Where does scripture say God wants us to be sick?

[Carlos Vigil]

The Bible!

James' father was Joseph,

WHERE......in the bible does it say ..."James' father was Joseph ?

Jesus and James had different fathers...

Yes... that is quite clear.

and this is what makes them half brothers. Both of them may have been raised by Joseph, but Joseph was only responsible for causing James to be born, not Jesus.

AGAIN......WHERE in the bible do you read THAT ?

Don't you realize that in addition to having different fathers, Jesus and James also had different mothers ?

or do you have one of those bibles that "IMPLY" what you propose ?

 

[Strong in Him]

The Bible! We know that Jesus was concieved in Mary's womb by the Word of God sent to her by an angel.

Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit.
Matthew 1v20:

"Joseph, do not be afraid to take Mary as your wife, because what is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit"

Luke 1v35:

"The Holy Spirit will come upon you and the power of the most high will overshadow you."

This means God was Jesus' physical Father. God is the one who provided the perfect DNA that made up Jesus. The Blood running through Jesus' veins was perfect Blood because no sinful earthly father provided this blood. When you study a little about medical science, you'll find that the blood of a child is provided by the father, not the mother.

God was Jesus' Father, but Jesus was human too. He was fully human and fully God. As a human being he got tired, hungry, thirsty, lonely etc etc, and was capable of sinning - though he didn't.
Hebrews 4v15:

"For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathise with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way .... yet was without sin".

Joseph was not Jesus' father, but Mary, a human being, was still his mother. Jesus' conception was different, but he developed and was born the same as any other baby. So before birth it was Mary's body that nourished him, he was attached to her by his umbilical cord. If he contained only perfect blood, some of that must have either passed to Mary during his pregnancy, or she must have had perfect blood herself. If a mother's blood group is incompatible to that of the child's, her body may reject the foetus as a "foreign body". Although maybe it's ok for a first child, I'm not sure. Are you saying that Mary was perfect too?

And "the blood of a child is provided by the father"??? Er .. I know anatomy and physiology were never my strong point, but I've never heard that before. Possibly a person takes their blood group from their father - though I'm not sure about that either - but blood itself is made in the same way that it is always made. I'll have to brush up on this and get back to you, it's too early in the morning yet!

 

[Maccie]

When you study a little about medical science, you'll find that the blood of a child is provided by the father, not the mother.

Indeed no! Blood is made by the developing foetus. The blood group can be inherited from either the father or the mother. The nutrition from the mother is passed through the placenta, plus various antibodies, and possibly hormones. Blood is not exchanged directly.

There can be problems when the mother is rhesus negative and the child is rhesus positive, though not with the first child. Subsequent children can be affected, and sometimes the pregnancy is aborted spontaneously.

I think its you who should be studying medical science.

 

[Strong in Him]

Thanks Maccie,

I'm afraid my biology is a little rusty. (Actually that's an understatement, it was rusty 20 years ago, and has been going downhill since)
I'm not too sure what Rock was saying about blood and fathers, I assumed he/she meant blood groups, but I had a look on the web and couldn't find anything that said that we get our father's blood group - as you said .


Rock, we'll never know how the Holy Spirit caused Jesus to be conceived. Normally blood type is established by genes inherited from both parents:

"These two genes determine your blood type by causing proteins called agglutinogens (a-GLOO-tin-a-gins) to exist on the surface of all of your red blood cells." (Quote from an internet site cos I'm not very good at explaining!)

Obviously God doesn't have a blood group, and no one will ever know what blood group Jesus was.
I can't remember what your point with all this was?

 

[Rockrz]

Indeed no! Blood is made by the developing foetus. The blood group can be inherited from either the father or the mother. The nutrition from the mother is passed through the placenta, plus various antibodies, and possibly hormones. Blood is not exchanged directly.

There can be problems when the mother is rhesus negative and the child is rhesus positive, though not with the first child. Subsequent children can be affected, and sometimes the pregnancy is aborted spontaneously.

I think its you who should be studying medical science.

Well, if that were actually true, I know several medical doctors that should not be practicing medicine!

 

[Strong in Him]

Well, if that were actually true, I know several medical doctors that should not be practicing medicine!

What's untrue about it?

 

[Rockrz]

How do you put God's word into your spirit?
How do you go about acting on God's word to prevent sickness?
I mean, what are the specific actions you do? Thanks

Basically it's a lifestyle that centers around what God says as being true. It starts with a decision and a realization...

First, you have to realize that it actually IS God's will for mankind to live above sin, darkness, death, etc. God didn't create this world full of these things because it was not in Him to put mankind in the middle of the trash we have currently on this planet. Go read what God created for mankind in Genesis and see and understand that it was good, not evil. The New Testament is full of promises that give you the right to be healthy and free from all forms of darkness. Just because bad things exists in the world, does not mean God intends for you to have all this destruction in your life.

A great example is salvation...just because a bunch of people all over the world are rejecting God and His Christ, doesn't mean it's God's will for them to go to hell and it doesn't mean God hasn't already provided salvation for them (see 2 Corinthians 5:19, and Romans 5:18)

Then, you would need to make a decision that "I'm going to be healthy, according to the promise made to me in scripture". This is what you did to get saved, now this is what you do to be healthy! But, you have to realize that Galatians 6:7,8 is true...what you sow is what you're going to reap. You can believe healthy and divine protection all day long, and it won't work for you if you don't exercise, eat well, and get plenty of sleep and plenty of water. If you abuse your body with junk food and never exercise, then eventually you'll get sick because that's the seeds you sowed. It doesn't mean God didn't want you well, it simply means you were putting the wrong fuel in your body.

The thing to do is gather up all the healing scriptures and for the rest of your life, pull them out everyday during your prayer time (you do have prayer time early in the morning? Those who seek Him early find Him!) and read them outloud and give God praise and thanksgiving that His Word is true and you have been blessed with healthy and protection! One of the major cornerstones of a victorious lifestyle is continual Praise and Thanksgiving flowing from your lips to God concerning His Word being true in your life!

Psalms 8:2 - Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings hast thou ordained strength (praise) because of thine enemies, that thou mightest still the enemy and the avenger.

After all this, you need to consider becoming spiritually minded instead of carnally minded (meat head!) Read and study Romans chapter 8, especially the 1st chapter. Being spiritually minded is literally thinking according to the way God thinks according to the promises He has given us in the Word. Thinking like God, does not include any defeat whatsoever! If you experience setbacks in life, get up and get back on God's Word and ask Him for wisdom according to James 1:5,6. If you miss it and there appears to be failure, it's not God's fault or the Words fault...it's something that you've missed and you need God to reveal to you where you missed it so He can teach you.

Don't make the mistake of listening to the devil who will tell you that God's Word cannot be trusted and it won't work for you, or God doesn't want you to be healed because He's trying to teach you something. The devil will have a ton of lies for you when you start looking at God's Word closely to act like it is true. Study Mark chapter 4, verses 4 thru 20, and you will find that the devil only has 5 things he can use to choke God's Word so it becomes unfruitful...BUT you're the one who controls whether these things enter your spirit, or not.

Jesus said to take heed (carefully consider) what you hear in Mark 4:24, so very selective about what you watch and listen to. Faith to be healthy comes by hearing...and hearing comes by the Word of God (Romans 10:17) so it's very important to confess the promises as being true for you now...because they are. You are simply saying what God has already said about you, which should only be offensive to the devil (and those that haven't a clue)

And, always remember...

Galatians 6:9 - let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.

Er, I think you just committed a formal heresy. The Jesus is the Word. Not "was conceived by".

There you go again, getting the only exercise you get....jumping to conclusions and running down your neighbors! We are talking about Jesus' physical life here on earth, not His overall existance. You gotta pay attention to the conversation here!

Jesus and James also had different mothers?

I've never seen that in the Bible, so you'll have to share that with the class. I've only seen the Bible say Jesus had a brother named James, which normally means they grewup in the same household together, which would lead one to believe they were born of the same mother. Mary did have other kids. The Bible doesn't say anything about Mary sleeping around with different men. I don't think she was loose with her caboose, but I could be wrong.

And "the blood of a child is provided by the father"??? Er .. I know anatomy and physiology were never my strong point, but I've never heard that before.

Hey, if you don't believe Jesus' shed Blood for our sins was the pure, perfect Blood of God just come out and say so! Go call your doctor and ask him where the blood comes from when to humans get together and have a baby...he will tell you the blood comes from the father...

 

[Maccie]

Hey, if you don't believe Jesus' shed Blood for our sins was the pure, perfect Blood of God just come out and say so! Go call your doctor and ask him where the blood comes from when to humans get together and have a baby...he will tell you the blood comes from the father...

rock, you are way, way wrong here. You just could not be more wrong! Maybe it would be a good idea if you just confined yourself to things you know.

I am giving two quotes from www.spuc.org.uk which is the Society for the Protection of the Unborn Child, a pro-life, anti-abortion organisation.

The baby is connected to the placenta by the umbilical cord, the lifeline channelling nourishment in and taking wastes out, which will be cut close to the baby's abdomen at birth and will leave the mark of the navel. During pregnancy the baby obtains oxygen from the mother's blood via cord and placenta, so does not drown in the surrounding fluid.

"By 30 days, just two weeks past mother's first missed period, the baby - one quarter of an inch long - has a brain of unmistakable human proportions, eyes, ears, mouth, kidneys, liver, an umbilical cord and a heart pumping blood he has made himself."
Though what this has to do with "claiming healing" I really do not know. I suppose you "claim wealth" too? Is your Pastor rich and healthy??

 

[Rockrz]

The DNA that produces the blood of the child comes from the father's DNA that was in the father's sperm that fertilized the egg in the mother's womb.

And, yes me and my Pastor both are rich. We have more than enough money to cover our bills, which enables us to give alot of money to spread the Gospel of Jesus Christ around the world.

That's what money is for...

 

[Strong in Him]

Rock,

The only part a man plays in making a baby is providing the sperm to fertilise the egg! All th rest happens when that egg has been fertilised and begins to develop as a foetus. It's amazing how this happens - look it up on the web or in a book to find out just how awesome the process is.

These two quotes are from various pregnancy websites. They show what's going on when the woman is 6 weeks pregnant.

"The heart has begun to pump blood and most of the other organs are well under construction. Buds form on the body that will become the arms and legs."

"The baby's heart is now beating and blood circulation is evident. The kidneys and liver are growing fast, and the neural tube, which connects the brain to the spinal cord, closes."


Have you any evidence you can quote which shows "the blood is from the father"? How does this happen anyway - is there a gene or something in a man's sperm that grows into blood?

Theologically speaking, if the blood in Jesus' veins was pure divine blood, wouldn't that have meant that Jesus was not human?

There you go again, getting the only exercise you get....jumping to conclusions and running down your neighbors! We are talking about Jesus' physical life here on earth, not His overall existance. You gotta pay attention to the conversation here.

I'm afraid you're in no position to talk about people jumping to conclusions and running down others! When I said I could never be your brother, you immediately accused me of not loving my fellow believers, and saying that such an attitude was the cause of my problems. Had you taken a second to check the symbol under my name you would have seen that I am female. Therefore the reason I can never be your brother is to do with gender, not spirituality. But did you apologise? I won't wait for the answer, you didn't.

 

[Zoomer]

Wow! You have research that proves God's Word is a lie, and God does not honor His promises?

That research must have come from satan and sons research underground. I hear their stock is really hot!

I do not need to research Scripture. However, I do need to research those who teach it so I know why and how they are twisting the Word of God to suit their own need and to see if they are profiting from it. I do not know why mainstream Christianity is so excepting of a group that demotes God and Jesus while raising man up to the level of a god. We do not allow Mormons to post here and the ones I talk to accept the Creed, but we let people who teach these things post here... http://www.biblebb.com/files/WRDFAITH.HTM
http://www.modernreformation.org/krhinn.htm

You can say that I am going to hell but I believe the Word of God over Benny Hinn. Benny Hinn once said that women were meant to give birth out of their sides and that God is really 9 persons. Then there is Kenneth Copeland who said that the reason those in Africa are poor is because they aren't being taught the true gospel of prosperity.

 

[kayanne]

When you study a little about medical science, you'll find that the blood of a child is provided by the father, not the mother.

Rockrz,
My bachelors degree is in Medical Science. I worked in hospital labs for over 10 years, with most of my work involving blood, transfusion compatilbility issues, and issues of blood compatibility between pregnant women and their unborn infant.
Now I'm not going to try to cram 15 years worth of education and work experience into one post on a message board---but I can assure you that you are quite incorrect in your statement about children's blood being provided by their father.
Where did you get this stuff?!?! On second hand, don't bother answering--I don't really care.

 

[Maccie]

The DNA that produces the blood of the child comes from the father's DNA that was in the father's sperm that fertilized the egg in the mother's womb.

Don't be silly - if something comes from the father only and through the male line, then it has to be on the Y chromosome, which means girl babies, who have XX chromosomes wouldn't be able to make blood!

This thread has become so ridiculous, I am not bothering with it any more. I prefer to discuss reality.

 

[Rockrz]

Theologically speaking, if the blood in Jesus' veins was pure divine blood, wouldn't that have meant that Jesus was not human?

If Jesus' blood wasn't pure divine Blood, then we are on our way to hell, all of us!
This would mean we have no salvation. The blood of Jesus is Holy!

 

[Strong in Him]

If Jesus' blood wasn't pure divine Blood, then we are on our way to hell, all of us!
This would mean we have no salvation. The blood of Jesus is Holy!

Agreed, we are saved by the blood of Jesus. But he was a man, a real human being; with a different conception to the rest of us admittedly, but he developed and was born just like any other foetus, and grew up like any other child.

Jesus felt hunger, thirst, loneliness, sadness, happiness, pain, stress while he was on earth. Yes - stress. An article I read recently about Christ's crucifixion, it was posted somewhere on this forum I think, said that when a body is under great stress, it's possible to sweat blood, I think I've remembered that correctly. But even if it was figurative, Jesus was definitely sweating in the Garden of Gethsemane. (It is Luke, the doctor, who records this, Luke 22v44). Why was he in great anguish if he knew a) flogging and crucifixion weren't going to hurt him in any way, and b) even though they really would kill him (can you kill God?) he would rise again? He asked his friends to stay awake and keep watch with him while he was praying, because he was feeling overwhelmed with sorrow. (Matthew 26v38) The Son of God was asking for companionship during a difficult time of his life!
Jesus wept - real salt tears - outside Lazarus' tomb, and he knew he was going to raise him to life again!

Jesus' blood is the blood of the New Covenant, shed for many for the forgiveness of sins. Jesus was the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. He was perfect, he lived a sinless life of complete obedience to his father. But he was human too, he had real, red human blood flowing through his veins, while still being God in the flesh. How come? I don't know, it's a mystery I'll undertand when I get to heaven.

 

[Rockrz]

Nobody said He wasn't a real man. I'm just saying that God provided the seed that fertilized Mary's womb that caused Jesus to be born, but Joseph provided this when James was born. This technically makes James and Jesus half brothers because they had different fathers.

And, the part that God provided caused Jesus to be perfect, and it cause His Blood to be perfect. There was no sin in Jesus, like there was with everyone else who was natually born into sin (thanks, Adam!)

If this weren't true, then other people before Jesus could have gone to the Cross to pay for our sins. That not being the case, it took a perfect man who had no sin to go to the Cross. Someone with pure Blood...which is why God spoke His Word, Mary received it, and it caused her to get pregnant with Jesus.

Jesus was literally conceived by the Word of God...God used the Word of Faith and spoke Jesus into His physical life on earth. Without the Word of Faith, you wouldn't be able to get born-again!

 

[Strong in Him]

We are born again through Jesus and what he has done for us. We confess our sins to God, repent and ask him into our lives. The we thank God that he has heard us. It is not our words that save us, but that we accept for ourselves all that Jesus has done for us. And it is the Holy Spirit who moves in our hearts to convict us of our sins in the first place.
A red blood cell is a red blood cell. It can't be either sinful or perfect, since they are moral values. And as several people have told you that a person's blood does NOT come from their father, that little analogy falls rather flat.

Oddly enough I've been looking up the word of faith movement for someone on another site who asked about it. Sounds very dodgy to me!

I think the time has come for me to move onto a more sensible thread, as a) you make assertions but can't back them up, and b) you seem unable to admit it when you make mistakes.

 

[Rockrz]

We are born again through Jesus and what he has done for us. We confess our sins to God, repent and ask him into our lives. The we thank God that he has heard us. It is not our words that save us, but that we accept for ourselves all that Jesus has done for us. And it is the Holy Spirit who moves in our hearts to convict us of our sins in the first place.
A red blood cell is a red blood cell. It can't be either sinful or perfect, since they are moral values. And as several people have told you that a person's blood does NOT come from their father, that little analogy falls rather flat.

Oddly enough I've been looking up the word of faith movement for someone on another site who asked about it. Sounds very dodgy to me!

I think the time has come for me to move onto a more sensible thread, as a) you make assertions but can't back them up, and b) you seem unable to admit it when you make mistakes.

OK, so you don't believe the Blood of Jesus is pure... that's your right. I wouldn't want to stand too close to you while you say that, but nontheless...

Yes, it's our words that save us in the sense that we are saying of our own free will "Jesus, I accept you as my Lord and Savior". Besides, Jesus specifically said we could have what we say if we believe that those things which we say will come to pass. Obviously, it has to be things God is in agreement with (His promises) before He will get involved in making it happen.

But, if you don't wanna believe what Jesus said, then that's your business I guess. It's between you and Him...not me. I've spent years counting on God's promises to be true, even staking my life on them, and He's never let me dow yet...because He can't lie and He watches over His Word to perform it!

 

[Grishnak]

I see that alot of Christians think that God wants us to get sick every once in a while and He even occasionally kills people with this same sickness that He brought on them to "teach them something".

Where, under the New Testament, do you see proof that Jesus and/or the Father are in favor of mankind being sick?

dunno.....but disobedience concerning the Lord supper sure seems to be the cause of some growing sick and even dying.

For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
(1Co 11:30 KJV)


Because of this many among you are weak and sick, and many have died.
(1Co 11:30 EMTV)

 

[Rockrz]

Yep...that's one of the 4 reasons the Bible gives for why people perish!
You da man...