Whom He Wills, He Hardens

[Mr. M]

Romans 9:14-18 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not! For He says to Moses, I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion. So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth. Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens.

There are those on occasion who try to use a passage such as this to claim that Our Father is random and capricious. Here is why that does not track. First, the Pharaohs claimed to be god in the flesh, and with the backing of the priesthood, ruled capriciously under that guise. Secondly, the Lord sent Moses to speak to one particular Pharaoh, and his response was:

Exodus 5:
1 Afterward Moses and Aaron went in and told Pharaoh, Thus says the Lord God of Israel:
Let My people go, that they may hold a feast to Me in the wilderness.
2 And Pharaoh said, Who is the Lord, that I should obey His voice to let Israel go?
I do not know the Lord, nor will I let Israel go.

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men...

That grace is received by believing His report...
Isaiah 53:1 Who has believed our report?
And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?

...and activated by faith.

Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God
must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

Therefore, I conclude that the hearts of men are hardened by their own unbelief, not the capricious act of an angry God.
Mark 16:14 Later He appeared to the eleven as they sat at the table;
and He rebuked their unbelief and hardness of heart,
because they did not believe those who had seen Him after He had risen.

 

[bling]

Romans 9:14-18 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not! For He says to Moses, I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion. So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth. Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens.

There are those on occasion who try to use a passage such as this to claim that Our Father is random and capricious. Here is why that does not track. First, the Pharaohs claimed to be god in the flesh, and with the backing of the priesthood, ruled capriciously under that guise. Secondly, the Lord sent Moses to speak to one particular Pharaoh, and his response was:

Exodus 5:
1 Afterward Moses and Aaron went in and told Pharaoh, Thus says the Lord God of Israel:
Let My people go, that they may hold a feast to Me in the wilderness.
2 And Pharaoh said, Who is the Lord, that I should obey His voice to let Israel go?
I do not know the Lord, nor will I let Israel go.

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men...

That grace is received by believing His report...
Isaiah 53:1 Who has believed our report?
And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?

...and activated by faith.

Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God
must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

Therefore, I conclude that the hearts of men are hardened by their own unbelief, not the capricious act of an angry God.
Mark 16:14 Later He appeared to the eleven as they sat at the table;
and He rebuked their unbelief and hardness of heart,
because they did not believe those who had seen Him after He had risen.

The same actions which at the same time can, softens one person's heart can harden another person's heart, so God will still do the action and we can say God softened a heart and God hardened a heart. The hardened heart person at judgement cannot say: "God made me hell bound", since the actions God did can and should soften the heart of a willing person.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

The same actions which at the same time can, softens one person's heart can harden another person's heart, so God will still do the action and we can say God softened a heart and God hardened a heart. The hardened heart person at judgement cannot say: "God made me hell bound", since the actions God did can and should soften the heart of a willing person.

It is because those who believe not are condemned already through Adam's rebellion against God. Through out the ages since Adam, God has given ample opportunity for people to believe and trust in Him. The Old Testament is full of Jesus Christ to be revealed to those who want to search, and the New Testament is full of the good news of the Gospel for those who decide to put their trust in the Crucified Christ.

But there are those who will not believe in spite of the signs of creation around them and the Scriptures that are available for all to read. All mankind is in the prison of sin awaiting judgment and hell, and if they decide to stay in the prison, their condemnation will be fulfilled. God doesn't have to do anything except open the prison door through the evidence of creation and the promises in Scripture.

In the Old Testament, God appointed prophets to show them the open door of salvation. In the New Testament He set up the ministry of Evangelist to point out the door and how to go through it. He doesn't take anyone's hand to guide them to and through the door. That would not involve faith on the part of the person. He who comes to God must believe that He exists and is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

The problem is that most refuse to believe God nor will they seek Him. That's what Paul said in Romans, "There are none who will seek Him." What this means is that they will remain condemned, and when they come before the Great White Throne of judgment, they will know that they are guilty and condemned before they refused God's offer of grace.

Those who believe in and trust in Christ, according to Romans 8:1 are no longer condemned because Jesus Christ has paid their debt of sin and are therefore free by the law of the spirit of life in Christ from the law of sin and death.

So God doesn't have to do anything to condemn unbelievers because they are condemned already. Therefore God is totally righteous when He does nothing to saved them except to open the prison door so they can go through it and be free.

 

[bling]

It is because those who believe not are condemned already through Adam's rebellion against God. Through out the ages since Adam, God has given ample opportunity for people to believe and trust in Him. The Old Testament is full of Jesus Christ to be revealed to those who want to search, and the New Testament is full of the good news of the Gospel for those who decide to put their trust in the Crucified Christ.

But there are those who will not believe in spite of the signs of creation around them and the Scriptures that are available for all to read. All mankind is in the prison of sin awaiting judgment and hell, and if they decide to stay in the prison, their condemnation will be fulfilled. God doesn't have to do anything except open the prison door through the evidence of creation and the promises in Scripture.

In the Old Testament, God appointed prophets to show them the open door of salvation. In the New Testament He set up the ministry of Evangelist to point out the door and how to go through it. He doesn't take anyone's hand to guide them to and through the door. That would not involve faith on the part of the person. He who comes to God must believe that He exists and is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

The problem is that most refuse to believe God nor will they seek Him. That's what Paul said in Romans, "There are none who will seek Him." What this means is that they will remain condemned, and when they come before the Great White Throne of judgment, they will know that they are guilty and condemned before they refused God's offer of grace.

Those who believe in and trust in Christ, according to Romans 8:1 are no longer condemned because Jesus Christ has paid their debt of sin and are therefore free by the law of the spirit of life in Christ from the law of sin and death.

So God doesn't have to do anything to condemn unbelievers because they are condemned already. Therefore God is totally righteous when He does nothing to saved them except to open the prison door so they can go through it and be free.

So, you blame Adam and Eve for your being hell bound?

Would that also mean every child from conception is hell bound?

God is providing tons of opportunities, but our hearts (different soils in the parable) determine how and if we cease these opportunities to help us grow or wither.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

So, you blame Adam and Eve for your being hell bound?

Would that also mean every child from conception is hell bound?

God is providing tons of opportunities, but our hearts (different soils in the parable) determine how and if we cease these opportunities to help us grow or wither.

That's what the Bible tells me, and I take it seriously. But I'm no longer hell bound, because I repented and received Christ as my Saviour. He paid my debt of sin on the Cross, and so old things passed away and all things became new for me.

 

[bling]

That's what the Bible tells me, and I take it seriously. But I'm no longer hell bound, because I repented and received Christ as my Saviour. He paid my debt of sin on the Cross, and so old things passed away and all things became new for me.

What verses are you using to show all babies are hell bound from conception?
Blame Adam and Eve takes the guilt off of you, and those forgiven little Love little (Luke 7)

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

What verses are you using to show all babies are hell bound from conception?
Blame Adam and Eve takes the guilt off of you, and those forgiven little Love little (Luke 7)

This is a controversial topic and I don't know the answer to it. All I know is that once outside of Christ I was condemned to be on the road to hell, but the Holy Spirit stepped in and introduced me to the Gospel, which I believed, and was changed from death to life in Christ.

 

[Der Alte]

@Watchman1 @bling

Romans 4:15​

(15) Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.​

Romans 5:13​

(13) (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.​

Romans 2:14​

(14) For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:​

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

@Watchman1 @bling

Romans 4:15​

(15) Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.​

Romans 5:13​

(13) (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.​

Romans 2:14​

(14) For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:​

So? I don't see your point in these out-of-context Bible quotes.

 

[Der Alte]

So? I don't see your point in these out-of-context Bible quotes.

Evidently you do not understand what "out-of-context" means. I quoted the vss, completely nothing out-of-context about them. Try a little courtesy and I will explain.

 

[Fervent]

To me it seems there's an unnecessary shift that often takes place in understanding what it means for God to "harden" someone. Looking at the story in Exodus, it seems clear that the "hardening" was a strengthening of the Pharaoh's will, rather than an imposition upon it. So God hardening whom He will is not saying God capriciously condemns people, but that it is His prerogative to give some the strength to stick to their will of opposition despite the consequences that come with it.