Why do you think arminians teach falsehoods?

[DD2008]

Such as man centered salvation etc..

If you do?

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Arminianism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Arminianism is a school of soteriological thought within Protestant Christianity based on the theological ideas of the Dutch Reformed theologian Jacobus Arminius (1560-1609)[1] and his historic followers, the Remonstrants. The doctrines' acceptance stretches through much of mainstream Christianity, including evangelical Protestantism.[citation needed]
Arminianism holds to the following tenets:

• Humans are naturally unable to make any effort towards salvation (see also prevenient grace).
• Salvation is possible only by God's grace, which cannot be merited.
• No works of human effort can cause or contribute to salvation.
• God's election is conditional on faith in the sacrifice and Lordship of Jesus Christ.
• Christ's atonement was made on behalf of all people.
• God allows his grace to be resisted by those who freely reject Christ.
• Salvation can be lost, as continued salvation is conditional upon continued faith.[citation needed]

 

[JimfromOhio]

Such as man centered salvation etc..

If you do?

Depends on our spiritual humility leads to a "right knowledge of our spiritual-self" whether we are God-centered or man-centered. How depraved man can cooperate with God’s grace in conversion? Arminianism takes credit for almost everything they achieve (holiness), even their salvation. That is why the Apostle Paul wrote, “Your salvation is nothing you have achieved by your good works. It is a gift of God. You receive it by faith. That way no one can boast of his own accomplishments.”

Without Christ through the Holy Spirit... we ARE NOTHING except worthy of going through the WIDE GATE of hell. Ungenerated people have no capacity to understand God's spiritual truth; instead they created God in their own image that they are calling God's truth foolishness (1 Cor. 2:14).

All of us are born spiritual ignorant (DEAD), not stupid. Through Adam, we are born spiritually dead. The nineteenth-century Scottish commentator John Eadie described it as a case of "death walking". Spiritually dead people are like zombies--they don't know they're dead and they're still going through the motions of living. Sin is where an unregenerate person runs away from God, meaning that a person called a "fugitive" that as a sinner, it is a person's inclination is to flee from God. Death is universal spiritually and also by nature. Physically we are born alive however spiritually dead.

 

[Zoness]

Is this a counterattack for the other thread? I didn't participate in that one so I won't participate in this one.

 

[SummaScriptura]

I think Arminians teach falsehoods for the same reasons Calvin's followers do, sin.

 

[sunlover1]

Arminianism holds to the following tenets:

Humans are naturally unable to make any effort towards salvation (see also prevenient grace}
Salvation is possible only by God's grace, which cannot be merited.
No works of human effort can cause or contribute to salvation.
God's election is conditional on faith in the sacrifice and Lordship of Jesus Christ.
Christ's atonement was made on behalf of all people.
God allows his grace to be resisted by those who freely reject Christ.
Salvation can be lost, as continued salvation is conditional upon continued faith.[citation needed]

I agree with most of the above.
and am unsure on the other 2

 

[ArcticFox]

Such as man centered salvation etc..

If you do?

Let me answer this.

Yes, I believe Arminianism is false, essentially. There is some truth to it, and it is part of a greater truth, but because it lacks the entirety of the truth, it becomes, in a sense, "falsehood."

However, let me say that Arminians believe what they are saying is the truth. They have passionate reasons for believing it, and they passionate believe that their counter-part theologically, Calvinism, is in fact the "enemy" of the gospel truth and of evangelism. They have a lot of reasons for believing this, and they feel very strongly about their convictions.

I have met many, many, many very godly and Bible-believing Arminians. I have met many who study theology and love to pray, who love to teach others about God.

I feel it's a shame that they haven't seen the fullness of God's sovereignty as I believe it is understood. I am not the standard of truth, not at all, but I believe that their understanding of God's sovereignty is so woefully deficient that it borders on "falsehood." They have the absolute best of intentions, but I believe they have been led astray by a man-centered understanding of the gospel, and by cultures that emphasize self, the individual, choice, and deciding one's own destiny.

I believe that these honest, faithful, and devout Arminians would more greatly and better serve, honor, and praise God if they were to take a better understanding of his sovereignty from the words of Scripture, particularly concerning God's role in salvation.

 

[ArcticFox]

Is this a counterattack for the other thread? I didn't participate in that one so I won't participate in this one.

Zoness, you are practicing very bad forum etiquette. Why do you post just to say you won't participate, and offer nothing to the discussion?

Please stop posting in General Theology if you won't participate. Don't post and run, and don't post just to tell us "I won't post."

Very bad form. Very bad.

 

[onwingsaseagles]

Such as man centered salvation etc..

If you do?

Arminianism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Arminianism is a school of soteriological thought within Protestant Christianity based on the theological ideas of the Dutch Reformed theologian Jacobus Arminius (1560-1609)[1] and his historic followers, the Remonstrants. The doctrines' acceptance stretches through much of mainstream Christianity, including evangelical Protestantism.[citation needed]
Arminianism holds to the following tenets:

• Humans are naturally unable to make any effort towards salvation (see also prevenient grace).
• Salvation is possible only by God's grace, which cannot be merited.
• No works of human effort can cause or contribute to salvation.
• God's election is conditional on faith in the sacrifice and Lordship of Jesus Christ.
• Christ's atonement was made on behalf of all people.
• God allows his grace to be resisted by those who freely reject Christ.
• Salvation can be lost, as continued salvation is conditional upon continued faith.[citation needed]

Exactly LLJ, to say that Arminians teach man centered salvation is a fallacy at best, and flat out lie at worst.

 

[onwingsaseagles]

Arminianism takes credit for almost everything they achieve (holiness), even their salvation. That is why the Apostle Paul wrote, “Your salvation is nothing you have achieved by your good works. It is a gift of God. You receive it by faith. That way no one can boast of his own accomplishments.”

Once again this is a flat out lie!!!

No one can be saved unless God draws them, it is not through our own effort that we are saved but through the sacrifice of Christ, we receive grace through faith. Further more without the empowerment of the Holy Spirit no man could become righteous. Only because we have been empowered through the infilling of the Holy Spirit are we able to cease from sin, not because of our own ability.


Must we respond to God's Call, must we yield to the Lordship of Christ, must we walk in the Spirit? Yes, Yes, and Yes. Could we have done any of that in our own ability? No

To believe that you have the choice to resist God's call, to refuse to yield to Christ, and remain in the flesh, does not mean we take credit for what God has done in our lives.

 

[onwingsaseagles]

I think Arminians teach falsehoods for the same reasons Calvin's followers do, sin.

Do you know what Arminians teach?

 

[Zoness]

Zoness, you are practicing very bad forum etiquette. Why do you post just to say you won't participate, and offer nothing to the discussion?

Please stop posting in General Theology if you won't participate. Don't post and run, and don't post just to tell us "I won't post."

Very bad form. Very bad.

Fine I will enter the discussion to please you, you alone.

First of all, let's clarify....what "falsehoods" do Arminians teach and why are Calvinists better people?

 

[SummaScriptura]

Do you know what Arminians teach?

Yes.

Do you deny that Arminians and Calvin's followers are prone to sin and therefore can and do teach falsehood? Does any school of theology have a corner on the truth?

 

[DD2008]

Yes.

Do you deny that Arminians and Calvin's followers are prone to sin and therefore can and do teach falsehood? Does any school of theology have a corner on the truth?

Sounds like something a calminian baptist would say...

 

[onwingsaseagles]

Yes.

Do you deny that Arminians and Calvin's followers are prone to sin and therefore can and do teach falsehood? Does any school of theology have a corner on the truth?

Yes I do deny it. Calvinist believe that Once you are saved/ or have been regenerated, then you cannot loose your salvation, so they are indeed prone to send, not concerning themselve with making Christ Lord. However Arminians believe that one must live a holy life doing the will of the Father remaining on the narrow rode to receive eternal life. Therefore agree or disagree with what Arminians teach that are not prone to sin, seeing as they believe that a believer must walk in the Spirit baring the fruit of holiness, righteousness, and purity.

 

[DD2008]

Yes I do deny it. Calvinist believe that Once you are saved/ or have been regenerated, then you cannot loose your salvation, so they are indeed prone to send, not concerning themselve with making Christ Lord. However Arminians believe that one must live a holy life doing the will of the Father remaining on the narrow rode to receive eternal life. Therefore agree or disagree with what Arminians teach that are not prone to sin, seeing as they believe that a believer must walk in the Spirit baring the fruit of holiness, righteousness, and purity.

Actually Calvinists believe that if Christ died for your sins you are saved..period. The atonement doesn't fail. Christ's sacrifice achieved what it was supposed to achieve by the soverign decree of God. If you have been regenerated you are saved. You will then certainly exibit good works born from the gratitude of faith in the Lord and Savior.

If one doesn't follow Christ as Lord it is evident that one was indeed not saved and is still in their sins.

 

[DD2008]

Arminians believe that Christ died to give the world the choice to choose salvation or hell. They believe once someone is saved they can lose that salvation by sinning their way out of it, because they teach that God has only predestined the person to the choice. However some do teach OSAS in the form of saying that God predestined a person to salvation based on the merit of that person's decision to choose Christ.

Forknowledge does not mean forknowledge of any merit on that person's part as Arminians claim. That would contradict Ephesians 2:8-9 It simply means forknowledge of everything, so God forknew the elect an eternity before they were born.

The Arminian view fails because it is unbiblical and in the end leaves one with man meriting his salvation by his choice of God. The view also in the end leaves open the posibility that absolutley nobody will be saved and that Christ died in vain.

 

[onwingsaseagles]

The Arminian view fails because it is unbiblical and in the end leaves one with man meriting his salvation by his choice of God. The view also in the end leaves open the posibility that absolutley nobody will be saved and that Christ died in vain.

Actually Jesus said few would find the path to righteousness, not that no one would. God made the path, but it is up to us to find, and then walk it.

 

[DD2008]

Actually Jesus said few would find the path to righteousness, not that no one would. God made the path, but it is up to us to find, and then walk it.

What about finding it would lead one to believe that it was the effort of the individual that made him find it?

The statement in Matthew 7:14 "those who find it are few". Does not at all conclude that one found it of their own accord. One could just as easily find something because they were compelled to find it. They couldn't help but find it. Because it is the end of the predestined journey that they are on it is the only door in the room...etc. One in that situation (election) must find it! There is no other alternative.

Nowhere in the Bible is God's purpose for his election (other than his love) revealed. That will only be known when we see the Lord. The bible is quite clear that it has nothing to do with any merit on the part of man, however.

 

[onwingsaseagles]

What about finding it would lead one to believe that it was the effort of the individual that made him find it?

The statement in Matthew 7:14 "those who find it are few". Does not at all conclude that one found it of their own accord. One could just as easily find something because they were compelled to find it. They couldn't help but find it. Because it is the end of the predestined journey that they are on it is the only door in the room...etc. One in that situation (election) must find it! There is no other alternative.

Nowhere in the Bible is God's purpose for his election (other than his love) revealed. That will only be known when we see the Lord. The bible is quite clear that it has nothing to do with any merit on the part of man, however.

#1 God wants everyone to find it.
#2 No one within themselves could find it on their own, God must lead us.
#3 We must follow