Who is prepared for the tax hike?

[SummerMadness]

That's not how any of this works.

 

[grasping the after wind]

As with most GOP presidents, 146 million Americans have been able to enjoy a bit of relief the past 4 years of not having the fruits of their labor taken from them in as much as the previous administration. In my own personal case, it amounts to about $300/mo. Considering Biden promised to cancel the Trump tax cuts, and thus raise taxes on not just the wealthy, but the rest of us as well, are you making any financial changes or preparation in the losses that are to be expected from this incoming administration?

Rich New York State resident will be getting a federal tax cut not a tax hike when they are again allowed to deduct state taxes from their taxable income. The poor and middle class of NY state will have to help pay for that with the increased taxes.

 

[RocksInMyHead]

I'm going to delve into this further when I'm off kid duty, but I must ask, how many people do you personally know that is on welfare assistance of some sort and has been for 2 years or more?

From what I've been able to tell, you should be paying little to nothing in taxes if you qualify for welfare. The most generous program is SNAP, which sets a limit of $2311/month gross for a family of three. That works out to $27,732 for the year. Married filing jointly, your standard deduction is $24,800, meaning that you'd have $2988 in taxable income, on which you'd owe $300 in income taxes. However, there's also a $2000 child tax credit, of which $1400 is refundable.

So someone making the maximum monthly income to qualify for SNAP with a family of three would actually owe zero taxes and would receive an additional $1400 on top of any tax refund from payroll deductions. At least in theory - I'm not a CPA or tax lawyer. If you have friends on welfare who are actually being crushed by taxes, then either they're not doing their taxes correctly or they're dealing with back taxes. Which is kind of their fault.

 

[gaara4158]

Maybe not for every case, but I've got too many personal acquaintances/neighbors proving that's exactly how it is for many.

Are you saying you know people who are taxed so much their net income puts them below the poverty line? Or are you saying availing oneself of social programs locks one into a cycle of inescapable poverty? Either of these cases would require a much more detailed explanation than “I know someone who this is true for.”

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I feel like there's a lot of misconceptions about the "tax cuts"/"tax increases" conversation (regards to income tax) that stem from either

A) people not understanding the numbers, and just going off of what a pundit tells them
B) people telling anecdotes that are outright false (like the ones coming from people who try to make it sound like the republican tax plan just totally changed their life for the better, or claim that the democratic tax plan is somehow magically going to put them in the poor house, when you know they make $35k/year changing truck tires for a living)

First and foremost...here are the numbers:

I'm still waiting for a cogent explanation for how a person with an income of $40-50k (who complains about democrats wanting to raise the top tax rates)...somehow magically had their life transformed for the better by the republican tax plan, or how their world will be shattered if it goes back to the previous structure...

...and I'm definitely waiting to hear a good argument against the Biden tax plan from someone who's not even in the group that's going to be targeted by it.

As a general rule, I prefer lower taxes and less government spending, but when a person (who you know doesn't make nearly the amount that it would take to actually be impacted by it) is griping about it... it comes across looking silly. "How dare the democrats try to tax the hypothetical 400k/year that I don't make but hope to some day!"

 

[Larniavc]

We need to abandon this, "I got mine," attitude seen in so much of the GOP.

But that is literally how the American dream works. By making sure no one else has access to want you want.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Rich New York State resident will be getting a federal tax cut not a tax hike when they are again allowed to deduct state taxes from their taxable income. The poor and middle class of NY state will have to help pay for that with the increased taxes.

Wrong! Eliminating Trump's punitive SALT deduction cap will have no effect on anyone except those (like me) currently punished by the SALT deduction cap.

Trump enacted it solely to punish high tax (largely blue) states, not to help poor or middle class people anywhere. Middle class?!? I'm middle class! Trump hurt middle class homeowners with this change.

 

[loveofourlord]

When 146M Americans are taxed to keep the poor in systemic poverty, that's not any "good" that I'm wanting to see us pay for.

Yeah it's people being taxed, not that most jobs don't have to pay a living wage to work for them.

 

[Belk]

As with most GOP presidents, 146 million Americans have been able to enjoy a bit of relief the past 4 years of not having the fruits of their labor taken from them in as much as the previous administration. In my own personal case, it amounts to about $300/mo. Considering Biden promised to cancel the Trump tax cuts, and thus raise taxes on not just the wealthy, but the rest of us as well, are you making any financial changes or preparation in the losses that are to be expected from this incoming administration?

Good. Maybe we can actually fund some of the massive ongoing expenses instead if burdening the next generations with it.

 

[disciple Clint]

Of course not. trump increased (past tense) the US deficit by a huge amount, plunging not only us but future generations into extreme debt.

GOOD RIDDANCE!!

That is nothing compared to what the taxes are going to have to be to bail out the cities and states that have been poorly managed, provide free medical for all illegal aliens and everyone else, provide free college and all those other free things that help people get elected but have to be paid for by someone.

 

[GreekOrthodox]

I'm going to delve into this further when I'm off kid duty, but I must ask, how many people do you personally know that is on welfare assistance of some sort and has been for 2 years or more?

I was on welfare for 3 years, 2007 to 2010. Getting off of welfare is difficult because at a certain point, you lose benefits at a higher cost than the income to replace it. I once was to get a raise of say $500 a month. However, that put me in a new bracket and I would have lost my family's health care from the state. Since I worked for a small company, they had a pretty poor health insurance package which would have cost me $750 a month. Basically, I worked out that I couldnt get off welfare by ordinary raises, but had to make a leap of faith to a new job which paid significantly more. There was a lot of fear involved because once you go off welfare, it is very difficult to get back on it if things go south.

 

[Vylo]

I'm going to delve into this further when I'm off kid duty, but I must ask, how many people do you personally know that is on welfare assistance of some sort and has been for 2 years or more?

Anymore? I've fallen out of contact with probably the only one left as he had permanent injuries. Everyone else I know who used such programs it was temporary before they got new employment. None of the others remained on disability/unemployment/etc for more than a year.

 

[98cwitr]

I was on welfare for 3 years, 2007 to 2010. Getting off of welfare is difficult because at a certain point, you lose benefits at a higher cost than the income to replace it. I once was to get a raise of say $500 a month. However, that put me in a new bracket and I would have lost my family's health care from the state. Since I worked for a small company, they had a pretty poor health insurance package which would have cost me $750 a month. Basically, I worked out that I couldnt get off welfare by ordinary raises, but had to make a leap of faith to a new job which paid significantly more. There was a lot of fear involved because once you go off welfare, it is very difficult to get back on it if things go south.

I think you hit the nail on the head here. It's that fear that keeps people from taking that leap. If I may pry a bit, what's your completed level of education (or was, at the time)?

 

[KCfromNC]

Maybe not for every case, but I've got too many personal acquaintances/neighbors proving that's exactly how it is for many.

I strongly doubt you have 146 million personal acquaintances, so the backtracking from your previous claim is noted.

 

[98cwitr]

Anymore? I've fallen out of contact with probably the only one left as he had permanent injuries. Everyone else I know who used such programs it was temporary before they got new employment. None of the others remained on disability/unemployment/etc for more than a year.

Our church has a program that has put me into relationship with several families (working, but severely underemployed) as well as a few neighbors who are receiving benefits. There is a common fear between them all that in the event they were to make more money via gainful employment, that they would lose said benefits. All but one example are unmarried, but with children. It's not that they are unable to work, but unwilling out of fear. That fear is created by the system that both supplies just enough to give a sense of satisfaction, but enough dependence to create that fear.

Private charity is better equipped, as it creates relationships and aims to get people out of poverty. Instead of the threat of loss if you improve, improvement is promoted via relationship building and setting realistic goals. Is it education the person lacks? That can be taken care of without taxing 146M Americans to do it.

Scripture tells us that charity should not be compulsory (2 Cor. 9:7), and thus I am convinced that it's charging the state to do the church's job.

 

[98cwitr]

I strongly doubt you have 146 million personal acquaintances, so the backtracking from your previous claim is noted.

You're missing the context in which I was speaking.

 

[KCfromNC]

You're missing the context in which I was speaking.

I don't believe I was. Hence my attempts to bring facts to the empty rhetoric.

 

[98cwitr]

I don't believe I was. Hence my attempts to bring facts to the empty rhetoric.

Obviously I was referring to those whom I am acquainted with who receive welfare benefits; and not all tax payers.

 

[hedrick]

The kinds of perverse incentives for not making too much that people have cited don't apply to the normal income tax. (I haven't looked t see how realistic those fears are, because it's not relevant to the topic of this thread.) Restoring the pre-Trump rates, particularly if it's only for upper income levels, will not have that kind of effect. The main reason for doing it is that we couldn't afford the cuts. They were justified as paying for themselves. But every Republican administration tries that, and it never works.

 

[Vylo]

Our church has a program that has put me into relationship with several families (working, but severely underemployed) as well as a few neighbors who are receiving benefits. There is a common fear between them all that in the event they were to make more money via gainful employment, that they would lose said benefits. All but one example are unmarried, but with children. It's not that they are unable to work, but unwilling out of fear. That fear is created by the system that both supplies just enough to give a sense of satisfaction, but enough dependence to create that fear.

Private charity is better equipped, as it creates relationships and aims to get people out of poverty. Instead of the threat of loss if you improve, improvement is promoted via relationship building and setting realistic goals. Is it education the person lacks? That can be taken care of without taxing 146M Americans to do it.

Scripture tells us that charity should not be compulsory (2 Cor. 9:7), and thus I am convinced that it's charging the state to do the church's job.

This is something that can be solved through education if we would stop gutting it.