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Why can't God send us all to Heaven?

strangertoo

sin is diabolical abuse of fellow humans-1John 3:8
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You must really have a difficult time deciding which sinners to believe. Hell is literal and eternal in the NT.

I don't believe any sinners , that would be believing in Satan...

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil

as for hell [hades, sheol], Jesus states all are released form, hell and then it is destroyed, so how could it be 'eternal' ?

Revelation 20:13 ...death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: ...
Revelation 20:14 and death and hell were cast into the lake of fire.

You need to understand the actual meaning oif the original word to see it is not about endlessness , but means 'lasting an age' ... from it we get teh word aeon for an age, it never does mean 'eternity' nor as Jesus says could it ... it's just a very bad translation then, and Jesus' own words prove that as well...
 
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dollarsbill

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I don't believe any sinners , that would be believing in Satan...

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil
That leaves us all out, but Jesus.
as for hell [hades, sheol], Jesus states all are released form, hell and then it is destroyed, so how could it be 'eternal' ?

Revelation 20:13 ...death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: ...
Revelation 20:14 and death and hell were cast into the lake of fire.

You need to understand the actual meaning oif the original word to see it is not about endlessness , but means 'lasting an age' ... from it we get teh word aeon for an age, it never does mean 'eternity' nor as Jesus says could it ... it's just a very bad translation then, and Jesus' own words prove that as well...
Nearly every English Bible agrees with eternal punishment in the fire.

Revelation 20:10 (NASB)
10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
 
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strangertoo

sin is diabolical abuse of fellow humans-1John 3:8
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The Lake of Fire 'baptism' is eternal.

Revelation 20:10 (NASB)
10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

again. look at what Jesus says which aqrees with the original scripture, showing the mistake in this mistranslation you quote :-

all will accept Jesus in the end , he says so, so why do you not believe him ?

Revelation 5:13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.

there can be no torment because God wipes away all tears , everyone is happy once all folks Love one another as Jesus COMMANDS and all will accept that

so look at a LITERAL translation and see your mistake :-

Revelation 20:10 [Young's Literal Translation (YLT) ]



-and the Devil, who is leading them astray, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where [are] the beast and the false prophet, and they shall be tormented day and night to the ages of the ages.


to the END of all time then and then they accept Jesus at the end as Jesus says they will ... the mercy of God endures...
 
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dollarsbill

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again. look at what Jesus says which aqrees with the original scripture, showing the mistake in this mistranslation you quote :-
Nearly every English Bible agrees with eternal punishment. Maybe YOUR translation is wrong.
all will accept Jesus in the end , he says so, so why do you not believe him ?

Revelation 5:13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.
That doesn't say everyone will be saved.
there can be no torment because God wipes away all tears , everyone is happy once all folks Love one another as Jesus COMMANDS and all will accept that
That only applies to the saved.

Revelation 22:11 (NASB)
11 "Let the one who does wrong, still do wrong; and the one who is filthy, still be filthy; and let the one who is righteous, still practice righteousness; and the one who is holy, still keep himself holy."
so look at a LITERAL translation and see your mistake :-

Revelation 20:10 [Young's Literal Translation (YLT) ]

-and the Devil, who is leading them astray, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where [are] the beast and the false prophet, and they shall be tormented day and night to the ages of the ages.
Which does not deny eternal punishment. Check the rest of our English Bibles. They are quite clear that eternal punishment is indeed eternal.
 
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dollarsbill

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Oh, you are right. I should have said "everyone's translation is wrong except the one translation you like."
The one YOU stated is a very good translation. Actually I have cited many well known English translations in the forum to show consistency in our English Bibles.
 
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strangertoo

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Nearly every English Bible agrees with eternal punishment. Maybe YOUR translation is wrong.

As I showed, Jesus' own witness shows which is the right translation , also Young's is a literal translation, the others are not ... also, rather conclusively the word in question comes from the word-root 'aion-' in Greek from which we get the word 'aeon' for an age.... an age is a long FINITE period of time, not 'eternity' ... and indeed nothing physical even can be damaged endlessly, it is impossible ...

That doesn't say everyone will be saved.

Well I expect your hope of salvation is by accepting Jesus, so why would you think it is different for anyone else?

but if you want it more explicit, how about this :-

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men ...

That only applies to the saved.

Revelation 22:11 (NASB)
11 "Let the one who does wrong, still do wrong; and the one who is filthy, still be filthy; and let the one who is righteous, still practice righteousness; and the one who is holy, still keep himself holy."

look again, your quote applies only to this life , countless many sinners are freed from sin by death and released from hell [Rev 20:13] to be saved by works in the next life [Rev 7:9-10], few only in this life [Matt 7:14] where the many are destroyed [Matt 7:13]

so indeed most will remain sinners to death in this life and the kingdom is not ready yet to save them... but we know countless many are later saved as Jesus himself says so [Rev 7:9-10]
 
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strangertoo

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I like all of the english translations, except the NWT.
The KJV is a bit archaic for my taste.

The KJV has many faults and Robert Young spent much of his life correcting them, he found thousands and they are all listed in the back of his Concordance ...

sadly the mistakes have been copied to many other translations , there is no English translation without countless mistakes in it ... YLT is a big improvemnet on KJV and the others but as with all translations one would do better with the original language so one can appreciate the poetry of the Word of God [one cannot translate poetry , it just cannot work in a different language]

but the problem with all translations is BIAS of the translation because they are all translations by sinners, a saint never would translate scripture , no need because God teaches all followers of Jesus, all saints, Himself by His Holy Spirit - John 16:13

so indeed anyone insisting 'their' translation is right is likely just underlining that they ahve decided what to believe BEFORE spirit baptism, before being taught ONE Truth of Love by God ...

as the new covenant states :-

Heb 8:10 ... saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

read carefully what God says then, no-one under grace teaches anyone under grace...

compare this to divided mass religion of sinners where even their sinner priests are taught what to say and it bears no relation to scripture of God because they do not know God as sinners :-

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil...

1 John 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

1 John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not

thus we find at Jesus return united world religion under Satan as the Antichrist -Rev 13:3-4 with only the few who found the way of Love, way of God, still resisting mass religion of sinners

So with the translation of bibles under control of Satan, it is unsurprising how many key words have been mistranslated ...

the ONLY way top know God is to STOP sinning and Love in obedience to God's advice about Love, Jesus' command to all saints...

if one simply Loves everyone that counts as Loving God because one is obeying God ...

almost all sinners however will not stop sinning, they are servants of sin, they will not find the strait narrow way in THIS life [Matt 7:14] , they will all be destroyed [Matt 7:13], but the spirit canot be destroyed, it is given of God, so countless many are later saved [Rev 7:9-10] in the NEXT life... so understand even from scripture WHY sinners do not teach this, why mass religion teaches a false story of salvation ...

the point then is that Satan cannot change all the scripture else it would be obvious to anyone , but by changing a little here and there we KNOW he will fool almost the whole world [Rev 13:3-4]
 
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dollarsbill

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As I showed, Jesus' own witness shows which is the right translation , also Young's is a literal translation, the others are not ... also, rather conclusively the word in question comes from the word-root 'aion-' in Greek from which we get the word 'aeon' for an age.... an age is a long FINITE period of time, not 'eternity' ... and indeed nothing physical even can be damaged endlessly, it is impossible ...
Since 'eternal' is the same word used for 'eternal life' then are you saying 'eternal life' isn't 'eternal' either?
Well I expect your hope of salvation is by accepting Jesus, so why would you think it is different for anyone else?

but if you want it more explicit, how about this :-

1 Timothy 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men ...
He is indeed. But the majority reject Him. Therefore they do not have 'eternal life', unless they repent.
look again, your quote applies only to this life , countless many sinners are freed from sin by death and released from hell [Rev 20:13] to be saved by works in the next life [Rev 7:9-10], few only in this life [Matt 7:14] where the many are destroyed [Matt 7:13]

so indeed most will remain sinners to death in this life and the kingdom is not ready yet to save them... but we know countless many are later saved as Jesus himself says so [Rev 7:9-10]
You are offering hope for those who died in rebellion and hatred against God. Won't happen. Nothing cancels FOREVER.

Revelation 20:10 (NASB)
10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
 
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brinny

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I'm a Christian but this has bothered me all my life. If God loves us all and wants us all to go to Heaven and to be saved, and if He is all powerful why did he make Hell? Why did he have to make his son suffer?

Don't get offended by this question. I don't know how else to put it into words. Thanks

Read the Bible again and pray to God again, until He clarifies for you why this cannot happen. in the meantime, watch this entire video and pray some more.

Godspeed, brother.

(So Great A Salvation) Hating Sin by Paris Reidhead - YouTube
 
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strangertoo

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I'm a Christian but this has bothered me all my life. If God loves us all and wants us all to go to Heaven and to be saved, and if He is all powerful why did he make Hell?

'Hell' ['hades' in Greek, 'sheol' in Hebrew] is simply the invisible state of the dead awaiting resurrection - Jesus called it 'sleep' until resurrection do not listen to what sinners , even sinner priests, say because they are led by Satan to preach falsehoods:-

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil

Psalms 13:3 Consider and hear me, O LORD my God: lighten mine eyes, lest I sleep the sleep of death;

John 11:13 Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep.

realise that Jesus says ALL are resurrected from hell, there can be no 'eternal hell' as sinners speak of based on mistranslation of scripture by sinners :-

Revelation 20:13 ....death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

note too that all who are still sinners by Jesus' return are destroyed [Matt 7:13] but all resurrected from death and judged by WORKS, not grace, in the new earth kingdom come, after sin's 'wages' of death free them from past sin to be allowed spirit baptism [as all flesh is given in the new earth -Joel 2:28] top receive all Truth from God [John 16:13] as obviously does not happen to more than a few [Matt 7:14] in this life where the many are destroyed for sin [Matt 7:13] :-

Romans 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

realise then that mass religion of sinners is already corrupted from teh word of God as Jesus warned must be the case for the whole world [Rev 13:3-4] , that only the few escape only tens of thousands stop sinning and Love in this life to be saved at Jesus return -Jude 1:14- but countless many are saved later [Rev 7:9-10] who were destroyed as sinners [including sinner priests] in this life [Matt 7:13]

Why did he have to make his son suffer?

Jesus died to show men the ONLY way of salvation , it was not God that made him suffer but men who unjustly convicted and crucified him despite that he was without sin and cleared of all accusations against him by the Roman governor of Jerusalem...

thus if he is not to have died in vain for you , consuider ALL three baptisms he went through, what they mean :-

Luke 3:16 John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:

baptism of water is the COMMITMENT of dying to sin, to STOP sinning , the first step, the foundation of God which very few even take seriously [parents even baptising babies as if a baby needed or understood dying to sin] :-

2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

thus if one has not stopped sinning by time of Jesus' return [or by death if sooner] then one's salvation will be after resurrection of all sinners in the new earth kingdom come, not in this world, Jesus says he will take none who are still sinners :-

Luke 13:27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.


the second baptism is baptism of the spirit yo know all Truth [John 16:13] once one has stopped sinning, this is God coming within once one chooses to Love instead of sinning against anyone any longer :-

1 John 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
1 John 4:16 ... and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

clearly one needs all Truth from God Himself as this world is led and dominated by sinners even in mass religion of sinners ... God thus ensures the purity of His teaching by teaching all himself who are under grace, so no-one under grace teaches anyone else under grace [compare this with mass religion where sinners teach sinners, bl;ind leading the blind into the ditch of death [to be saved later once death frees them from sin] :-

Heb 8:10 ...saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

Matthew 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

and the third baptism, trial by 'fire' , resisting temptation to sin against others, proving one's Love is true belief in Love, not just words

1 Peter 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
...
James 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

Love is what you give freely, it is an action, not just saying one believes in Love but doing it...

so Jesus died to show us all that man could live a perfect life of Love, giving the LIE to what sinners preach that man is born a sinner and cannot stop ...

Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Jesus died then to give courage to the saints who followed him, that they would face unjust torture and death for sake of faith in Love, faith in God who is Love...

Jesus then died for sake also of those who killed him... because the salvation of the many depends completely on the salvation of the few in this life... the few firstfruit saints are the kings and priests of teh kingdom come in the new earth where the many are later saved [e.g. Rev 7:9-10]
 
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