When does Salvation Come?

[HARK!]

(CLV) Re 12:10
And I hear a loud voice in heaven saying, "Just now came the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God, and the authority of His Christ, for the accuser of our brethren was cast out, who was accusing them before our God day and night.

 

[Mr. M]

Luke 10:18 And He said to them, I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven. 19 Behold, I give you the authority to trample on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall by any means hurt you. 20 Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rather rejoice because your names are written in heaven.

 

[Tone]

Throughout eternity.


*He is our Salvation.

 

[Mr. M]

Throughout eternity.


*He is our Salvation.

Yahshua (salvation) manifests in power (dunamis), and authority. (exousia).
gospels and I were discussing Psalm 35 today. Check out this verse:

Psalm 35:3. Also draw out the spear, and stop those who pursue me.
Say to my soul, “I am your salvation.”
amar nephesh yeshuwah
or,
say to my soul, " I am Yahshua".
Meditate on that for about a minute!

 

[visionary]

Every step of reconciliation is a step towards salvation that God has taken to mend the breach between heaven and earth.

 

[HARK!]

Every step of reconciliation is a step towards salvation that God has taken to mend the breach between heaven and earth.

I believe that it's a process too.

It might begin when we come out of the water; but clearly it hasn't happened at that time.

 

[GedaliahMaegil]

The best question to ask, before the first question is answered, is "Saved from what?"

 

[HARK!]

The best question to ask, before the first question is answered, is "Saved from what?"

Are we being saved from; or are we being saved for?

I give the esteem to YHWH.

 

[visionary]

Are we being saved from; or are we being saved for?

I give the esteem to YHWH.

That is a looking back and looking forward answer.

 

[GedaliahMaegil]

Are we being saved from; or are we being saved for?

I give the esteem to YHWH.

What we are being saved for is actually an easier question to answer, but that is another topic.

As for my question, it is in response to those who claim, often mindlessly, "I'm saved!" When I ask them what they feel they are saved from, they tend to wobble and not be able to offer a concrete answer.

Some just don't care, because, in their minds, they're just happy to have a seat at the table ... whatever that means. I find that to be lazy. There is enough in the Scriptures to say what men are being saved from, whom they are being saved by, what necessitated their need for salvation in the first place, and what HaShem's purpose for men's salvation is.

 

[HARK!]

That is a looking back and looking forward answer.

It comes from an understanding that YHWH revealed to me, when I was in my infancy of understanding. This happened on the day that I knew he was real. I had read the Shema; but I didn't recognize it at that time. However YHWH was revealing understanding of it to me.

We are to pray incessantly. We are to keep all of our mind and heart on him. A thought given to anything else, is a thought taken a way from him. If I dwell on the darkness, that his light has revealed within me; then I have turned from the majesty of his light. That's self worship, the greatest idol left to destroy.

Turned...

Decades later, I began to fellowship with a Messianic congregation. I hadn't been there long when I was taught, at least from their perspective, that the word repent means to turn, not from sin, but towards YHWH.

I didn't even question what they meant. This made perfect sense with my previous understanding.

By turning from sin, sin is at the forefront of our thought. By turning toward YHWH, our minds remain on him.

 

[HARK!]

I find that to be lazy.

Is it laziness; or are they working very hard to protect what they love more than truth?

 

[Mr. M]

Acts 2:40. And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying,
Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

From the world and the prince of this world. Out of darkness, into light!

1 Peter 2:9. But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light.

 

[Danthemailman]

There are 3 tenses to salvation that should not get mixed up.

1. We have been saved from the PENALTY of sin (justification)
2. We are being saved from the POWER of sin (ongoing sanctification)
3. We will be saved from the PRESENCE of sin (glorification)

 

[visionary]

It comes from an understanding that YHWH revealed to me, when I was in my infancy of understanding. This happened on the day that I knew he was real. I had read the Shema; but I didn't recognize it at that time. However YHWH was revealing understanding of it to me.

We are to pray incessantly. We are to keep all of our mind and heart on him. A thought given to anything else, is a thought taken a way from him. If I dwell on the darkness, that his light has revealed within me; then I have turned from the majesty of his light. That's self worship, the greatest idol left to destroy.

Turned...

Decades later, I began to fellowship with a Messianic congregation. I hadn't been there long when I was taught, at least from their perspective, that the word repent means to turn, not from sin, but towards YHWH.

I didn't even question what they meant. This made perfect sense with my previous understanding.

By turning from sin, sin is at the forefront of our thought. By turning toward YHWH, our minds remain on him.

The burden falls of your shoulders when you stop dwelling on the sins the so beset you and move forward in faith in Him. He is our focus, our goal, our Savior, and He is the answer. With the head aglow from His Presence, we are in awe of Him. Overwhelmed in His Glory, His Majesty, and His Wisdom, we find ourselves not dwelling on those failings about us, but on the future with Him.. and glorious it is.

 

[GedaliahMaegil]

Is it laziness; or are they working very hard to protect what they love more than truth?

I find that there are many systems of religious fervour that will see Truth and see its good but be fearful to lose what they have invested their lives into, whether a congregational "family", a biological family, a trusted mentor, or the praise of men. They value these things so much that they consider the Truth to take a back seat, something to be returned to at a "more convenient time", because they are unwilling to risk giving up all comfort and vainglory and praise for the true reward that an adherence to the Truth of HaShem and His Mashiach is.

 

[HARK!]

We have been saved from the PENALTY of sin (justification)

(CLV) Mt 24:13
Yet he who endures to the consummation (of the marriage), he shall (future tense) be saved.

Endures what?


(CLV) Mt 24:11
And many false prophets shall be roused, and shall be deceiving many.

(CLV) Mt 24:12
And, because of the multiplication of lawlessness, the love of many shall be cooling.

 

[Jesse Dornfeld]

We were saved
We are being saved
We will be saved

 

[visionary]

I find that there are many systems of religious fervour that will see Truth and see its good but be fearful to lose what they have invested their lives into, whether a congregational "family", a biological family, a trusted mentor, or the praise of men. They value these things so much that they consider the Truth to take a back seat, something to be returned to at a "more convenient time", because they are unwilling to risk giving up all comfort and vainglory and praise for the true reward that an adherence to the Truth of HaShem and His Mashiach is.

I know what you mean, I ask a fellow once if you have to choose between the two which would you choose, and he said "church".

 

[Jesse Dornfeld]

To be more clear, salvation comes "before the foundations of the world". I do not mean that in a legalistic sense but in an awe inspiring sense that God can and does choose who He wants in his family apart from "bloodline, human desire, and human will". It is a gracious thing that our king chose to save us. Upon the call of salvation, the choice of regeneration is one of synergism rather than strictly monergism, I believe. Not so to say God is not a part of the choice, as he most certainly is in guiding us to the Light of the World who became sin, who knew no sin, and was ascended to the Throne of heaven whereby He will return at the Father's call to judge the living and the dead. When we put our trust in Him, that is when He is most glorified in us. Beyond the realm of the physical, we have peace with God according to the richness of His grace. What a man does after salvation is surely a miracle as he devotes his life to the pursuit of Truth putting the desires of the flesh behind him and God points him his steps.