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No, I don't want to change a word of the Bible... I want people to accept that the context of Western industrial urbanised society is different to that of semi nomadic bronze age desert dwelling herders... and that therefore, attempts to overlay their moral and ethical structure onto our society requires more understanding than just saying "well the Bible SEZ!"
Maybe thats because you havent got a clue what the Bible is. Firstly the condemnation of same-sex sex wasnt just to God's people in the deser, it was also to God's people amongst the Greek and Roman cultures. Secondly as I keep reminding you believers believe Biblical testimony of Jesus Christ in the NT believe what God has said is the truth. I accept from what you are saying that you dont want to change the Bible, but you also clearly dont believe it.
Sure what God has said is the truth... but what is in the Bible and what God has said are not necesarily the same thing.
The information we have about Jesus does come from the Bible and also from other Gospels that have been discovered and were never included in the Bible, such as the Gospel of Thomas. Scholars have attempted to discern what statements attributed to Jesus in the Bible and in these other Gospels were statements that he actually probably made. I base my understanding of what Jesus said on the work of these scholars.
Because God is inerrant, the Bible isn't. Therefore, the Bible isn't the word of God.
Ok but you said you don’t believe the Bible is the word of God so in what capacity do you believe the information that comes form the Bible. How do you know which bits to believe and which bits not to believe, apart from our feelings. because without believing all the testimony of Jesus Christ one cant believe in Him for who He says He is.
which have been discovered? How do you know the Gospel of Thomas wasn’t one of the writings discarded when the cannon of scripture was decided.
Ah ok then that is cult Christianity.
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I answered your question in another thread. Scholars can and do use the Bible as a primary historical source. In doing that, you have to be careful to try to determine what information may be historically accurate and what in the Bible is a story, a piece of fiction, and what is something in between. One way to do this is to compare the accounts in the Bible with accounts from other sources. Another way is to consider the accounts in the Bible in the light of archeological evidence. Another way is to look for internal consistencies or inconsistencies in the Bible itself. I think we do have to treat the Bible as a historical source, with all of the problems and questions and uncertainties that this kind of source raises for scholars.
I will call myself Christian as I choose, my friend. You don't get to decide what I call myself. That's up to me. If you want to dismiss me as a "cult Christian," then fine. I don't care what you think of my Christianity. Your opinion of my beliefs does not matter. I do care that some Christians continue to use the Bible to try to justify slandering and throwing stones at gay people. Doing that is immoral.
That means nothing the scholars could be Muslims. Muslims refer to the Bible, but as corrupted. I am talking about Christians, and Christian scholars, Christians being the ones who believe the Bible.
No that’s no use at all, many have done that and seen the other sources as false and unreliable, hence that’s why the Bible is as it is.
Fair enough my friend, I will call you ‘not a Christian’ and ‘not gay’ either. My reason is a Christian is someone who believes in the Jesus Christ of the Bible and there is no consensus of scientific evidence to support people being homosexual , certainly not genetically anyway
uhmmm not to interrupt but that first part is a rule violation here. I understand you're talking here but if it stays like that it could get reported. You might want to find a different way of getting your point across without getting the whole thread shutdown. Just a sugestion.
Thus starting flame wars. My point was it could close the thread. I know you believe it and I'm not trying to change your mind, I'm just asking if you could find another way to express your opinion that doesn't violate a rule. So now you have decided to label me not Christian and not gay?
