Why does God identify Himself as a Father ?

[food4thought]

This will inevitably turn into a kind of "chicken or egg" debate.

Those who believe that God is sovereign over all history, that He has accurately revealed Himself to people through the ages as He saw fit, and that Scripture is inspired, authoritative, and inerrant (in the original autographs) will generally argue that God designed human history to be almost universally patriarchal (for whatever reason) and thus revealed Himself to us as the male.

Those who believe that God (if there really is one) has revealed himself in a phenomenological way, that people have written of God as they understood "Him" throughout the ages, and that Scripture is really no more than a great epic story about God will generally argue that society in the ancient near east was predominantly patriarchal, and thus "scripture" reflects that bias in describing God as male.

So... did mankind create our concept of God as they wrote what we now consider Scripture? Or did God create mankind and then inspire certain people He sovereignly chose to write Scripture?

I believe the Bible is revealed truth, and it is obvious which of those two choices the Bible teaches. So why did He choose this way? Only God knows... but I believe in faith that God knows all things, and He chose to do things in such a way as to bring about the greatest possible good in eternity without violating the necessity of free choice in order for love to be real.

 

[revrobor]

God is our Heavenly Father, identified as a male, not a female.

God is Spirit, so why the need to designate a human gender ?

Anything feminine was created by a masculine God---so why specify ?

Since this question is not answered in the Bible and you are asking people who don't know the answer but rely on conjecture I suggest you ask God Himself.

 

[DeadlyScimitars]

The man might have the ultimate authority in your household, but that is not the case in the majority of households. LOL.
And btw, a man can operate without a woman and a woman can operate without a man. Take a look at the millions of one parent families, and the millions of single people, and the millions of widows/widowers and celibate individuals. It's silly to make out that men or women can't survive without the opposite gender.

I agree with you that it may not be the case nowadays with authority...but that is how it was designed.
And yes, they CAN operate without each other but my point was that it is so much better for a family to have both instead of the children wondering where there dad/mom is. I come from one that didn't have both and if I had had both godly parents then I think it would have been better.

 

[DeadlyScimitars]

This will inevitably turn into a kind of "chicken or egg" debate.

Those who believe that God is sovereign over all history, that He has accurately revealed Himself to people through the ages as He saw fit, and that Scripture is inspired, authoritative, and inerrant (in the original autographs) will generally argue that God designed human history to be almost universally patriarchal (for whatever reason) and thus revealed Himself to us as the male.

Those who believe that God (if there really is one) has revealed himself in a phenomenological way, that people have written of God as they understood "Him" throughout the ages, and that Scripture is really no more than a great epic story about God will generally argue that society in the ancient near east was predominantly patriarchal, and thus "scripture" reflects that bias in describing God as male.

So... did mankind create our concept of God as they wrote what we now consider Scripture? Or did God create mankind and then inspire certain people He sovereignly chose to write Scripture?

I believe the Bible is revealed truth, and it is obvious which of those two choices the Bible teaches. So why did He choose this way? Only God knows... but I believe in faith that God knows all things, and He chose to do things in such a way as to bring about the greatest possible good in eternity without violating the necessity of free choice in order for love to be real.

Though this may be true...I think it is wholesome and mind challenging to discuss multiple viewpoints on this. To encounter new possibilities in thought process is very fulfilling to my interests. There always will be a simple, universal agreement to an ideal but to discuss different views is also very uplifting and challenging!

 

[DeadlyScimitars]

The only thing wrong with that theory is that Adam and Eve were created equal and Adam did not have authority over Eve. That was her punishment for sinning.
Genesis 3:16
"To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."

Hmm..my theory never stated different.
I 100% agree with you. But I guess I was really referring to after the Fall.
Their family did not begin until after the Fall. But yes, I agree that they were created equal. Eve was created as a suitable helper for him. So..yes agreed.

 

[Norah63]

After the op, I notice how the thread changed, from your question to 'our' thoughts.
Rebellion is in man and can only be cured by a trip to the cross. Otherwise the scriptures becomes useless, because we discern with an unregenerated mind. Our human ego worries about things that the word never tells to worry about. I choose to be a Mary not a Martha.
Lord help us to just believe your Word and not try to figure a way out!

 

[rgleason]

Matthew 6:9; 15
9After this manner therefore pray you: Our Father which are in heaven, Hallowed be your name. 10Your kingdom come, Your will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. 11Give us this day our daily bread. 12And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. 13And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For your is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen. 14For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: 15But if you forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Basics/god_is_a_trinity.htm
God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit.

 

[rgleason]

You are assuming that spirits don't also have gender. It is specific in the Hebrew for example that their are both male and female 'evil spirits', ie 'ruach rah (male)' and 'ruach ra'ah (feminine)'.

He created Adam as male and took Adamah (female form later named Eve) out of him, not created directly. He put the female under submission to the male as He is male just as we are in submission to Yeshua as the husband and the church as the bride (female).

The Father is NOT in submission to anyone! He is the head of the household just as a husband/father is the head of a Christian household.

Trying to make female as equal to male is a doctrine right out of Asherah worship, the divide mother goddess and is condemned by Yah.

"Trying to make female as equal to male is a doctrine right out of Asherah worship" WRONG!
As I posted, man and woman were equal until God punished Eve for her sin, Genesis 3:16.
To the woman he said, "I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."

In Christ, there is no male or female.... Galatians 3:28
"There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus."

There is a difference in marriage, according to Paul, and he quotes a woman
is to be in submission, as the law teaches, but I never found that in any of the law, only in Genesis.

 

[DeadlyScimitars]

You are assuming that spirits don't also have gender. It is specific in the Hebrew for example that their are both male and female 'evil spirits', ie 'ruach rah (male)' and 'ruach ra'ah (feminine)'.

He created Adam as male and took Adamah (female form later named Eve) out of him, not created directly. He put the female under submission to the male as He is male just as we are in submission to Yeshua as the husband and the church as the bride (female).

The Father is NOT in submission to anyone! He is the head of the household just as a husband/father is the head of a Christian household.

Trying to make female as equal to male is a doctrine right out of Asherah worship, the divide mother goddess and is condemned by Yah.

Where did you get this detail of the creation of Eve?
The scripture clearly states:

But for Adam no suitable helper was found. So the Lord God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man’s ribs and then closed up the place with flesh. Then the Lord God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man.
The man said,
“This is now bone of my bones
and flesh of my flesh;
she shall be called ‘woman,’
for she was taken out of man.”

That is why a man leaves his father and mother and is united to his wife, and they become one flesh.

God created woman from man's body not spirit. God breathed the breathe of Life into both, not a separate female breathe of life and a male breathe of life.

 

[bottomofsandal]

God created woman from man's body not spirit. God breathed the breathe of Life into both, not a separate female breathe of life and a male breathe of life.

That is noteworthy, this is something of which we are all aware.

God created man and from man God made woman.

So, within God is both male and female characteristics and attributes.


So, what we call feminine was always within God's essence.

There is no agenda here, just curiosity as to why God chose Father ?

 

[bottomofsandal]

This will inevitably turn into a kind of "chicken or egg" debate.

Those who believe that God is sovereign over all history, that He has accurately revealed Himself to people through the ages as He saw fit, and that Scripture is inspired, authoritative, and inerrant (in the original autographs) will generally argue that God designed human history to be almost universally patriarchal (for whatever reason) and thus revealed Himself to us as the male.

Those who believe that God (if there really is one) has revealed himself in a phenomenological way, that people have written of God as they understood "Him" throughout the ages, and that Scripture is really no more than a great epic story about God will generally argue that society in the ancient near east was predominantly patriarchal, and thus "scripture" reflects that bias in describing God as male.

Phenomenology is predicated on subjective perception, so IMVHO I do not believe we can use this philosophy to illustrate God the Father. God has already revealed Himself as a Father, Jesus is His Son. They call each other in such a manner.


Neither is anthropomorphism in play, there is no attempt to humanize God or any insinuation or implication that man elevates himself to become a god. God could have chosen to manifest Himself in any manner. Perhaps it is as simple as being made in His image...

 

[DeadlyScimitars]

Phenomenology is predicated on subjective perception, so IMVHO I do not believe we can use this philosophy to illustrate God the Father. God has already revealed Himself as a Father, Jesus is His Son. They call each other in such a manner.


Neither is anthropomorphism in play, there is no attempt to humanize God or any insinuation or implication that man elevates himself to become a god. God could have chosen to manifest Himself in any manner. Perhaps it is as simple as being made in His image...

Could you run through that "ism" and bigger words again?
JK you made my mind twist there for a sec
Felt like I was reading a doctoral thesis

 

[bottomofsandal]

Could you run through that "ism" and bigger words again?
JK you made my mind twist there for a sec
Felt like I was reading a doctoral thesis

Now you know how the rest of us feel driving through your fair city on that massive interstate system you have in Indy. Dude, that is craaazy ! That labyrinth is the real Indy 500 !

 

[food4thought]

Now you know how the rest of us feel driving through your fair city on that massive interstate system you have in Indy. Dude, that is craaazy ! That labyrinth is the real Indy 500 !

AMEN!!! Anybody else ever work as an OTR truck driver? You think navigating places like Indy is tough in a car? Try it with 53 feet of trailer behind you! lol.

I was not trying to insinuate that you had an agenda with your post BoS, I was just reflecting on the presuppositions that could underlie the discussion. Looking back, I think I came across wrong, and I apologize to anyone I might have offended.

And I still don't have a good answer to the main question other than: Uhhhh... Idunno.

 

[bottomofsandal]

AMEN!!! Anybody else ever work as an OTR truck driver? You think navigating places like Indy is tough in a car? Try it with 53 feet of trailer behind you! lol.

I was not trying to insinuate that you had an agenda with your post BoS, I was just reflecting on the presuppositions that could underlie the discussion. Looking back, I think I came across wrong, and I apologize to anyone I might have offended.

And I still don't have a good answer to the main question other than: Uhhhh... Idunno.

You didn't step on my toes bro, but I appreciate the brotherly love !


You have stimulated wholesome thought, and consequently I will be more observant of your posts on the BBs !!! There is a certain fogginess with this topic because it is simultaneously both innovative and ambiguous.


God is not androgynous. My clumsy topic is simply God choose to manifest Himself as a male. This in no way demeans or denigrates women whatsoever, and there is nothing implicit in the topic of the thread. God is Spirit, yet God presents Himself to mankind as a man. Is there a reason ?

 

[DeadlyScimitars]

You didn't step on my toes bro, but I appreciate the brotherly love !


You have stimulated wholesome thought, and consequently I will be more observant of your posts on the BBs !!! There is a certain fogginess with this topic because it is simultaneously both innovative and ambiguous.


God is not androgynous. My clumsy topic is simply God choose to manifest Himself as a male. This in no way demeans or denigrates women whatsoever, and there is nothing implicit in the topic of the thread. God is Spirit, yet God presents Himself to mankind as a man. Is there a reason ?

Oh yes gotta love Indy!! lol But I think there is a lot of presupposition that can take place with this topic. It's good to share thoughts and stimulate different perspectives but I DO know I don't think we can put an affirmative "this is why" answer.

 

[bottomofsandal]

AMEN!!! Anybody else ever work as an OTR truck driver? You think navigating places like Indy is tough in a car? Try it with 53 feet of trailer behind you! lol.

I was not trying to insinuate that you had an agenda with your post BoS, I was just reflecting on the presuppositions that could underlie the discussion. Looking back, I think I came across wrong, and I apologize to anyone I might have offended.

And I still don't have a good answer to the main question other than: Uhhhh... Idunno.

Can't imagine Indy in a semi !!! :o


There is no answer is the answer...

 

[bottomofsandal]

Oh yes gotta love Indy!! lol But I think there is a lot of presupposition that can take place with this topic. It's good to share thoughts and stimulate different perspectives but I DO know I don't think we can put an affirmative "this is why" answer.

Agreed. There is no answer is the answer...


BTW, the only thing crazier I have driven on is in Chicago in the middle of both lanes where in the am the traffic goes one way and in the pm it goes the other way.