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Whats your opinion?

Discussion in 'News & Current Events' started by ForJesusChrist, May 1, 2014.

  1. interpreter

    interpreter Senior Member

    +129
    Anglican
    Because I took part in the Viet Nam war? I will be rewarded in heaven for that.
    My point is, Jesus condoned the death penalty (In Luke 19:27 and other verses).
     
  2. TheReasoner

    TheReasoner Former christian, current teapot agnostic.

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    Ah yes, "Jesus thought as I do!" a common argument from supporters or opposers of anything from slavery, via taxation to death penalty, war, economic policy or racial questions.YOU read your bible that way. This does not mean you are right in your interpretation (After all many people understand it completely differently). And even if you are right this does not mean you are right in your opinion as it rests on the authority and veracity of the bible. And frankly, I think there is no real reason to think the bible is a good source of morality, facts, ethics or anything else, apart from a few good stories. Bloody, violent, horrible stories. Such as genocides, horrible rape stories and the like. God apparently killed everything that moved on this earth in the flood. He told the Israelites to slaughter everyone in the nations they conquered as another example. This is the stuff of Hollywood, war novels or post apocalyptic ones. It SHOULD be the stuff of the ancient past. Yet for some reason some people cling to these horrible stories as templates for their lives. Or they say thay do, but fail to read the book they profess to follow. Thankfully.
     
  3. florida2

    florida2 Well-Known Member

    +421
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    We are commanded to LOVE.

    That's it.

    Blowing someone's brains out because you may perceive someone is an 'enemy of Jesus' (how do you define that?) does not come into the equation.
     
  4. TheReasoner

    TheReasoner Former christian, current teapot agnostic.

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    As much as I agree with you, Florida2, far from all christians seem to do so. Your viewpoint is clearly in line with what my own was as a christian, and I maintain that position without believing there is any divine commandment demanding it of me today. However, there are many verses in the bible where violence is quite significantly endorsed directly (as in the call for death penalty for minor perceived crimes, the sale of offspring as slaves, or extermination of entire nations) or indirectly (By speaking of atrocities without any form of condemnation).
    Christians today are the ones who keep pushing for discrimination of homosexuals. It tends to be christians who want borders closed to immigration, and who work against universal healthcare in the states. Just to bring up a few examples. Yes, plenty of christians are as you describe loving and kind people. Who genuinely seek to do good and who also DO good. We can probably make a long list of such people, famous or not. But, we can also make a long list of christians who are anything but. And both sides (it is an excessive simplification to say there are only two sides, I know) tend to claim they are right because the bible supports THEIR view. In many cases both sides are right, too. The bible may be said to support many different things if the reader only wants it to.

    I applaud the viewpoint you seem to have, that love is your primary purpose, and I would agree that this would be Jesus of Nazareth's core teaching. It would seem not everyone agrees with us on that though. Not in practice, anyway.
     
  5. Armoured

    Armoured So is America great again yet? Supporter

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    What is the heavenly reward for having been in Vietnam?
     
  6. Desk trauma

    Desk trauma Atheist Capitalist Supporter

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    An existence in a universe where the war never happened?
     
  7. Armoured

    Armoured So is America great again yet? Supporter

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    But then there'd be no need for armour! You can see why I'm conflicted...
     
  8. interpreter

    interpreter Senior Member

    +129
    Anglican
    Read Luke 19:27 where an enemy of Jesus is defined as someone who doesn't want Jesus ruling over them (through Christian nations). We are commanded to kill them.
     
  9. Armoured

    Armoured So is America great again yet? Supporter

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    Context, what's that?

     
  10. Desk trauma

    Desk trauma Atheist Capitalist Supporter

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    I qualify as an enemy of Jesus by that definition, when should I expect the assault?
     
  11. drjean

    drjean Senior Veteran Supporter

    +4,395
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    No we aren't.
    That is a parable and the person who will destroy the enemies of Christ is the Christ, not us... that is not our responsibility in Christianity (though it is in Islam, to kill us the infidels.)

    There is a difference between killing and murdering, also. While our laws allow us to put certain people to death, I no longer (and haven't for a long time) condoned the death penalty in general. Where there is positive evidence of someone evil murdering another, yes, put him/her to death. But there are far too many people in prison who committed no crime. And with the way the world is going (NWO etc) for all we know WE will be the ones in prison on death row for no real crime except believing in Jesus the Christ and rejecting the satanic powers in authority.
     
  12. interpreter

    interpreter Senior Member

    +129
    Anglican
    Wrong. Jesus is the king of the parable.
    Jesus doesn't kill anyone. His followers carry out the death penalty.
     
  13. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy A person of low ability. Supporter

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    Many 'experts' blind themselves to what the rest of the elephant looks like.
     
  14. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy A person of low ability. Supporter

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    No worries. The enemies of Jesus will be killed.......by Jesus.
     
  15. Joykins

    Joykins free Crazy Liz!

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  16. bhsmte

    bhsmte Newbie

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    How do you determine who the enemies of Jesus are?
     
  17. ThisBrotherOfHis

    ThisBrotherOfHis Well-Known Member

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    We don't. He does. Simple criteria: Belief.
     
  18. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy A person of low ability. Supporter

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    Jesus did uphold the death penalty, but not in this verse. The time frame of the parable in Luke 19 is at the return of Christ, a yet future event. See verse 15:

    15 "And it came to pass, that when he was returned, having received the kingdom, then (and only then) he commanded these..(to be killed).
     
  19. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy A person of low ability. Supporter

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    He will determine that, when he returns. (see post #138).
     
  20. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy A person of low ability. Supporter

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    Here is where Jesus validates the death penalty:


    Matthew 15:3-5

    "But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
    For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.
    But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me";

    and,

    Mark 7:9-11

    "And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
    For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death: But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free."
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2014
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