Who does this verse refer to?

[OldWiseGuy]

Romans 9:25
As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

 

[seventysevens]

Romans 9:25
As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Referring to the Gentiles which would be grafted into and be considered spiritual Israel

 

[Halbhh]

Romans 9:25
As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Answered above I see, but also I'm reminded of the parable of the wedding banquet, in which the initially invited (Israel) are largely not responding, and so the guest list is radically expanded (to include such as you and me!). It's also got a good further message -- we must change our raiment, dress in Christ and doing His words to us.

 

[Dave-W]

Referring to the Gentiles which would be grafted into and be considered spiritual Israel

True on the first part, wrong on the 2nd.

It is talking about gentiles, but there is no such thing as a "spiritual Israel."

Grafted in gentiles become part of a "commonwealth of Israel," which is not the same thing.

Ephesians 2:12
remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

 

[seventysevens]

True on the first part, wrong on the 2nd.

It is talking about gentiles, but there is no such thing as a "spiritual Israel."

Grafted in gentiles become part of a "commonwealth of Israel," which is not the same thing.

Ephesians 2:12
remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

I do not push any spiritual Israel but many people interpret it that way(amil) because the true Israel rejected Messiah Jesus and as such the Good News of the Messiah has come and the Gentiles received and accepted Messiah when Israel rejected Him , so if you choose to google what is spiritual Israel you will see what I meant - I do not support any level of replacement theology such as what is being pushed alot here on the forum

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Romans 9:25
As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

osee meaning Hosea
Hosea 2:23
And I will sow her for Myself in the land; And I will have compassion on Lo-ruhamah, And I will say to Lo-ammi, You are My people; And they will say, My God.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Referring to the Gentiles which would be grafted into and be considered spiritual Israel

Why would the author of Romans mention this verse in Hosea in regard to the Gentiles?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

osee meaning Hosea
Hosea 2:23
And I will sow her for Myself in the land; And I will have compassion on Lo-ruhamah, And I will say to Lo-ammi, You are My people; And they will say, My God.

So Loruhamah and Loammi represent Gentile peoples?

 

[keras]

The clearest expression of the identity of the People of God of the New Covenant is found in 1 Peter 2:9-10 But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God’s own people, in order that you may proclaim the mighty acts of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light. Once you were not a people, but now you are God’s people; once you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy.

Romans 9:24-25 We [Christians] are the recipients of God’s mercy, whom He has called from among the Jews and Gentiles, for as Hosea says: Those who were not My people, I will call My people…..sons of the Living God.​

This new People of God are bonded together by the sacrifice of the life of Jesus and the gift of his Spirit dwelling in their hearts, re-creating, directing, activating and motivating them from within. Paul’s letter to Titus speaks clearly of the influence of the Holy Spirit given at the rite of baptism, the first sacrament of Christian initiation: From the goodness and loving kindness of God; our Saviour appeared and He saved us, not because of any works of righteousness that we had done, but according to His mercy, through rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit. This Spirit he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Saviour, so that, having been justified by his grace, we would become heirs according to the hope of eternal life, Titus 3:5-7

Note that Hosea 2:23 says the Lord will sow His people in the holy Land. This refers to the great Second Exodus, when all of God's people will live in peace and prosperity in all of His Land. Ezekiel 34:11-31,

 

[Hank77]

I do not push any spiritual Israel but many people interpret it that way(amil) because the true Israel rejected Messiah Jesus and as such the Good News of the Messiah has come and the Gentiles received and accepted Messiah when Israel rejected Him , so if you choose to google what is spiritual Israel you will see what I meant - I do not support any level of replacement theology such as what is being pushed alot here on the forum

Not all amil people believe in replacement theology. I know several who don't.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

So Loruhamah and Loammi represent Gentile peoples?

It pictures the sowing of the seed of His own in the earth, unlike Israel that planted a piece of paper of ownership buried that meant to establish that they would return from captivity, this is a spiritual seed. That's why Jezreel, the seed of God which He will sow is used in vs 22

 

[mozo41]

every son borne of GOD ....

 

[Revealing Times]

Referring to the Gentiles which would be grafted into and be considered spiritual Israel

Gentile "CHURCH" but I get the point, just wanted to clarify.

 

[seventysevens]

Why would the author of Romans mention this verse in Hosea in regard to the Gentiles?

Israel is called the chosen people of Almighty God - this would include also those whose reject Jesus as they are among the chosen people of God - and the scripture say outright that the people in reference to " I will call them my people, which were not my people;" the Gentile people were not among the 'chosen people of God' and thus included in the "not my people "
Somewhat literal and somewhat not - which may make it more confusing so ---
It is reference to people who actually accept the Lord through faith and not necessarily by heritage

23 What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory— 24 even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles? 25 As he says in Hosea:
“I will call them ‘my people’ who are not my people; and I will call her ‘my loved one’ who is not my loved one,
26 and,“In the very place where it was said to them, ‘You are not my people,’ there they will be called ‘children of the living God

27 Isaiah cries out concerning Israel: “Though the number of the Israelites be like the sand by the sea, only the remnant will be saved

28 For the Lord will carry out his sentence on earth with speed and finality.

29 It is just as Isaiah said previously: “Unless the Lord Almighty had left us descendants,
we would have become like Sodom, we would have been like Gomorrah.”

30 What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith;

31 but the people of Israel, who pursued the law as the way of righteousness, have not attained their goal. 32 Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone.

33 As it is written: “See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes people to stumble and a rock that makes them fall, and the one who believes in him will never be put to shame.

 

[Hank77]

So Loruhamah and Loammi represent Gentile peoples?

The Jews and indirectly the Gentiles who are saved by the Jewish Messiah. If it did not include the Gentiles Paul would not have used it in his argument for the salvation of both Jew and Gentile.

Rom 9:23 and that He might make known the riches of His glory on vessels of kindness, that He before prepared for glory, whom also He did call--us--
Rom 9:24 not only out of Jews, but also out of nations,

 

[seventysevens]

Not all amil people believe in replacement theology. I know several who don't.

Agree , but the vast majority that I have met and hear them speak do ,

 

[Danoh]

Romans 9:25
As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Good question.

That is a passage that MANY misinterpret.

But basically, in Romans 9-11, Paul is contrasting between what it appears has become of Israel in the sight of God, and what their actual status is in His sight.

In Romans 9, he sets out to establish some basic rules of thumb for properly understanding that, together with examples of their application.

He starts out by making use of an example from Israel's past in which God did what He did, not only because He alone is Soverign, but because it showed that He alone is Sovereign.

Having established that, Paul then goes on to some examples from Israel's past in which God had not only warned Israel He would be turning from them in His wrath for their rebellion, but had told them He would do something absent of them during His turn from them, but had also told them, that after that He would THEN punish them, afterwhich He would THEN bless them...at last.

Thus Romans 9: 25's "As he saith ALSO in O see..."

Paul is NOT saying Hosea had Prophesied verse Romans 9:24, rather, he brings Hosea up as one MORE example of....

Times in Israel's past wherein though it had looked like God was through with Israel, actually, he was / is NOT.

Rather, He is merely doing something else that He had planned on doing, first, once more...

Note that that is the VERY issue not only that all three chapters begin with - the issue of "wait a minute, what about ISRAEL!" - but that all three chapters end with.

Answer?

He is not through with Israel.

Rather, as in their past, it just looks that way again - As he saith ALSO in O see...

Its why Romans 11 ends with all that rejoicing by Paul, in the God of HIS fathers...

Nevertheless, Rom. 14:5 towards ya, in memory of Romans 5: 6-8 - in each our stead.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Note that Hosea 2:23 says the Lord will sow His people in the holy Land. This refers to the great Second Exodus, when all of God's people will live in peace and prosperity in all of His Land. Ezekiel 34:11-31,

Why do you think this means "the holy land"?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

It pictures the sowing of the seed of His own in the earth, unlike Israel that planted a piece of paper of ownership buried that meant to establish that they would return from captivity, this is a spiritual seed. That's why Jezreel, the seed of God which He will sow is used in vs 22

So Jezreel refers to Gentiles?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Israel is called the chosen people of Almighty God - this would include also those whose reject Jesus as they are among the chosen people of God - and the scripture say outright that the people in reference to " I will call them my people, which were not my people;" the Gentile people were not among the 'chosen people of God' and thus included in the "not my people "
Somewhat literal and somewhat not - which may make it more confusing so ---
It is reference to people who actually accept the Lord through faith and not necessarily by heritage

23 What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory— 24 even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles? 25 As he says in Hosea:
“I will call them ‘my people’ who are not my people; and I will call her ‘my loved one’ who is not my loved one,
26 and,“In the very place where it was said to them, ‘You are not my people,’ there they will be called ‘children of the living God

27 Isaiah cries out concerning Israel: “Though the number of the Israelites be like the sand by the sea, only the remnant will be saved

28 For the Lord will carry out his sentence on earth with speed and finality.

29 It is just as Isaiah said previously: “Unless the Lord Almighty had left us descendants,
we would have become like Sodom, we would have been like Gomorrah.”

30 What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith;

31 but the people of Israel, who pursued the law as the way of righteousness, have not attained their goal. 32 Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone.

33 As it is written: “See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes people to stumble and a rock that makes them fall, and the one who believes in him will never be put to shame.

But the reference in Hosea isn't about the Gentiles but refers specifically to "the house of Israel" (the northern kingdom).