Why am I paying for someone else's sin?

[Non sequitur]

Eve, then Adam...

 

[Faulty]

The only sin you'll be held responsible for is your own, and that only if you insist on paying the penalty yourself, but you don't have to.

 

[Non sequitur]

The only sin you'll be held responsible for is your own, and that only if you insist on paying the penalty yourself, but you don't have to.

But if their sin was their choice (their choice in going against God), why didn't it end with them?

 

[Mediakira]

With Christ we are not paying for Adam and Eve's sins anymore. Christ died to help us. What really happened is that Satan intervined and caused them two to sin.

The reasons for Satan's action is that he is jealous of us humans. He hates and likes us to be destroyed. Cause many diseases, violents in our hearts to cause hate. He affects everyone. He'll even mimic anyone, and control people. Just like God does. Satan isn't suppose to interfer us. But he does it to test God and make us sin. Fall from God's grace.

Jesus came down to see what was really going on. Because Satan loves to hid. Jesus came down to save us and finds Satan doing his cruel intentions on us humans. And explaining the real truth to us, and make us understand what is really going on between Heaven and earth.

He died on the cross to mark the earth with His blood. Making us realize our sins. And mostly to know God and the Satan. The WAR that is happening between God and Satan. Satan has done heavy crimes against Heaven and is WANTED! After Jesus has died, he he helped us go to Heaven like He died. He is our salvation! A gift from God. Because God loves us all! He wants to save us from the law that's happen from Adam and Eve. That is already been paid. All we have to do is believe in Jesus and follow his word. Get baptised and pass Jesus's words and help God's people!

If you have anymore Questions. I don't mind helping you.

 

[lucaspa]

Eve, then Adam...

You're not. Scripture is very plain that you can only be punished for your sin.

Deut. 24:16 "The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the
children be put to death for the fathers

2Chron.25:4 "But he slew not their children, but [did] as [it is] written in the law in the book of Moses, where the LORD commanded, saying, The fathers shall not die for the children, neither shall the children die for the fathers, but every man shall die for his own sin."

Paul states several times in letters that Jesus died for our sins. Not Eve's, not Adam's.

 

[Non sequitur]

With Christ we are not paying for Adam and Eve's sins anymore. Christ died to help us. What really happened is that Satan intervined and caused them two to sin.

The reasons for Satan's action is that he is jealous of us humans. He hates and likes us to be destroyed. Cause many diseases, violents in our hearts to cause hate. He affects everyone. He'll even mimic anyone, and control people. Just like God does. Satan isn't suppose to interfer us. But he does it to test God and make us sin. Fall from God's grace.

Jesus came down to see what was really going on. Because Satan loves to hid. Jesus came down to save us and finds Satan doing his cruel intentions on us humans. And explaining the real truth to us, and make us understand what is really going on between Heaven and earth.

He died on the cross to mark the earth with His blood. Making us realize our sins. And mostly to know God and the Satan. The WAR that is happening between God and Satan. Satan has done heavy crimes against Heaven and is WANTED! After Jesus has died, he he helped us go to Heaven like He died. He is our salvation! A gift from God. Because God loves us all! He wants to save us from the law that's happen from Adam and Eve. That is already been paid. All we have to do is believe in Jesus and follow his word. Get baptised and pass Jesus's words and help God's people!

If you have anymore Questions. I don't mind helping you.

Um...

We are/can be sinful, because of their original sin/transgression.

Why didn't it end with them, and each newborn person was born they way they were originally?

 

[lucaspa]

But if their sin was their choice (their choice in going against God), why didn't it end with them?

Because the story is an allegory. I'm assuming you know what an allegory is. It's where you have individuals represent a group. Think Aesop's fables, like the Ant and the Grasshopper. The Ant represent those people who are careful to save for possible bad things to happen in the future. The Grasshopper represents people who spend everything they have and never save.

Adam = Dirt and Eve = Hearth. That helps make the allegory plain. Adam and Eve stand for each and every one of us. We all disobey God at some point (OK, many points). Each of us sins. Each of us needs a Savior.

 

[Non sequitur]

You're not. Scripture is very plain that you can only be punished for your sin.

Deut. 24:16 "The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the
children be put to death for the fathers

2Chron.25:4 "But he slew not their children, but [did] as [it is] written in the law in the book of Moses, where the LORD commanded, saying, The fathers shall not die for the children, neither shall the children die for the fathers, but every man shall die for his own sin."

Paul states several times in letters that Jesus died for our sins. Not Eve's, not Adam's.

What are our sins and how did we get them, and didn't Eve and Adam bring sin into our world?

Did sin already exist or did it have a start?

 

[drich0150]

Eve, then Adam...

You have you own sin. Sin that you are not worthy to "pay."

 

[Mediakira]

Because the story is an allegory. I'm assuming you know what an allegory is. It's where you have individuals represent a group. Think Aesop's fables, like the Ant and the Grasshopper. The Ant represent those people who are careful to save for possible bad things to happen in the future. The Grasshopper represents people who spend everything they have and never save.

Adam = Dirt and Eve = Hearth. That helps make the allegory plain. Adam and Eve stand for each and every one of us. We all disobey God at some point (OK, many points). Each of us sins. Each of us needs a Savior.

Sure, But don't forget the serpent that made Eve eat the fruit of Knowledge. That was forbidden. That made God turn away from them.

 

[Non sequitur]

Irrelevant, because even without Adam and Eve's sin, you committed personal sin yourself. You're not paying for Adam/Eve's sins, but because of them you are subject to sin. If you view it metaphorically, Adam/Eve don't even matter and only your personal sins (which you've committed) do.



Irrelevant, see above answer. If you view the story metaphorically, it didn't have a start; it always existed (history will show you that evil has always existed).

If someone creates the internet, then everybody has no choice but to use the internet and then they simultaneously all get penalized for using the internet... well, that's just how it is?

And we're all supposed to go, "We can't blame the inventor of internet. We all need to accept that, while we didn't actually choose to be in the situation we are in, it's fair that we should be held accountable for being in it."

I don't even care if there is a way to not be penalized, the situation itself is just despicable and I would never align myself with an ideology that deemed itself unworthy of the Great Situation Maker and Rule Creator.


Jesus or God isn't my life raft. They are the ones that pushed me overboard.

 

[Non sequitur]

Sure, But don't forget the serpent that made Eve eat the fruit of Knowledge. That was forbidden. That made God turn away from them.

I thought the serpent coerced her into doing so. If he made her, then she was under duress.

Wait, n/m.

You two talk about it.

 

[Mediakira]

My main reasoning is that Satan pretty much took over earth. In Matthew 4:9 Satan was telling Jesus he will give back everything if Jesus would bow down to him as King.

Starting with Adam and Eve he pretty much persuade them to eat the forbidden fruit. Which God forbid them to eat. When they ate the fruit. They broke the Heavenly law. Gave men knowledge, and sin. Then God left them. He never appeared again. Giving Satan more time to ruin of what God has made.

 

[CryptoLutheran]

Eve, then Adam...

You're not.

Original Sin. <-- dominant Western theological view

Ancestral Sin. <-- dominant Eastern theological view

Neither says one pays for (i.e. is condemned for) the sin of another (including Adam's); rather both theological positions attempt to account for the root cause of sinfulness, positing that either:

Through Original Sin we inherit the fallen, corrupted human nature which we receive from Adam (that is, we inherit a humanity like the postlapsarian Adam). The problem, therefore, is that the essence of our humanity is stained, fallen, broken.

Through Ancestral Sin we live in a world--in an environment--where sin is inevitable. Man as representative of creation has, in some sense, permitted the entire created order to become oppressed under the tyranny of sin, death, and the devil (etc); and we are now having to live with the consequences of that ancient tragedy.

In neither case are you or I held accountable to anyone's actions other than our own. Historic Christian teaching is clear on this, each one of us, when we stand before God in the Judgment, will have to give an account for what we did or what we failed to do. No one is held accountable for what Adam did other than Adam himself.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Emmy]

Dear Non sequitur. You had some good replies, may I just answer to: " I like your Christ I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." You cannot speak for all Christians, and you have only met some. Christians are at different stages, of trying to become like Christ. Thank God that we have a loving God, and God can see our hearts, God knows how seriously we are trying, to be worthy to be called Christians. I am sure that worldwide you would find many Christian men and Christian women, who are seriously trying to become as selflessly-loving as Jesus is telling us in Matthew, chapter 22, verses 35-40: Everything we say or do, will become more and more loving, caring, kind, not puffed up, and forgiving as God has forgiven us. I say this with love, Non sequitur. Greetings from Emmy, sister in Christ.

 

[Non sequitur]

You're not.

Original Sin. <-- dominant Western theological view

Ancestral Sin. <-- dominant Eastern theological view

Neither says one pays for (i.e. is condemned for) the sin of another (including Adam's); rather both theological positions attempt to account for the root cause of sinfulness, positing that either:

Through Original Sin we inherit the fallen, corrupted human nature which we receive from Adam (that is, we inherit a humanity like the postlapsarian Adam). The problem, therefore, is that the essence of our humanity is stained, fallen, broken.

Through Ancestral Sin we live in a world--in an environment--where sin is inevitable. Man as representative of creation has, in some sense, permitted the entire created order to become oppressed under the tyranny of sin, death, and the devil (etc); and we are now having to live with the consequences of that ancient tragedy.

In neither case are you or I held accountable to anyone's actions other than our own. Historic Christian teaching is clear on this, each one of us, when we stand before God in the Judgment, will have to give an account for what we did or what we failed to do. No one is held accountable for what Adam did other than Adam himself.

-CryptoLutheran

In both cases you refer to there being a catalyst ("inherit the fallen... receive(d) from Adam" or "consequences of tragedy"), so it's illogical to say that the effect has no bearing on the cause.

Without one, we would not have had the other.

Either way, both the situations are allowed to be the unfortunate situation that we find ourselves in... by your god.

 

[Non sequitur]

Dear Non sequitur. You had some good replies,

Thanks.

... may I just answer to: " I like your Christ I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." You cannot speak for all Christians, and you have only met some. Christians are at different stages, of trying to become like Christ. Thank God that we have a loving God, and God can see our hearts, God knows how seriously we are trying, to be worthy to be called Christians. I am sure that worldwide you would find many Christian men and Christian women, who are seriously trying to become as selflessly-loving as Jesus is telling us in Matthew, chapter 22, verses 35-40: Everything we say or do, will become more and more loving, caring, kind, not puffed up, and forgiving as God has forgiven us. I say this with love, Non sequitur. Greetings from Emmy, sister in Christ.

I take it you are just commenting on my signature, even though it wasn't a question.

You, yourself, could say, "I like Non Sequitur, I do not like your atheists. Your atheists are so unlike Non Sequitur."

I am not speaking for Christians, but am making an observation about them.

 

[Ishraqiyun]

The effects of sin influence the very environment we live in. That is simply the nature of reality. If I blow up a bomb in my house it might also level my next door neighbors house. Is it "fair"? Maybe, maybe not. Fair or not we have to live with it.

 

[solarwave]

You don't. You sin because you are imperfect and choose to. You are imperfect because of your biology and the influence of culture. Adam and Eve didn't exist.

 

[Non sequitur]

The effects of sin influence the very environment we live in. That is simply the nature of reality. If I blow up a bomb in my house it might also level my next door neighbors house. Is it "fair"? Maybe, maybe not. Fair or not we have to live with it.

The undeniable answer to that question is, "No. That's not fair."

If bombs and/or our ability to make them (sin) never existed, then you wouldn't have blown up your house (sin influence), therefore you couldn't have leveled your next door neighbors house

It would be rather short sighted to say: "We have to live with it" and not question the person that allowed this as your only situation.