Drunk drivers don't always know that they're drunk.
If your head is in a buzz and your wably, dizzy, then you KNOW your drunk.
Someone can be legally drunk and not show symptoms.
I dont care about legal i care about reality and common sense.
The point is that there are rules we all follow regardless of symptoms because we have to have some responsibility for how we affect others. The person who prepares your food in a restaurant or in the store you buy it from has to follow certain standards like hand-washing even if they think their hands are clean and they show no symptoms of being sick. You wouldn't hold the person who prepared your food liable if they prepared it after going to the bathroom and not washing their hands? Somehow I can't believe that.
Well I dont care if you dont believe it and if you dont believe it then our discussion is going to be pointless. If they peed on there hand, I'd expect them to wash it. And I think they naturally would. If they don't always wash there hands I trust they know there hands are clean enough. There not our children.
That's why public health standards and regulations exist. There needs to be reasonable expectations of how people behave when they are interacting with other people. The blame shouldn't go on the victim of someone else's negligence.
Lets stay in context, MASKS. I'm not responsible for your health, if you dont wanna take the risk to get sick, then YOU wear the mask. You take responsibility yourself.
Unless you're living off the grid then you absolutely do "live with these OTHER people". They have certain responsibilities in regards to your safety and you have certain responsibilities in regards to their safety. You can claim your denial of this all you like but it's a fact and it's reality.
No its not a fact or a reality. SOMETIMES its a fact and SOMETIMES its not. In the case of masks its NOT.
I didn't say "government", I said "society". With a society comes benefits AND responsibilities. You're responsible to the society from which you benefit.
Depends on what kind of responsibility your talking about. Stuff like dont steel, dont murder, dont rape, dont break contracts, ABSOLUTELY im responsible. But masks?NOPE im not responsible for your health. You are.
I don't know where you're getting 'tyranny' from, nobody brought up tyranny.
You dont have to bring up the word for it to be obviously applied.
If you perceive responsibility as tyranny then go live where there is no society, out in the wilderness, off the grid. It's that simple.
No its not that simple. I'm responsible in SOME ways to society, not ALL ways.
If you want to participate in society on any level then you must have responsibility towards that society in exchange for the benefits you receive from that society.
When I go to a store, my responsibility is to PAY for the food with MONEY I earned by work. I'm not responsible for YOUR health. Period. I dont know where you people get off on thinking otherwise.
If all you want is power from the grid, then that's fine, but you have a responsibility to compensate the society that is providing you power by paying that company.
Why are you going off on these irrelevant red herrings about paying the power company?
Come on man, I'm not responsible for your health. You wear the mask.
If you want to do business with the society and the members of that society then you have to take on the responsibility of living with the people you're doing business with in that society.
Yea, I pay money i earned via work for products or services. Im not responsible for your health, YOU ARE. Its not me that needs to go live off grid, its you that needs to go live in a country that seeks authoritarian conquest.
But I can tell from your use of the word 'tyranny' that you don't understand the word. There are Christians in this world who live under REAL tyranny, who are persecuted and killed for their faith. Calling mere social responsibility 'tyranny' is an affront to the experience of real Christians around the world.
Yea, those Christians undergo tyranny as well. Tyranny comes in different intensities. Demanding i be responsible for your health is still tyranny. Period.
No, you actually are imposing your ideology on me and everyone in society.
No im not, you can go wear your mask or live in your fearfull bubble, but i won't join you. Your imposing YOUR idea on me because your TELLING ME that I must join you. Well, NO!
You are telling the society in which you choose to live that they have no right to maintain their public safety and health standards.
Lets get this straight. I'm not living with THEM. There not living with ME. Wer living ON THE SAME PLANET. That means im not in THERE house, there not in MY house. I'm not responsible for THERE health, THEY ARE.
You could make the same argument about seat belts, that you are not asking anyone to wear a seat belt and that it's 'tyranny' for society to tell you you have to wear a seat belt.
And yes, its ALSO tyranny for society to tell anyone to wear a seatbelt. Its ok to RECOMMEND, but ORDER this when it SHOULD be a personal choice? No, thats wrong.
Of course, that would be just as wrong. Society (and the government that governs it) does well to defend the rights of its members. That's what wearing seat belts or masks (or shirts or shoes) does for the individuals in a society.
Oh so requiring me to wear a seatbelt protects YOUR rights? Requiring me to wear a mask, protects your rights? Requiring me to wear shoes protects your rights? What kind of upside down thinking is that? No, that does not protect your rights, that imposes your tyranny upon others rights to choose there own way. The sheer audacity. Why can't people mind there own business.
if you really took responsibility for yourself only you would simply leave such a society and go live where you can deal with little or none of these rules and regulations. You can homestead in the wilderness, off the grid, and never have to do anything. But as long as there are people around you in any aspect of your life then you have a responsibility towards them just as they have responsibilities towards you.
Again, it depends on what kind of responsibility wer talking about. Rape, murder, theft, breaking contracts, that kind of responsibility, YES, but your health? NO. You wear the mask.
The whole reason you "own" anything at all in your life is because society makes it happen.
What is wrong with you? Your talking about stuff that is totally unrelated to anything im talking about. And your talking about stuff I already agree with. Of course, someone built trucks and cars and houses and invented and innovated them and we work, and some of our work plays a role in helping to make those things and then we pay money to buy those things. Of course. But, im not responsible for your health, you wear the mask. Whats so hard about that?
Society says that property and land ownership are your right.
So if society decided that its no longer my right, would society be right then? NO it would not.
Society enforces your rights by providing police and courts so that you can protect your ownership rights. If not, then you'd be left to defend your property and with certainty someone bigger and stronger than you would come along and take everything you have. Maybe make you his vassal or serf. What prevents that is society.
[STAFF EDITED]
That's not a fact, that's a lie. Tyranny is not government. Government is instituted by God. Romans 13 explains it clearly - I don't know if you believe God's Word on this but here's what God says in His Holy Word:
Romans 13
1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:
4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.
6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.
7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.
Now, if you can show me Biblically how earthly government is "tyranny" for enforcing God's justice then please feel free. From what I see, earthly government is not "tyranny" but rather God's ordained ministers unto His Justice and rebellion against them brings damnation upon the rebel.
I didnt say OR mean that ALL FORMS of government are tyranny. But holding me responsible for your health IS tyranny.
