking. In fact the most famous faith verse of all states,

Heb. 11:6 And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.

Scripture is replete with commands to seek.

Now it is true that many in history have seen God's signs and wonders and yet refused to believe. Miracles don't guarantee anything. Good arguments don't guarantee anything. But it's false to say they never accomplish anything. Many in the O.T. and N.T. were converted through miracles. Many rejected Christ after seeing miracles, but let's not forget many believed because of them.

John 4:46 He came therefore again to Cana of Galilee where He had made the water wine. And there was a certain royal official, whose son was sick at Capernaum. 47 When he heard that Jesus had come out of Judea into Galilee, he went to Him, and was requesting Him to come down and heal his son; for he was at the point of death. 48 Jesus therefore said to him, “Unless you people see signs and wonders, you simply will not believe.” 49 The royal official said to Him, “Sir, come down before my child dies.” 50 Jesus said to him, “Go your way; your son lives.” The man believed the word that Jesus spoke to him, and he started off. 51 And as he was now going down, his slaves met him, saying that his son was living. 52 So he inquired of them the hour when he began to get better. They said therefore to him, “Yesterday at the seventh hour the fever left him.” 53 So the father knew that it was at that hour in which Jesus said to him, “Your son lives”; and he himself believed, and his whole household. 54 This is again a second sign that Jesus performed, when He had come out of Judea into Galilee.


When Paul reasoned at Mars Hill many rejected his arguments, but many others were persuaded. God uses good answers!

My point is there's a balance. God does not want blind faith which doesn't need to be sought. He wants us to seek. Seeking and blind faith are mutually exclusive.

And by the way, the whole idea of blind faith would have been foreign to the biblical writers, anyway. It's a modern notion that's crept into the church. Here's a great article by the great JP Holding.

Fallacious Faith
Correcting an All-too-Common Misconception

It's a must read for everyone, christian or non.

Excellent examples! If we have blind faith...we will be very prone to fall away... I believe that is why it says "faith w/o works is dead". It's not that one "isn't saved", but we are saved by grace through faith, so we have to put that into action.

For those who are saved, and have His Holy Spirit...it isn't blind at all. That feeling of having the Holy Spirit inside of you, there's nothing like it in the whole world. The fact that nobody can take that joy and peace away...well, that is a rant in and of itself so I better stop.

 

[KCDAD]

God doesn't need us or want us... both of those concepts are not God-like at all. God loves. Get it out of your mind that God has any emptiness or lack that would cause a need or want. WE need and want. We lack what God is... Love Truth, Mercy, Justice... God .... just is.

 

[salida]

Ymeg--

God has shown himself in his creation alone. Its His fingerprints. But man chooses to ingore it. Oh, you want the facts. If one were to chose a religion based on intellect alone it whould be christianity. Because there is only so much room on this page, I suggest you read Examine the Evidence by Muncaster (converted from an athiest to a christian). And A Case For A Creator and A case for Christ by Lee Strobel (an athiest but now a christian). AND- God Fingerprints - its actually almost a science book on why a creator has to exist. One has to outright ignore it by plain denial only.

If your serious and sincere, you will do your own research and stop burning animals and whatever else you are doing. These books have objective facts in them.

 

[KCDAD]

I am a very devoted atheist; burning bibles, killing kittens, eating children's souls etc, and I have always wanted to know why your god does not just come out and say believe in me? Doing this he could get well over 98-99% of the population to change their beliefs. Not doing so would seem to be holding in the holy spirit which is a sin right?

I am curious about what you think this would look like? Are you picturing ET or something like in Star Trek The Final Frontier with the "god" that tricked Spock's brother into stealing the Enterprise?
Don't you already know what is right and wrong? Don't you already know what is true or not? (Maybe not specific ideas of right and wrong or truth, but a general sense that I should or should not do or say something...) I would argue that God has already shown "himself" to us in many, many ways.

 

[seajoy]

Mocking other Christians is against Christ. Hope you all feel better about yourselves and have a reason for it when you apppear in front of your maker.

Fortunately, because of Christ and His shed blood all of our sins are forgiven, even the ones that fellow Christians do to each other.

If I have hurt you, I am sorry. Try not to judge everyone too quickly. You've hardly gotten to know us.

 

[Calminian]

If god created the universe, rose from the dead, cured blind ect. I'm sure he could come down and tell me he is real. That would be nothing for him.

He certainly could, Ymeg. God at any moment could come down and force you to believe in him. But He is a God that requires you to seek. That's not my opinion, that's straight from scripture. He's given you enough evidence so that you should at least know to seek (Romans 1:18-31). In essence, He's already sought you. But you seem to have a tendency to lay back with your fingers crossed behind your head, felling you have no obligation to get up and look. For those, God will give a way out. He will grant your desire not to find him. But for the rest:

Matt. 7:7 Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. 8 “For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened.

 

[Zeena]

No, no..

CIRCULAR reasoning would be that the world revolves..

AROUND YOU! =P

 

[Zeena]

Not at all!

But the world DOES revolve around One GREATER than us!

JESUS!

And to Glorify HIS Name in such a manner I am NO LONGER being arrogant and stuck in circular reasoning logic =P

If you say YOU are this or that, it is circular!
If God says it, it's linear

 

[seajoy]

It would mean we believed in a Divine Creator, that in spite of our sinfulness, saved us anyway.

You are only condemning yourself with such talk. It is not knowledge in Christians or being Christian that you seek, it is the pleasure that you've somehow tried to outsmart us with your drivel.

If you have sincere questions, we'd be happy to answer them.

 

[seajoy]

For you it will be, if you don't take God's free gift of Salvation through Christ before your last day on this earth.

We tell you these things so you too can be saved...we care about your soul. We don't say these things as a "nana nana booboo...I got the last word in."

May God open your heart

 

[Zeena]

I have MANY other things I could be doing..

FUN things!

Instead the Lord decides to come here to witness to the lost.. OUT OF LOVE FOR YOU!

HE LIVES!

 

[marshamarshamarsha]

God gave us senses ( sight, hearing, touch ect. ) and a logical mind to use in our lives to make decisions.

Why won't He use ANY of these things He gave us,
to give us the joy of KNOWING He exisits ?

I can understand having to have faith that Mary
was a virgin or any number of OTHER things...
but having to have FAITH that GOD EVEN EXISTS ?

Does anyone have a logical idea as to WHY He would
set things up this way ?

 

[marshamarshamarsha]

Also...Some say that if God were to prove that He exists, it would eliminate our ' free will ' to choose.
I don't understand this, because in order ' to choose '..
one must have two things to choose FROM.

>>Adam and Eve had a choice... and it didn't eliminate
THEIR ' free will '.

 

[marshamarshamarsha]

Also..Some say that if God were to prove He exists,
it would eliminate our ability to have ' free choice '.

But to have ' free choice ', one needs two things to choose from.

Adam and Eve had proof of God's existance
and still had ' free choice ' !

 

[KCDAD]

Also..Some say that if God were to prove He exists,
it would eliminate our ability to have ' free choice '.

But to have ' free choice ', one needs two things to choose from.

Adam and Eve had proof of God's existance
and still had ' free choice ' !

marshax3,
if you believe you will get all the evidence you need, and if you don't, no amount of evidence will convince you. I know this seems silly, but if you think about it, it is true about the news we hear or read, interpretations of history, or any other social interaction we have.
Liberals believe CNN is fair and balanced, conservatives believe Fox News is fair and balanced, and the reality is neither is. They have their own preconceived ideas of reality and report the news based on those notions. We accept their information based on our preconceptions about what is real.

 

[marshamarshamarsha]

I was a strong believer for many years, and during that time...I felt there was ' evidence ' of God's existance
everywhere ! When you ' believe ', it causes you to
interpret things according to your belief !
Now...I am standing back and looking at all the things I
have believed, as a Christian, and wondering WHY God
would even EXPECT me to believe these things ( due to
how He made us psychologically ) without any definite
proof whatsoever to ANY of our senses !
Quite truthfully, I WANT to be able to believe wholeheartedly.
I'm sure hoping that the whole idea of God hasn't been
created by ' all of us wanting so much for Him to exist ' !
But I want to know the real truth. Not the ' feel-good '
truth. So I must go back to my very beginnings and take
a better look at all the ideas I originally accepted.
I'm doing this now, and running into LOTS of things that just don't make sense ( like the question above ).

 

[visionary]

God does provide living proof, or He would not have invited you to meet with Him. Rev 3:20 When He knocks at your door of your heart, let Him in, and He will talk with you. Can not get any more real than that. I would prepare myself to meet the Holy One of Israel, who is just as real as the day Moses met Him, just as real as the day that Abraham greeted Him and invited Him in to visit, just as real as the day that Isaiah cried out "Woe is me for I am undone".

God would love you meet you. He just doesn't want you to die from the shock.