What's up with the shift in facemask use?

[Ricky M]

What is not christian about my response man?

Also, watch this.

On your side:
1. Do the actual numbers justify the response? In most places, No.
2. Is the media blowing things out of proportion? When have they not?
3. Is this preparation to get people ready to accept a one-world economy and leader? Most probably, that is part of it.

On the other side:
1. Is there a pathogen out there killing people? Yes
2. Do we know everything we need to know about it? No.
3. Should we err on the side of caution? Yes
4. Should we do what we can to help curb it's spread? Yes.
5. Does the world need to be better prepared for a true pathogen? Yes, as evidenced by this 'trial run'.
6. Should we participate in this 'training exercise'? Yes, as far as learning how to be prepared, and curbing the spread are concerned.

And, most importantly,

SHOULD WE CARE IF WE MAKE OTHER PEOPLE SICK?

ABSOLUTELY YES.

That is where your 'Christian compassion' is lacking. Your absolute lack of concern for those who are vulnerable, and your unwillingness to take steps to protect others.

Oh and, is "I'm 100% fine with catching this" an appropriate response?

ABSOLUTELY NOT.

But I kinda hope you do, so you'll lose the arrogance and learn your lesson.

 

[ap_Earwood]

On your side:
1. Do the actual numbers justify the response? In most places, No.
2. Is the media blowing things out of proportion? When have they not?
3. Is this preparation to get people ready to accept a one-world economy and leader? Most probably, that is part of it.

On the other side:
1. Is there a pathogen out there killing people? Yes
2. Do we know everything we need to know about it? No.
3. Should we err on the side of caution? Yes
4. Should we do what we can to help curb it's spread? Yes.
5. Does the world need to be better prepared for a true pathogen? Yes, as evidenced by this 'trial run'.
6. Should we participate in this 'training exercise'? Yes, as far as learning how to be prepared, and curbing the spread are concerned.

And, most importantly,

SHOULD WE CARE IF WE MAKE OTHER PEOPLE SICK?

ABSOLUTELY YES.

That is where your 'Christian compassion' is lacking. Your absolute lack of concern for those who are vulnerable, and your unwillingness to take steps to protect others.

Oh and, is "I'm 100% fine with catching this" an appropriate response?

ABSOLUTELY NOT.

But I kinda hope you do, so you'll lose the arrogance and learn your lesson.

It is an appropriate response.

And when did I say I don't care if people get sick? I said was that I will not wear a facemask, and that it is stupid to force me to stay inside. If YOU are afraid of getting sick, stay inside or wear a facemask. Do not force me to. I am not putting any people at risk by minding my business. It's not like I'm purposefully coughing on them!

And how will you speak of christian compassion, and display none? This is hypocrisy. In fact you have displayed the opposite, with a hateful tone.
"Stay out of my neighborhood."
"I kinda hope you do [catch the virus], so you'll lose the arrogance and learn your lesson."

Proverbs 11:9

 

[Halbhh]

No, I was thinking of the average duration of the flu season (3-4 months) and then comparing the stats. Remember those worldwide deaths (2-5 million) happened mainly in a short time span of 5 months max.
But as you say, we'll wait and see.

Which pandemic do you mean about 2-5 million in 5 months? (that's not the Spanish flu of 1918-1919) The worldwide projection at the moment (today only) for this current Covid 19 would be pretty hard to do since nations are taking new steps all the time, every day, changing the situation. But, for instance today one model current estimates the U.S. by itself (just 1 nation) could get out of it under 100k:
IHME | COVID-19 Projections

A lot of resourceful people have been working really hard to make this under 100k become possible here in the U.S. It's amazing the ways New York State has continually innovated and adapted.

Of course, these reasonable estimates can change a lot when new factors come up.

 

[Halbhh]

We were told not only that facemasks do not help, but that they increase the possibility of infection.

No, You Do Not Need Face Masks To Prevent Coronavirus—They Might Increase Your Infection Risk

Now, we're told that everyone should wear facemasks in public, to prevent infecting others if we are asymptomatic.

The CDC released a guide on how to make a face mask without sewing skills. Materials include a bandana, a coffee filter, and hair ties.

I think the official account is that the thinking on this, by the experts, has changed. That may be. But, why is it that folks from Asian countries, who have some experience with pandemics, were all wearing masks from the very beginning? Personally, I thought the guidance of not wearing masks was counter-intuitive. But, what do I know? I'm no expert. So, I defer. Perhaps, our experts were just asking the wrong questions.

Face masks: have we been asking the wrong question all along?

We should have been wearing masks all along, but there was a known shortage, and we were misled. Purposely or not? I don't know. We knew we had a shortage and wanted to ensure our courageous health care workers had enough of the needed protections. As it should be. But, were they afraid if they suggested wearing facemasks there would be none available for our health care workers? We could have been making homemade facemasks from the beginning. I don't want to say we have been purposely misled, but that is what it feels like.

Here's a small part of the interesting stuff in one article about U.S. mask wearing during the 'Spanish' Flu I was just reading:

Amid these bans, the American public often rallied around hygiene, making activities such as wearing face masks a sign of good citizenship, even patriotism. Numerous public health advocacy campaigns pushed preventative measures. A cartoon released by the Illinois State Department of Health featured a man smoking a cigarette, wearing a sign that said “Don’t talk into my face, don’t shake my hand, cough, sneeze and spit into your handkerchief, stay home if you have a cold.” A Red Cross ad made clear “the man or woman or child who will not wear a mask now is a dangerous slacker.” The U.S. Public Health Service ran an ad featuring an older man chastising a boy to “use the hankerchief and do your bit to protect me!”

The use of masks was particularly popular in San Francisco. Both Mayor James “Sunny Jim” Rolph and California governor William Stephens advocated for the practice, using the language of wartime sacrifice and patriotism to push the public. It worked, leading to a colorful array of masks profiled by the San Francisco Chronicle, including fancy chiffon veils for the upper class, homemade linen versions, creations resembling nosebags, from the Turkish-inspired muslin yashmak veil, and even “fearsome looking machines like extended muzzles.” While most citizens wore them, a loud minority complained, and many were fined (even Mayor Rolph was given a $50 fee by his own police chief when his mask slipped). When the city rules requiring masks were relaxed on November 21 at noon, announced with a whistle-blow sounded across the city, citizens ripped off their protective gear, and “the sidewalks and runnels were strewn with the relics of a torturous month.”
https://www.curbed.com/2020/3/18/21178053/coronavirus-pandemic-public-space-influenza-history

Today though, with our glimpses into ICUs where we see patients on the borders of death, I think we will be able to most of us summon the will to wear one longer, without too much coaxing.

Dude! $50 in 1918. Wow, that's like a lot of money. I see one site calculates a factor of like 18 or so times as valuable as vs 2020.

 

[public hermit]

Here's a small part of the interesting stuff in one article about U.S. mask wearing during the 'Spanish' Flu I was just reading:

That's fascinating. I like how they connected it with being a good citizen, which is exactly right.

Dude! $50 in 1918. Wow, that's like a lot of money. I see one site calculates a factor of like 18 or so times as valuable as vs 2020.

I thought the exact same thing!

 

[RDKirk]

That's fascinating. I like how they connected it with being a good citizen, which is exactly right.

They were rolling off the first world war the world had ever experienced. Patriotic language was already common in the air.

 

[mama2one]

although a 20 yr old is not afraid of the virus, it is often the younger people out and about who are spreading it

people have it & are unaware if no symptoms
several "famous" people tested showed no symptoms

research by scientists has shown that a forceful sneeze can spread droplets up to 27 feet
an infected person CAN spread it to many people w/o knowing it

church of 60 choirs members who DID social distance @ choir practice still ended up with 45 infected & 2 dead
singing, talking loud, sneezing pushes particles past 6 ft!

so wearing masks can prevent the spread

 

[pgp_protector]

I refuse to wear a mask. If I am going to catch corona, I will catch it like a man.
Stay safe bros!

I can't afford to give it to the wife.

 

[ap_Earwood]

I can't afford to give it to the wife.

Lol

 

[pgp_protector]

Lol

Glad you think it's funny, I don't.
She's in a high risk group.

 

[ap_Earwood]

Glad you think it's funny, I don't.
She's in a high risk group.

Not saying her state is funny, that's terrible and I really hope you, or her, do not get it.

I said "Lol" because it was a funny statement, I think anyways.

 

[coffee4u]

It does not mean that I should wear a facemask. If you are worried about your child's safety, or your own safety for that matter, then you should stay home or wear a facemask.

I do stay at home and I have ordered face masks.
My children are older with good immune systems, but yes I do have a low immune system I am one of those at risks, but even if I wasn't I would still be thinking about my neighbour.

It's like, someone gets sick, and they lock everybody up, when really they need to be locking the sick person up.

You do realize you can have it and not show any if few systems for days, so not even realizing that you are sick you can spread it far and wide, right? Of course those who are obviously sick should be isolated but this does not account for those who don't look sick but actually are.
A Person Can Carry And Transmit COVID-19 Without Showing Symptoms, Scientists Confirm
A Person Can Carry And Transmit COVID-19 Without Showing Symptoms, Scientists Confirm
These people ^ are why it will spread.

And some of the best reasoning I've ever heard a pastor say, if you are afraid of catching the virus, don't come to church! But, do not force ME to stop holding church. (I'm pretty sure the pastor got arrested for holding physical church service). It's a libertarian way of thinking, no doubt.

Must feel good for him to be completely selfish.
Singing and shouting transforms the droplets into tiny airborne particles that can travel far and wide within an enclosed space and be breathed in. One person with Corvid inside an enclosed church could infect everyone sitting there.

No it's thinking about the welfare of others and not just yourself.
Mark 12:31
The second is this: 'Love your neighbour as yourself.' There is no commandment greater than these."

 

[ap_Earwood]

I do stay at home and I have ordered face masks.
My children are older with good immune systems, but yes I do have a low immune system I am one of those at risks, but even if I wasn't I would still be thinking about my neighbour.



You do realize you can have it and not show any if few systems for days, so not even realizing that you are sick you can spread it far and wide, right? Of course those who are obviously sick should be isolated but this does not account for those who don't look sick but actually are.
A Person Can Carry And Transmit COVID-19 Without Showing Symptoms, Scientists Confirm
A Person Can Carry And Transmit COVID-19 Without Showing Symptoms, Scientists Confirm
These people ^ are why it will spread.



Must feel good for him to be completely selfish.
Singing and shouting transforms the droplets into tiny airborne particles that can travel far and wide within an enclosed space and be breathed in. One person with Corvid inside an enclosed church could infect everyone sitting there.

No it's thinking about the welfare of others and not just yourself.
Mark 12:31
The second is this: 'Love your neighbour as yourself.' There is no commandment greater than these."

I am not putting anyone at risking by going outside and not wearing a facemask. I am simply minding my business. And, everyone could be sick at any moment, they do not shut churches down during a flu season. So by that logic we should all stay home as to not spread it, right? Because we love our neighbors, right?
It's nonsense. Do not force me to stay home, no one has the right to force me to stay home. People are acting like if you go out into public without a facemask you are the devil!

Wanting to hold church service, which (Hebrews 10:25) we are not to forsake, and is a great place to encounter the Lord and learn, is selfish? Not wanting to conform to the system of the beast with online services is selfish? Definitively, this man cares more about his neighbor than one who is staying inside.

Anytime we go outside, or anyone goes outside, we are also putting ourselves at risk. Meaning, if you go outside, you are accepting the chance, and are willing, to catch the virus. That commandment says "Love your neighbor as yourself." So, this does not mean love others higher than yourself. Jesus never commanded that. Paul taught it in Philippians 2:3. but Paul is not Jesus. My point is, by going outside you are accepting the chance, and that means anyone else is accepting the chance who is outside, and that if you accept the chance and we are to love our neighbors as ourselves, are we not to accept their chance? Not force ourselves to stay inside for the sake of others, when we aren't willing to do it for ourselves? I am perhaps interpreting the verse incorrectly but this is what I read.


I encourage you to watch this. It was removed off youtube and vimeo, for displaying the truth.
https://www.[bless and do not curse... and do not curse]ute.com/video/H4W7FwBy0Ukh/

 

[faroukfarouk]

although a 20 yr old is not afraid of the virus, it is often the younger people out and about who are spreading it

people have it & are unaware if no symptoms
several "famous" people tested showed no symptoms

research by scientists has shown that a forceful sneeze can spread droplets up to 27 feet
an infected person CAN spread it to many people w/o knowing it

church of 60 choirs members who DID social distance @ choir practice still ended up with 45 infected & 2 dead
singing, talking loud, sneezing pushes particles past 6 ft!

so wearing masks can prevent the spread

@christine40 Sometimes wisdom comes through years of experience.

 

[coffee4u]

I am not putting anyone at risking by going outside and not wearing a facemask. I am simply minding my business. And, everyone could be sick at any moment, they do not shut churches down during a flu season. So by that logic we should all stay home as to not spread it, right? Because we love our neighbors, right?
It's nonsense. Do not force me to stay home, no one has the right to force me to stay home. People are acting like if you go out into public without a facemask you are the devil!

Wanting to hold church service, which (Hebrews 10:25) we are not to forsake, and is a great place to encounter the Lord and learn, is selfish? Not wanting to conform to the system of the beast with online services is selfish? Definitively, this man cares more about his neighbor than one who is staying inside.

Anytime we go outside, or anyone goes outside, we are also putting ourselves at risk. Meaning, if you go outside, you are accepting the chance, and are willing, to catch the virus. That commandment says "Love your neighbor as yourself." So, this does not mean love others higher than yourself. Jesus never commanded that. Paul taught it in Philippians 2:3. but Paul is not Jesus. My point is, by going outside you are accepting the chance, and that means anyone else is accepting the chance who is outside, and that if you accept the chance and we are to love our neighbors as ourselves, are we not to accept their chance? Not force ourselves to stay inside for the sake of others, when we aren't willing to do it for ourselves? I am perhaps interpreting the verse incorrectly but this is what I read.


I encourage you to watch this. It was removed off youtube and vimeo, for displaying the truth.
https://www.[bless and do not curse... and do not curse]ute.com/video/H4W7FwBy0Ukh/

Philippians 2:4
Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others.

 

[renniks]

Good questions.

We're a little ahead of the states here in Europe.

Face masks are a MUST.
GLOVES are a MUST.

Face masks are to be worn all the time when leaving the house.

Gloves are to be put on and removed IMMEDIATELY upon exiting the store, etc.

There are two types of masks:
one protects you and others.
one protects only others if YOU are sick.

Be smart.
Don't leave the house...
Wear a mask and gloves when you do.

What good does wearing gloves everywhere do? All you are doing is cross-contaminating everything you touch.
I think the masks are probably more of a feel-good thing, but then, maybe I'm a cynic.

 

[faroukfarouk]

Philippians 2:4
Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others.

Good verse there...

 

[faroukfarouk]

I do stay at home and I have ordered face masks.
My children are older with good immune systems, but yes I do have a low immune system I am one of those at risks, but even if I wasn't I would still be thinking about my neighbour.



You do realize you can have it and not show any if few systems for days, so not even realizing that you are sick you can spread it far and wide, right? Of course those who are obviously sick should be isolated but this does not account for those who don't look sick but actually are.
A Person Can Carry And Transmit COVID-19 Without Showing Symptoms, Scientists Confirm
A Person Can Carry And Transmit COVID-19 Without Showing Symptoms, Scientists Confirm
These people ^ are why it will spread.



Must feel good for him to be completely selfish.
Singing and shouting transforms the droplets into tiny airborne particles that can travel far and wide within an enclosed space and be breathed in. One person with Corvid inside an enclosed church could infect everyone sitting there.

No it's thinking about the welfare of others and not just yourself.
Mark 12:31
The second is this: 'Love your neighbour as yourself.' There is no commandment greater than these."

Caution is indeed healthy.

Part of sanctified wisdom, sometimes.

 

[charsan]

I am not putting anyone at risking by going outside and not wearing a facemask. I am simply minding my business. And, everyone could be sick at any moment, they do not shut churches down during a flu season. So by that logic we should all stay home as to not spread it, right? Because we love our neighbors, right?
It's nonsense. Do not force me to stay home, no one has the right to force me to stay home. People are acting like if you go out into public without a facemask you are the devil!

Wanting to hold church service, which (Hebrews 10:25) we are not to forsake, and is a great place to encounter the Lord and learn, is selfish? Not wanting to conform to the system of the beast with online services is selfish? Definitively, this man cares more about his neighbor than one who is staying inside.

Anytime we go outside, or anyone goes outside, we are also putting ourselves at risk. Meaning, if you go outside, you are accepting the chance, and are willing, to catch the virus. That commandment says "Love your neighbor as yourself." So, this does not mean love others higher than yourself. Jesus never commanded that. Paul taught it in Philippians 2:3. but Paul is not Jesus. My point is, by going outside you are accepting the chance, and that means anyone else is accepting the chance who is outside, and that if you accept the chance and we are to love our neighbors as ourselves, are we not to accept their chance? Not force ourselves to stay inside for the sake of others, when we aren't willing to do it for ourselves? I am perhaps interpreting the verse incorrectly but this is what I read.


I encourage you to watch this. It was removed off youtube and vimeo, for displaying the truth.
https://www.[bless and do not curse... and do not curse]ute.com/video/H4W7FwBy0Ukh/

Link isn't working

 

[RDKirk]

What good does wearing gloves everywhere do? All you are doing is cross-contaminating everything you touch.
I think the masks are probably more of a feel-good thing, but then, maybe I'm a cynic.

You wear the gloves while you're out in "contaminated" spaces. However, you do have to be conscientious about maintaining clean surfaces. For instance, I do a bit of juggling to get to my credit card with an ungloved hand while touching the card device with my gloved hand. Gloves comes off to open the car door, being careful not to touch the outer surface, and go into a wastebasket in the car. The I use alcohol wipes to go over my hands anyway, and everything I'd normally touch in the car anyway.

Wearing a bandana is pretty much just feel-good. But it doesn't take much effort to make a significantly better mask.

I'm using quite a bit of the thinking I learned in CBWR training in the military. Dealing with the virus is quite a bit like dealing with alpha particles.