Why didn't Jesus write his own book?

[peaceful soul]

Again I hope I'm not putting words in Balbatish's mouth, but I don't think that "manipulated" is the right word. It is true that our modern Greek New Testament and Hebrew Old Testament are put together from fragmented manuscripts. There are very few full-length manuscripts of the Bible in existence (a couple that come to my mind are the Codex Vaticanus and Codex Sinaiticus, which contain both Testaments). Most manuscripts contain only fragments of the whole text. Our modern Bibles are printed by combining these fragments together, and applying textual criticism. It isn't manipulation (in the perjorative sense) by any means, but rather a restoration of God's words.

After all, Christ said that his words would never pass away, but he did not say that this would not come about by God-inspired, human effort.

Thanks for the info. I understood most of what you said already. I have much faith in the early oratory skills and church writings to believe that the Bible is sound as the Holy Spirit was and is at work in keeping God's Word guarded from harm.

 

[JRNetwork]

Thanks for the info. I understood most of what you said already. I have much faith in the early oratory skills and church writings to believe that the Bible is sound as the Holy Spirit was and is at work in keeping God's Word guarded from harm.

As do most Christians

 

[Electra]

Most all the yogis before and after his time wrote their own teachings.

So why didn't jesus do so? I think that if Jesus would have wrote his own teachings, he would have be understood better IMHO.

Perhaps Jesus didnt mean to give out a specific ''live by my rules book'' If he was educated in India, and especially if he was educated by Buddhists might suggest that he wanted to prach in the same manner as Buddha, not giving a doctrine or a system, but a vision.

Perhaps...its a possibility.

 

[elijah115]

perhaps such thinking is wishful

 

[vedickings]

perhaps such thinking is wishful

If you want to start talking about wishful thinking then the Bible would be a good place to start.

 

[HeWhoSearches]

But that's exactly it, How could so many people in different locations and at different times conspire to create a story and have it never contradict itself and fit so perfectly well together. It coulden't be done. Which is why I believe that the Bible is nothing other than truth and is the inspired word of God.

Have you ever heard of the Pagan Mystery Religions of Attis, Adonis, Mithras, ect.?

Jesus didn't need to write anything because his perennial story and teachings already existed, and all that needed to be done was reformat them, combine them, and let them evolve into the faith it is today.

Behold the wonderful universality of the Mysteries! Behold the many shaped Attis! Behold the Logos, the Son of God who has come in many forms to guide us to initiation! Origen spoke of them. I say we all listen to him....

 

[morningstar2651]

Maybe he had trouble finding a publisher before the crucifiction?

 

[peaceful soul]

If you want to start talking about wishful thinking then the Bible would be a good place to start.

I guess you can invalidate our personal experiences, right? You're the enlightened one, I guess?

That really was inappropiate, especially since the response had no connection to your beliefs or person. It was not a putdown.

 

[vedickings]

I guess you can invalidate our personal experiences, right? You're the enlightened one, I guess?

That really was inappropiate, especially since the response had no connection to your beliefs or person. It was not a putdown.

Ok, I guess I was a little out of line there. Sorry about that elijah115.

 

[arunma]

Perhaps Jesus didnt mean to give out a specific ''live by my rules book'' If he was educated in India, and especially if he was educated by Buddhists might suggest that he wanted to prach in the same manner as Buddha, not giving a doctrine or a system, but a vision.

Perhaps...its a possibility.

One major focus of the Bible is keeping holy, so as to not defile the Lord's people, which are his church. This is why Christ Jesus said, "You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect." (St. Matthew 5:48).

I recall that in another thread, in which the OP asked posters to rate the sinfulness of several sexual activities, the Buddhist posters said that in their tradition, such things are not sinful when done between consenting adults. I say this not to insult the Buddhist religion, but to mention a philosophy which contrasts with Christianity. Whereas Buddhism emphasizes a philosophical precept, Christianity emphasizes both a theological framework and a set of works that ought to be lived out in the lives of believers. Apostle Paul taught, "Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children." (Ephesians 5:1).

Even though the Gospel sets believers free from the punishment of sin, the Scriptures speak of "obeying" the Gospel (2 Thessalonians 1:8, 1 Peter 4:17). We are not merely to remember the central vision that Christ taught. As Christ lived, so too must Christians live. Therefore, it is important to "live by God's rule book" (as you have put it), not out of a spirit of legalistic adherance, but through the outpouring of a transformation which has occured within the believer.

 

[peaceful soul]

Ok, I guess I was a little out of line there. Sorry about that elijah115.

I am not trying to be a mind reader, but elijah115 was just responding to your "Jesus went to India" theory as wishful thinking.Not a problem. I just saw it as an invitation for a confrontation for no good reason. If I get out of line, please fell free to correct me too. Sometimes we do things that seem innocent but are not.

 

[peaceful soul]

Have you ever heard of the Pagan Mystery Religions of Attis, Adonis, Mithras, ect.?

Jesus didn't need to write anything because his perennial story and teachings already existed, and all that needed to be done was reformat them, combine them, and let them evolve into the faith it is today.

Behold the wonderful universality of the Mysteries! Behold the many shaped Attis! Behold the Logos, the Son of God who has come in many forms to guide us to initiation! Origen spoke of them. I say we all listen to him....

Many things are similar, but that is inconclusive to them being copies of another. Look at it this way, many people have ideas of inventions. Some people will research to see if someone else has laid claim to a patent on their created concept. Suppose 8 people were trying to lay claim to that same concept as their own. Would you say that in each case that each person perhaps copied from the other? There has to be proof that these individuals did not come up with the idea without stealing from each other. We need proof that the actions and teachings of Christ were indeed learned and applied to Christianity from other sources. That is not easy to do, given that Jesus' teachings and actions are woven together in such a fashion that as a whole, they make a unique claim of which the individual parts (assumed to be copied) do not hold.

 

[Catholicism]

Most all the yogis before and after his time wrote their own teachings.

So why didn't jesus do so? I think that if Jesus would have wrote his own teachings, he would have be understood better IMHO.

For the same reason Buddha and Socrates didn't?

 

[Electra]

perhaps such thinking is wishful

With all due respect - if there was ever a religion which would accomodate my beliefs and incorporate so called belief in God, it would be Hinduism, and not Christianity by a long shot.

Wishful thinking? What for?

One major focus of the Bible is keeping holy, so as to not defile the Lord's people, which are his church. This is why Christ Jesus said, "You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect." (St. Matthew 5:48).

I recall that in another thread, in which the OP asked posters to rate the sinfulness of several sexual activities, the Buddhist posters said that in their tradition, such things are not sinful when done between consenting adults. I say this not to insult the Buddhist religion, but to mention a philosophy which contrasts with Christianity. Whereas Buddhism emphasizes a philosophical precept, Christianity emphasizes both a theological framework and a set of works that ought to be lived out in the lives of believers. Apostle Paul taught, "Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children." (Ephesians 5:1).

Even though the Gospel sets believers free from the punishment of sin, the Scriptures speak of "obeying" the Gospel (2 Thessalonians 1:8, 1 Peter 4:17). We are not merely to remember the central vision that Christ taught. As Christ lived, so too must Christians live. Therefore, it is important to "live by God's rule book" (as you have put it), not out of a spirit of legalistic adherance, but through the outpouring of a transformation which has occured within the believer.

Thanks for the reply.

however, every single thing you quoted there to rebute my religion was not written by Jesus. And the things which were noted to be said by Jesus, were again, not written down by Jesus, but by Matthew.

 

[HeWhoSearches]

Many things are similar, but that is inconclusive to them being copies of another. Look at it this way, many people have ideas of inventions. Some people will research to see if someone else has laid claim to a patent on their created concept. Suppose 8 people were trying to lay claim to that same concept as their own. Would you say that in each case that each person perhaps copied from the other? There has to be proof that these individuals did not come up with the idea without stealing from each other. We need proof that the actions and teachings of Christ were indeed learned and applied to Christianity from other sources. That is not easy to do, given that Jesus' teachings and actions are woven together in such a fashion that as a whole, they make a unique claim of which the individual parts (assumed to be copied) do not hold.

Huh?

Well for one thing the Mysteries predate Christianity. Also, I'm a little confused by part of your post. Furthermore, they predate Christianity. You should read "The Jesus Mysteries" by Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy, both world-renown on their respective subjects (Mysticism, Ancient Religions, and Philosophy, ect.) It's quite compelling, and written in a way to be easily understood and read. I knew most everything inside it before reading it, but it was still ok. Heres part of the back of the book:

What if for thousands of years Pagans​

had also followed a Son of God?​

What if this Pagan saviour was also born of a virgin​

on the 25th of December before three shepherds,​

turned water into wine at a wedding,​

died and resurrected at Easter,​

and offered his body and blood as a Holy Communion?​

---------------------------------
To the post above:

Mathew? I had heard that the gospels in their original form were merely the gospels of prominent christian sects, themselves written in all caps, practically no spacing or punctuation, and no apparent author.

The Catholic Church were the ones who gave them their authors, and many another text within the bible attributed to certain people despite it being false.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Most all the yogis before and after his time wrote their own teachings.

So why didn't jesus do so? I think that if Jesus would have wrote his own teachings, he would have be understood better IMHO.

I suspect it's because Jesus never existed. I can't prove this, but this is the view I lean towards.

 

[HeWhoSearches]

I suspect it's because Jesus never existed. I can't prove this, but this is the view I lean towards.

No one can prove he existed nor didn't. Its called faith. Right?

 

[Eudaimonist]

No one can prove he existed nor didn't. Its called faith. Right?

"Prove" might be too strong a word but, no, I don't think we are left with nothing but faith. Do you have faith that George Washington was the first President of the United States? I don't. I think we don't need faith for that, given the strength of the evidence.

 

[HeWhoSearches]

"Prove" might be too strong a word but, no, I don't think we are left with nothing but faith. Do you have faith that George Washington was the first President of the United States? I don't. I think we don't need faith for that, given the strength of the evidence.

Ok.... but all the evidence that has been put in front of my face for Jesus existence has been lacking. Ancient Catholics were never any good at forging. So, as far as I know, there is no evidence.

 

[JRNetwork]

By our definition of fact and what it takes for something to be considered fact, saldly, Jesus does not meet the standard because of many factors that kept knowledge of his exsitance during his life limited to a certain area or number of people. Which is why it is called faith. We, 21st century people who have never seen Jesus, are only given parts of the whole truth, and as Christians, we trust that the information we are given, along with the things that God and Jesus have done for us, is enough, or more than enough, to believe that he is indeed real. For some, it is not enough, and only they can decide when, or if it will ever, be enough.