Why are Christians so incredibly deceived about scripture?

[yeshuaslavejeff]

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[Goatee]

Jesus said nothing about upper casing or lower-casing his words.
The Jews considered their tradition "Sacred" and even Christ admits "The sit in the seat of Moses" when pronouncing their traditions.

The wild speculation that the Jews were merely claiming "common - non-sacred" status for their traditions - goes against every historic document on the subject.

Then you need to read a bit more as you have missed out a lot.

 

[Goatee]

Yes, again, this is your claim - but you can only defend your claim with man's tradition,
while I rest entirely on what YHWH(GOD) says to RELY ON (HIM and HIS WORD - plain truth) and not on man/men.

You rely on 'mans' interpretation. Thus, 'your' interpretation. You rely on what 'you' think is correct. Thus, mans!

 

[Goatee]

My heart goes out for you...living in your legalistic I have to merit my way into heaven bondage.

As do we all. We have to earn our way to heaven. Jesus said to pick up your cross and follow him. We all have to do that my friend. The road is not an easy one to tread.

 

[BobRyan]

Yes, correct. Jesus was on about 'tradition', not 'Tradition'. Sacred Tradition is very much different.

Jesus said nothing about upper casing or lower-casing his words.
The Jews considered their tradition "Sacred" and even Christ admits "The sit in the seat of Moses" when pronouncing their traditions.

Matthew 23:2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
Matthew 23:3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

The wild speculation that the Jews were merely claiming "common - non-sacred" status for their traditions - goes against every historic document on the subject.

Then you need to read a bit more as you have missed out a lot.

Since you quote nothing to support your speculation - I assume you too know that your statement is not true in real life.

At least we both agree - when we have the text - we post it.

 

[Goatee]

As far as they have posted online in this forum,
they don't think they can know they are saved until after they die.
According to what we know from YHWH'S WORD, that is too late to find out, and they don't get a second change./chance.
i.e.
I haven't heard them say you could be saved on earth,
therefor you couldn't lose your salvation on earth. (see?).

Everyone must do their very best while on earth to make sure they have a chance of being saved. If you do your best and follow Jesus then you have a good chance of reaching heaven.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

...moved to private chat...

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

...moved to private chat...

 

[Goatee]

Yes, again, this is your claim - but you can only defend your claim with man's tradition,
while I rest entirely on what YHWH(GOD) says to RELY ON (HIM and HIS WORD - plain truth) and not on man/men.

But, you are relying solely on 'your' own interpretation of what you are reading. You say what you understand is coming straight from God. I hope it is for you. Truly i do.

But, be careful as the devil is a good deceiver! Don't rely on just your own mind. Remember, you are relying on 'mans' interpretation as you are relying on your own mind!!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Rubbish as Catholic dont believe in once saved always saved! We have confession. We know one needs to repent and not sin again.

How many times did Jesus say to forgive? 77 x 7?

Surely Jesus was not talking about holy living here. Also, Jesus realizes that there are people who honestly do struggle with sin (and yet they do not make excuses for it).

For if you belief says that no man can live holy then the future existence of 144,000 is a contradiction for you (See Revelation 14:3-5).


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[yeshuaslavejeff]

...moved to private chat...

 

[Goatee]

If you think interpretation means something
it does not mean,
and cannot hear the SHEPHERDS CLEAR VOICE,
then
what do you hope in ?

And why not ask YHWH(THE CREATOR) to be able
to hear HIS VOICE? (HE DELIGHTS TO REVEAL HIS SALVATION TO BABES ! and says in JESUS OWN WORD THAT HE HIDES IT FROM THE LEADERS you said you trust in).

HIS VOICE and HIS WORD are absolutely more sure and certain than

the other things that are opposed to HIM and against HIS WORD.

Be careful my friend that it is indeed the true shepherd that you can hear! Test and test again! But how will you test if you are blinded by the evil one?

Tread carefully buddy. I am happy to have Scared Tradition and Sacred Scripture to fall back on. Driven by the Holy Spirit. Blessing buddy

 

[-57]

No. It's double talk because you said before that you do not have to do anything to be saved. This is basically telling a person that they can live however they like (Which does not promote a person to live righteously or to be fruitful for their LORD).

You don't seem to get the obvious... The bible tells us in Eph 2...As for you, you were dead in your trespasses and sins,

You can't save yourself...God has to make you alive again. You can't make yourself alive again.

Now a warning....If you present FALSE statements like this again...after already been told what you are saying is not what I am saying...you will be reported.

"This is basically telling a person that they can live however they like (Which does not promote a person to live righteously or to be fruitful for their LORD)"

That is not my teaching but false words you are putting into my mouth.

My position is this....READ IT SEVERAL TIMES.

Salvation PRODUCES good works in a Christian. If someone is living the life that you suggest above they probably are not saved.

GOT IT?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

As for me..All my sins have been forgiven and my salvation is secure forever.

Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only." (James 2:24).
"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone." (James 2:17).
"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).
"If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing," (1 Timothy 6:3-4).
"...God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble." (James 4:6).
"And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him." (Hebrews 5:9).
"Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord" (Hebrews 12:14).
"If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha." (1 Corinthians 16:22).
"If ye love me, keep my commandments." (John 14:15).
"Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls." (James 1:21).
"But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: For there is no respect of persons with God." (Romans 2:8-11).
"For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved." (John 3:20).
"What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? (Romans 6:1-2).
"...but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments." (Matthew 19:17).


Verses on the Error of Christians saying they cannot not walking uprightly:

Jesus says,

"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven" (Matthew 5:16).

Jesus also says,

"You give glory to my Father when you produce a lot of fruit and therefore show that you are my disciples." (John 15:8 GW).

And Peter says,

"Be careful to live properly among your unbelieving neighbors. Then even if they accuse you of doing wrong, they will see your honorable behavior, and they will give honor to God when he judges the world." (1 Peter 2:12 NLT).

Paul says,

"That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;" (Philippians 2:15).


Now, how on Earth does the "all my future sins are forgiven" and "We are saved despite doing nothing" type belief make any sense with the above Scripture?

The short answer is that it doesn't make any sense.
But you are free to explain it if you like.


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[yeshuaslavejeff]

...moved to private chat...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You don't seem to get the obvious... The bible tells us in Eph 2...As for you, you were dead in your trespasses and sins,

You can't save yourself...God has to make you alive again. You can't make yourself alive again.

Now a warning....If you present FALSE statements like this again...after already been told what you are saying is not what I am saying...you will be reported.

"This is basically telling a person that they can live however they like (Which does not promote a person to live righteously or to be fruitful for their LORD)"

That is not my teaching but false words you are putting into my mouth.

My position is this....READ IT SEVERAL TIMES.

Salvation PRODUCES good works in a Christian. If someone is living the life that you suggest above they probably are not saved.

GOT IT?

Let's just cut to the chase. Do you believe you can die in one unrepentant sin like lying or lusting after a woman and still be saved?


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[-57]

If you sin you are automatically forgiven? lol

I have been given the righteousness of Christ when ALL of my sins were imputed to Jesus at the cross.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

...moved to private chat...

 

[Goatee]

YHWH'S WORD says not to rely on yourself or your own understanding.
Rely on HIM and HIS WAY in Y'SHUA .

If you admit to relying on men, men who are opposed to YHWH and against YHWH'S WORD often,
where will that get you ?

So, instead , do what YHWH says - RELY ON YHWH by grace and faith in Y'SHUA --- no one is more faithful than YHWH.

And many of the ones you rely on (you have said frequently) have proven false.(directly contrary to YHWH'S WORD).

The CC has fantastic Spiritual guidance. Born from the Holy Spirit. Like all walks of life, there is also good and bad in it. This is where we seek the right path through Jesus. Jesus guides us. We are his sheep. He will never let us down.

To rely on Sola Scriptura is to be lost in the wilderness. Man wrote the Bible. But only through the voice of God. Man 'tries' to go it alone and interpret Holy Scripture on his own, thinking God is guiding him. Woe to him that is blindly led!

 

[-57]

All sins are absolved in confession as if you know the Catholic confession you would know what is said in there and what it means.

You cannot sin and not repent. Jesus sent out his Apostles to forgive sin. Our priests carry out that same ministry today.

I'll trust in the blood of Christ for the removal of my sins rather than the say-so of a priest.