Who Changed Genesis?

[DamianWarS]

So you think a jot and a tittle is different than an iota and a keraia?

An iota is a Greek letter not a Hebrew character. Your argument is that Christ specifically references the Hebrew so must have been referring to a Hebrew text. He probably spoke in Aramaic but what is revealed to us aren't the Aramaic words but the Greek and what is referenced is based on Greek letters not Hebrew and there is no argument that links it specifically to a Hebrew base text as you suggest.

 

[Minister Monardo]

Whatever happened to the Sadducees, the opponents of the Pharisees? I find it interesting that we don't hear of them anymore.

I smell a Hegelian Dialectic; but I'm not going to follow the scent.

Yeshua told them "You do greatly err, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God." The End.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Right... The text still doesn't say "jots and tittles"

In our current bibles it says that unless you don't read and write English or something.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Right... The text still doesn't say "jots and tittles"

I was paraphrasing. The King James says,

"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."
(Matthew 5:18).​

So the text says "jot" and "tittle."

 

[HARK!]

Yeshua told them "You do greatly err, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God. The End.

The end? What about his covenant with them? Did he even have a covenant with the Pharisees?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

An iota is a Greek letter not a Hebrew character. Your argument is that Christ specifically references the Hebrew so must have been referring to a Hebrew text. He probably spoke in Aramaic but what is revealed to us aren't the Aramaic words but the Greek and what is referenced is based on Greek letters not Hebrew and there is no argument that links it specifically to a Hebrew base text as you suggest.

Nobody speaks or writes biblical Hebrew or Greek anymore.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I ended up watching the whole series. He makes some convincing arguments. He was doing great up until the end; when he started hugging the KJV.

I am glad you liked most of it.

 

[DamianWarS]

In our current bibles it says that unless you don't read and write English or something.

In the KJV you mean a 500 year old translation written in a dead earlier form of English.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The irony in this post is amazing.

Your not convincing me with showing me otherwise.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

In the KJV you mean a 500 year old translation written in a dead earlier form of English.

1600's English is not so dead of a language that a person cannot read and understand it. You cannot read and understand Hebrew or Greek at all unless you had a Lexicon. With the 1600's English you can understand most of the words (because it is technically still English), and any words you don't understand you can check in a dictionary that is not religiously biased.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

In the KJV you mean a 500 year old translation written in a dead earlier form of English.

You may have seen this thread before, but just in case, there are several reasons that the KJV is the divinely inspired perfect Word of God for our day.

Reasons why I believe the KJV is the divinely inspired perfect Word of God.

 

[DamianWarS]

I was paraphrasing. The King James says,

"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."
(Matthew 5:18).​

So the text says "jot" and "tittle."

The translation says "jot and tittle" other translations don't say this.

 

[HARK!]

I am glad you liked most of it.

He made some very impressive arguments. Now, anyone touting the reliability of the LXX will have an uphill battle with me. I'm going to save a link to the video to my files.

(CLV) 1Th 5:21
Yet be testing all, retaining the ideal.

 

[DamianWarS]

Nobody speaks or writes biblical Hebrew or Greek anymore.

Apparently those who translate the bible do, including those who translated the KJV.

 

[DamianWarS]

1600's English is not so dead of a language that a person cannot read and understand it. You cannot read and understand Hebrew or Greek at all unless you had a Lexicon. With the 1600's English you can understand most of the words (because it is technically still English), and any words you don't understand you can check in a dictionary that is not religiously biased.

Living languages change, dead language don't. Latin for example is still spoken but its a dead language because it doesn't change. The English in the KJV is dead and not spoken any more (nor is it taught in general ed) pass a KJV to a millennial and see how well they understand it.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Apparently those who translate the bible do, including those who translated the KJV.

But they are not with us anymore. It was 47 translators who worked on the KJV. They also double checked their work in groups. No other translation is ever like it. All the Modern Translations come from the other line of manuscripts that have been corrupted Codex Vaticanus and the Codex Sinaiticus. The KJV comes from the pure line of manuscripts (Which is the Textus Receptus).

 

[HARK!]

But they are not with us anymore. It was 47 translators who worked on the KJV. They also double checked their work in groups. No other translation is ever like it. All the Modern Translations come from the other line of manuscripts that have been corrupted Codex Vaticanus and the Codex Sinaiticus. The KJV comes from the pure line of manuscripts (Which is the Textus Receptus).

The Textus Receptus doesn't stand to textual criticism.

 

[Minister Monardo]

Whatever happened to the Sadducees, the opponents of the Pharisees? I find it interesting that we don't hear of them anymore.

You asked the question. I was not cutting them off from covenant with God as Jews in my answer.
I was saying that Yeshua dismissed their doctrines. That's what made them Sadducees, not being Jews.

 

[Tra Phull]

Jots and tittles - I had always considered them to be IOTA SUBSCRIPTS and BREATHING MARKS which are used in Koine Greek for specific purposes. Breathing marks are either rough or smooth.

These are what jots and tittles are to me.

I had always believed the Septuagint to be quoted more often by Jesus and apostles than Masoretic texts. This is the common view of most scholars, IMHO.

Those who poo-poo the Septuagint and exalt the KJV beyond all reason may have been influenced by John Connor, who went back in time on many occasions, spending whole weekends in Qumran, and several times disputed with Sadducees, embarrassing them so bad their movement went kaput after Temple destruction.

Watchers are good angels, if some of them fell, I have no knowledge of that.

If their are Hebrew marks of grammar that relate to JOTS AND TITTLES, I wouldn't know that either - I studied Greek and not Hebrew, and JOTS AND TITTLES match perfectly to me what iota subscriptions and rough and smooth breathing marks are.

Perhaps there are good Terminators and bad Terminators; good Watchers and bad Watchers.

John Connor also makes many time trips to get to the bottom of who changed Genesis.

Theophilus to whom Luke addressed his Gospels and Acts may have been a real guy, but possibly the name is figurative and simply means LOVER OF GOD.

Occam held this position once he quit shaving.

 

[Tra Phull]

Subscripts, not subscriptions - I have no edit feature