Who has read the Book of Mormon?

[Moodshadow]

Let me see if I have this right: you love your family just enough to call them family here but you don't love them enough to where you want to spend the eternities with them?

Doctrines and/or church affiliations notwithstanding, that question is disgusting, demeaning, shamefully presumptuous, and abominably insulting.

 

[LegacyJB]

Doctrines and/or church affiliations notwithstanding, that question is disgusting, demeaning, shamefully presumptuous, and abominably insulting.

Lol it's a question. It's about how Christians view families.

 

[Moodshadow]

Lol it's a question. It's about how Christians view families.

And now, in addition to the humiliating disrespect exhibited in your earlier post, you add mockery with this expression of mirth? Have you no shame at all? Whatever happened to "...benevolent, virtuous, and doing good to all men?"

 

[Ran77]

Do Mormons believe in hell? Who goes there?

Not in the traditional sense. There is Outer Darkness, but only the Sons of Perdition would be sent there. And there are very few who have committed sins grievous enough to be Sons of Perdition.

 

[southcountry]

You're misunderstanding what is taught here. Jesus was not talking about all marriages, he was referring to that specific case. Such a marriage was called a Levitical Marriage. It was tradition. The lesson learned here is a traditional marriage will break at death because it's not bound by God. A marriage bound by God, however, will stand throughout the eternities. Like I said, a heaven with no family is a hell. I'm grateful for the knowledge that families can be together forever. How do you feel knowing you believe you will have zero claim on your children?

mmksparbud is correct, you really have to distort what Jesus taught to get LDS theology to fit. Well, it just doesnt fit.

If we look at the Book of Enoch, which, if I am not mistaken, Jesus himself had quoted, we find this which speak of the watchers "angels":


Chapter 15
2Wherefore have you forsaken the lofty and holy heaven, which endures for ever, and have lain with women; have defile yourselves with the daughters of men; have taken to yourselves wives; have acted like the sons of the earth, and have begotten an impious offspring?
3You being spiritual, holy, and possessing a life which is eternal, have polluted yourselves with women; have begotten in carnal blood; have lusted in the blood of men; and have done as those who are flesh and blood do.
4These however die and perish.
5Therefore have I given to them wives, that they might cohabit with them; that sons might be born of them; and that this might be transacted upon earth.
6But you from the beginning were made spiritual, possessing a life which is eternal, and not subject to death for ever.
7Therefore I made not wives for you, because, being spiritual, your dwelling is in heaven.




Gender is the way of this world, meant for procreation, it is not an attribute of angels, neither is marriage, which was meant to sanctify carnal instinct while on this planet.

 

[southcountry]

Let me see if I have this right: you love your family just enough to call them family here but you don't love them enough to where you want to spend the eternities with them?

I do not now nor ever will understand this mindset.

If you were to adopt a child, would you not love that child just as much as any other member of your family? Sure you would. Im not questioning that.

Have you ever had a friend you would take a bullet for? I have.

What I am questioning is the logic of the sealing. We are supposed to love each other equally. Doesnt matter who they are or where they come from. That persons soul on the other side of the planet should mean just as much to you than your own blood relatives. This is one problem I have with these atrocious wars we are involved in right now, but thats another subject.....well, actually, no its not.

And this is what Jesus taught to love your neighbor as much as yourself.

 

[southcountry]

I am speaking of after this life, not while we are on earth in physical bodies. God wants us to marry on earth, it is why he invented it, we are to populate the earth, people have sexual desires but these are all natural, physical acts - not happening in the spiritual realm outside of our natural bodies.

Are you not aware we are all one family? It will be even more so when this time on earth as we know it is done.

This doctrine is false, it doesn't exist, the Mormons made it up. In the temple, people can be married to dead people, it goes on and on.

I think its hard for them to understand this concept......Jesus had the same problems back then.

 

[Moodshadow]

I do not now nor ever will understand this mindset.

If you were to adopt a child, would you not love that child just as much as any other member of your family? Sure you would. Im not questioning that.

Have you ever had a friend you would take a bullet for? I have.

What I am questioning is the logic of the sealing. We are supposed to love each other equally. Doesnt matter who they are or where they come from. That persons soul on the other side of the planet should mean just as much to you than your own blood relatives. This is one problem I have with these atrocious wars we are involved in right now, but thats another subject.....well, actually, no its not.

And this is what Jesus taught to love your neighbor as much as yourself.

Exactly. When we see people of any age in serious need of comforting, or seriously ill or injured and in need of a physician's care, or people who are suffering because they are lonely or homeless or war-torn - the list could go on and on - aren't we deeply moved because of our innate, God-given sense of brotherhood and humanity and caring? It doesn't have to be people who are related to us by blood; we want to help them because they breathe and they hurt, just like we do. Jesus Himself said the first and greatest commandments are to love God with all our hearts, mind, might and strength, and to love our neighbors as ourselves. He actually didn't even mention family members in that, though of course it is implicit. The idea of sealings to spouses and extended family is purely LDS; you will find it nowhere in the teachings of Jesus. In whose society could Jesus very often be found? That of the lepers and the lame and the blind and others whom the sanctimonious hypocrites would have nothing to do with. That was his message: to love and to help and to serve and to heal. How sad it is for any religion now to insist on inventing its own version of the Mosaic law, with all the ceremonies and rites and contrived rituals, forgetting the beautiful simplicity of what Jesus really taught.

 

[Jake255]

Let me see if I have this right: you love your family just enough to call them family here but you don't love them enough to where you want to spend the eternities with them?

I don't understand this mindset either. This is just one of many, many issues Mormon's do not understand about Jesus and the Bible, you just have been taught wrong.

Did you know - and please have an open mind -

Jesus came to redefine the term family. Remember when he asked, "who is my mother and brothers?" He answered himself with, "they who do my Father's will are my mother, brothers and sisters".

That's the redefining moment, we should not only love our spouses, blood relatives, children - but in the same manner, we love those in Christ. We are all adopted into the family of God. We are one family, there are no spouses in heaven, no aunts, no uncles - we all share one another equally because we are the Body of Christ. We edify one another - all of us together as One.

There is no separation as the Body, you are trying to separate it into "family units", this is a natural human concept and you are thinking with a natural mind, not a spiritual mindset.

 

[Jake255]

I think its hard for them to understand this concept......Jesus had the same problems back then.

Yes, I agree.

In my previous post, I tried explaining what Jesus did to the term "family" - he redefined it. The only way a person can grasp this spiritual concept is with a spiritual mind - without that kind of mind, people just aren't going to get it.

 

[Norah63]

Love covers a multitude of sins.
This thread of who has read the book of Mormon has turned into something else.
To me reading of the wonderful savior and how many are blessed by reading about Him, is a good thing.
If reading this book is not helpful for some then dont read.

 

[southcountry]

I don't understand this mindset either. This is just one of many, many issues Mormon's do not understand about Jesus and the Bible, you just have been taught wrong.

Did you know - and please have an open mind -

Jesus came to redefine the term family. Remember when he asked, "who is my mother and brothers?" He answered himself with, "they who do my Father's will are my mother, brothers and sisters".

That's the redefining moment, we should not only love our spouses, blood relatives, children - but in the same manner, we love those in Christ. We are all adopted into the family of God. We are one family, there are no spouses in heaven, no aunts, no uncles - we all share one another equally because we are the Body of Christ. We edify one another - all of us together as One.

There is no separation as the Body, you are trying to separate it into "family units", this is a natural human concept and you are thinking with a natural mind, not a spiritual mindset.

This is what scares me so much about Mormonism, its when you get right down to the final detail, it doesnt match what Jesus taught.

In fact it grounds one into a materialistic future complete with rituals and ceremonies.

 

[southcountry]

Love covers a multitude of sins.
This thread of who has read the book of Mormon has turned into something else.
To me reading of the wonderful savior and how many are blessed by reading about Him, is a good thing.
If reading this book is not helpful for some then dont read.

I thought about not posting because of thread derailment, but the original poster seemed to not mind, and also I figured if God was directing it to go elsewhere, then I would respond.

 

[LegacyJB]

I don't understand this mindset either. This is just one of many, many issues Mormon's do not understand about Jesus and the Bible, you just have been taught wrong.

Did you know - and please have an open mind -

Jesus came to redefine the term family. Remember when he asked, "who is my mother and brothers?" He answered himself with, "they who do my Father's will are my mother, brothers and sisters".

That's the redefining moment, we should not only love our spouses, blood relatives, children - but in the same manner, we love those in Christ. We are all adopted into the family of God. We are one family, there are no spouses in heaven, no aunts, no uncles - we all share one another equally because we are the Body of Christ. We edify one another - all of us together as One.

There is no separation as the Body, you are trying to separate it into "family units", this is a natural human concept and you are thinking with a natural mind, not a spiritual mindset.

That's funny because marriage being eternal is a doctrine taught by the ancient apostles, specifically Peter.

Jesus came to redefine the family? Weird. I thought He came to ransom man from sin through His redeeming sacrifice.

Oh, you mean like your trinity belief? OK. So you believe we'll become one massive Trinity. Is that it?

Thinking about the togetherness of the family IS the spiritual mindset. No God, except a powerless one, would not allow marriage to be eternal. Why did the Savior tell Peter that whatever he bound on earth would be bound in heaven? If a marriage is bound on earth by God's authority it shall be bound in heaven. Do you believe Jesus was fooling Peter? Is a marriage that is bound on earth by proper authority not bound in heaven?

Only in Jesus Christ's church is the doctrine of eternal marriage found. This is true doctrine and I say it by the name of Christ Himself. If I were to believe death breaks marriage I would be saying God is not Almighty.

 

[South Bound]

And anyone who does not agree is accused of not truly reading it with an unbiased and open heart.

In another thread, I responded with evidence from four Mormon sources. He still accused me of using anti-Mormon propaganda.

And one of the sources was the Book of Mormon, itself! Imagine my surprise to find out that the Book of Mormon, the Articles of Faith, and James Talmage are all anti-Mormon propaganda.

So don't feel too bad when he dismisses what you say. He does that with everybody who says something he doesn't like.

 

[LegacyJB]

And now, in addition to the humiliating disrespect exhibited in your earlier post, you add mockery with this expression of mirth? Have you no shame at all? Whatever happened to "...benevolent, virtuous, and doing good to all men?"

I'm loving yet I'm also blunt. I'm to the point. I asked the question I did because that's what it seems like so I wanted clarification. No disrespect intended, none shown. I can't imagine how any Christian can believe families can't be eternal. That is a very cold belief derived from the Adversary.

 

[South Bound]

Good job on something you got from someone else. How many people use this? I've lost count. Instead of the one verse you need to read that with the 2 verses before and after. The dark skin was not the curse. If you actually take it in the context it's in instead of just repeating what every critic says you'd know this. The curse was being cut off from God. The dark skin was a marking and nothing more, not the curse.

Actually, Jacob 3:5 makes it pretty clear that the curse was not merely being "cut off from God", but the blackening of their skin:

Behold the Lamanites your brethren, whom ye hate because of their filthiness and the cursing which hath come upon their skins.

Please note that the curse, according to Jacob 3:5 doesn't say that the curse was directed at their relationship with God, but upon their skin.

Good try, though.

 

[LegacyJB]

Actually, Jacob 3:5 makes it pretty clear that the curse was not merely being "cut off from God", but the blackening of their skin:



Please note that the curse, according to Jacob 3:5 doesn't say that the curse was directed at their relationship with God, but upon their skin.

Good try, though.

It wasn't a "try", it was accuracy. The source talked about was 2 Nephi. I know the Book of Mormon quite well. You can't and won't because you do not believe in it. You don't believe in it therefore your reading does not come from the Spirit of God.

 

[Moodshadow]

Oh, you mean like your trinity belief? OK. So you believe we'll become one massive Trinity. Is that it? Yet more of your insulting sarcasm? It's getting really, really old. No one said or even hinted anything about one massive trinity - that is your own derisive invention.

Thinking about the togetherness of the family IS the spiritual mindset. No God, except a powerless one, would not allow marriage to be eternal. Why did the Savior tell Peter thank whatever he bound on earth would be bound in heaven? If a marriage is bound on earth by God's authority it shall be bound in heaven. Do you believe Jesus was fooling Peter? Is a marriage that is bound on earth by proper authority not bound in heaven? You do realize, don't you, that since all of this is purely LDS doctrine, it is therefore not very helpful except to those who are LDS - and they already know it?

Only in Jesus Christ's church is the doctrine of eternal marriage found. This is true doctrine and I say it by the name of Christ Himself. If I were to believe death breaks marriage I would be saying God is not Almighty.

Would you be kind enough to point out for us, then, where in the Bible - or even in the Book of Mormon, or the Pearl of Great Price, or the Doctrine and Covenants - it tells when Jesus Christ, being the Great Exemplar, set the standard by obeying this great commandment Himself by participating in His own eternal marriage sealing while He was on the earth?

 

[South Bound]

It wasn't a "try", it was accuracy.

Jacob 3:5 disagrees with you.

The source talked about was 2 Nephi. I know the Book of Mormon quite well.

You haven't really appeared to know it that well in any of the threads I've participated in with you. To the contrary, in another thread, several of us had to correct you and then, when I quoted the BoM to you, you didn't even recognize it as the BoM. You said it was "anti-Mormon propaganda".

You can't and won't because you do not believe in it. You don't believe in it therefore your reading does not come from the Spirit of God.

I don't believe my reading has to come from the Mormon perception of the "Spirit of God" in order to know the difference between being "cut off from God" and "the cursing which hath come upon their skins."

incidentally, I noticed that when you quoted me, you omitted Jacob 3:5, the verse from the Book of Mormon that shows that the curse was on their skin.

So I'll repeat it for those reading along:

Behold the Lamanites your brethren, whom ye hate because of their filthiness and the cursing which hath come upon their skins.