Why are women not allowed to be ministers in some churches?

[mathinspiration]

Is it because of what Paul says or because of the gender or culture ?

 

[Freedom~Sprite]

Is it because of what Paul says or because of the gender or culture ?

My view? Entrenched sexism and ignorance.

It can't be what Paul said about women remaining quiet in church, because that pertained to women asking for clarity on the scriptural teachings within the churches in Corinth. If someone reads the text in context in 1 Corinthians 14.
Women were apostles remember. Women walked with Jesus during his ministry.

If that is argued to apply, then Paul contradicted himself when he said we are all one in Christ Jesus. Galatians 3.
For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed and heirs according to the promise.…

 

[Tallguy88]

It's unbiblical. There were women disciples, but never any women priests/pastors. Sexism has nothing to do with it.

 

[Freedom~Sprite]

Unbiblical? The Bible doesn't call people to preach. God does. And sexism is a sin and against Pauls decree in Galatians concerning the oneness in Christ.


No, it isn't unbiblical. Galatians 3 shoots that argument right out of the water. Anyone that would like to insist on that line of falsity would be calling Paul either a liar when he wrote to the churches in Galatia, or deluded.
Why were women to be quiet in the churches in Corinth? Why would Paul write a totally different letter to the churches in Galatia about women? Because he wasn't talking about the woman's capacity to be called by God to preach.
In 1 Corinthians 14 and verses 27-35, Paul tells a number of people how to behave in church. His letters were a matter of restoring order and maintaining decorum during the service. Not saying women cannot preach. If it were true that women are to keep quiet in church there would not be a woman in the choir. Nor in any office that serves in the church. Because she would then be not quiet in her service to and within the church.

 

[Tallguy88]

Unbiblical? The Bible doesn't call people to preach. God does. And sexism is a sin and against Pauls decree in Galatians concerning the oneness in Christ.

Nowhere in the Bible is a woman ordained to the preisthood or pastorate. Neither are women supposed to exercise spiritual authority over men. That's why it's unbiblical, and it's not sexist, unless you are calling God sexist.

No, it isn't unbiblical. Galatians 3 shoots that argument right out of the water. Anyone that would like to insist on that line of falsity would be calling Paul either a liar when he wrote to the churches in Galatia, or deluded.
Why were women to be quiet in the churches in Corinth? Why would Paul write a totally different letter to the churches in Galatia about women? Because he wasn't talking about the woman's capacity to be called by God to preach.
In 1 Corinthians 14 and verses 27-35, Paul tells a number of people how to behave in church. His letters were a matter of restoring order and maintaining decorum during the service. Not saying women cannot preach. If it were true that women are to keep quiet in church there would not be a woman in the choir. Nor in any office that serves in the church. Because she would then be not quiet in her service to and within the church.

Where are women ordained or given teaching authority over men? Chapter and verse, please.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

In the Catholic Church, because they believe their priesthood was ordained by Christ as an all-male institution.

Protestant churches that do not ordain women generally do so because the scriptural prohibitions against them having teaching authority over men precludes any possibility of them serving as pastors.

 

[Freedom~Sprite]

Nowhere in the Bible is a woman ordained to the preisthood or pastorate. Neither are women supposed to exercise spiritual authority over men. That's why it's unbiblical, and it's not sexist, unless you are calling God sexist.

No, I'm calling males who believe God would never call a woman to preach, false.

Where are women ordained or given teaching authority over men? Chapter and verse, please.

Where's the word Trinity in scripture? We're all one in Christ Jesus. There you have it. Unless someone wishes to say they know what God would and would not do, particularly in calling women to pastor, and that there are women pastors is evidence God does call women to preach, then that's blasphemy and not worthy of comment.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

 

[Albion]

Actually, it's neither. It's not because of the "remain silent in church" passage, although that's often mentioned, and it's not because of cultural standards. If it were the latter, that would have been changed long before the 20th century.

 

[Freedom~Sprite]

Remember that Jesus didn't ordain Gentiles to be his Disciples. But they are his Apostles and pastors today.
Jesus orchestrated a world view back to the Edenic lifestyle prior to the fall. When in Genesis we know God made both man and woman in his image and likeness.
It was a woman that discovered the empty tomb, Mary. And she ran to the upper room and informed the Disciples and they followed her to see for themselves. Not something that would naturally occur in Hebrew culture in that day. Just like the women that traveled with Jesus was a rarity because women were considered second class in the culture. While with Jesus women were in his company.

Read the scriptures too wherein Jesus speaks highly of women being he was a revolutionary. He worked on the Sabbath, he did not resign himself to keeping only with the royal or high class people. He instead supped with sinners. Something his own Disciples questioned.
Jesus said, he did not come to save the righteous but the unrighteous. How did he do that? He walked and shared among them. Because he was here to save the world. All people in the world who only needed to have faith in him and due to the gift of grace His Father ordained for the world.

All that and yet it is argued God would never let a woman deliver his word? A woman delivered God into the world. Women aren't second class in God's eyes. We're equal to males because we were made by God in his image and likeness. And God in the beginning ordained the first man should not be alone and that is why God created a woman to share the world and his life with.
Matthew 15:21- 28
Mark 5:25-34
John 4:7-30
John 20:1-18
Luke 8:1-3

Acts 18:24-26
Now a Jew named Apollos, a native of Alexandria, came to Ephesus. He was an eloquent man, competent in the Scriptures. He had been instructed in the way of the Lord. And being fervent in spirit, he spoke and taught accurately the things concerning Jesus, though he knew only the baptism of John. He began to speak boldly in the synagogue, but when Priscilla and Aquila heard him, they took him and explained to him the way of God more accurately.

 

[Tallguy88]

No, I'm calling males who believe God would never call a woman to preach, false.

Where's the word Trinity in scripture? We're all one in Christ Jesus. There you have it. Unless someone wishes to say they know what God would and would not do, particularly in calling women to pastor, and that there are women pastors is evidence God does call women to preach, then that's blasphemy and not worthy of comment.

I never said a woman cannot preach, but they cannot be priests or have spiritual authority over a man.

A woman cannot be a priest anymore than a man can be a mother. It's not "fair", but it's just a fact of how God made us differently. This in no way diminishes a woman's God-given dignity or means that they can't have positions in the church in other roles.

 

[Albion]

When in Genesis we know God made both man and woman in his image and likeness...It was a woman that discovered the empty tomb, Mary...Read the scriptures too wherein Jesus speaks highly of women being he was a revolutionary...All that and yet it is argued God would never let a woman deliver his word? A woman delivered God into the world. Women aren't second class in God's eyes.

While these points are valid, none of them shows us that women ought to be ordained (as we would call it nowadays) to the roles of bishop, elder, or deacon.

Yet those clerical offices are clearly indicated in scripture. God does have different roles for each of us to play, as the Bible also testifies. That does not mean that if you have one and the next person has a different one, God is discriminating against someone! Nor would that hold true for his church.

 

[Silmarien]

Where are women ordained or given teaching authority over men? Chapter and verse, please.

Judges 4-5? If that's not spiritual authority, I'm not sure what is.

 

[Tallguy88]

Judges 4-5? If that's not spiritual authority, I'm not sure what is.

An OT judge is not equivalent to the NT priesthood. Deborah was a military leader, law-giver, and prophet. She was not a priest (in the OT or NT sense).

 

[Silmarien]

An OT judge is not equivalent to the NT priesthood.

Why not?

 

[Tallguy88]

Why not?

Deborah was a military leader, law-giver, and prophet. She was not a priest (in the OT or NT sense).

 

[Silmarien]

Deborah was a military leader, law-giver, and prophet. She was not a priest (in the OT or NT sense).

Prophets did not have spiritual authority?

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

While these points are valid, none of them shows us that women ought to be ordained (as we would call it nowadays) to the roles of bishop, elder, or deacon.

There is reference to a deaconess named Phoebe in Romans 16, but teaching authority is not inherent to the diaconate.

 

[Tallguy88]

Prophets did not have spiritual authority?

They spoke the direct words of God. They were not priests who offered sacrifice. Some were both, but it was not inherent to the office. Either way, the Judges are gone and so are the Prophets, so it's largely a theoretical discussion with no direct relevance. Biblically, no women were appointed the NT priesthood (Apostles and elders/bishops/priests). In the history of Christianity, women did serve as deacons in the early church, but never priests or bishops. It's only been in the 20th Century that some denominations have gone against scripture and tradition and begun ordaining women.

 

[Tallguy88]

There is reference to a deaconess named Phoebe in Romans 16, but teaching authority is not inherent to the diaconate.

Correct. The female diaconate served the needs of female Christians in ways that would have been inappropriate for male priests to do (people were often baptized naked to symbolize being born again, for example).