What's so bad about the Book of Mormon?

[Ironhold]

For me, the biggest issue is women not being allowed into the priesthood.

This goes back to the "claptrap" bit.

If you were to ask the average Mormon woman, she'd tell you that she didn't want the priesthood. The higher up one is, the more time demands it places on the holder and, by extension, the entire family; family time is a rare commodity once a person becomes a bishop or branch president, and once you get up to the stake level you're not even guaranteed a regular sleep cycle. This is why the church has the individual members doing visitation (getting the members to know each other + taking that burden off of the clergy), and why the Relief Society is such a key part of the church (they handle local-level charitable and humanitarian work). It's also why local-level clergy are usually rotated out every 5 - 8 years.

Most of the people I've seen calling for women to have the priesthood generally don't understand this, and either regard having a clergy position as something that one can just phone in or mistakenly presume that it's a paid vocation (it's lay ministry at the local level).

It's kinda like the folks who call on Mormon women to wear pants to church as a protest, only to realize that there's nothing stopping women from doing so in the first place. In fact, I live next to a major military base, and so it's quite common to see members from both genders come in wearing their uniforms; it's understood that they have duty at some point in the day and so there's simply no time for them to change.

 

[smaneck]

Most of the people I've seen calling for women to have the priesthood generally don't understand this, and either regard having a clergy position as something that one can just phone in or mistakenly presume that it's a paid vocation (it's lay ministry at the local level).

I well understand that. My problem is none of those things. My problem is that presumes males should have the power and authority. Whether that comes with any pecuniary reward is irrelevant.

 

[Ironhold]

I well understand that. My problem is none of those things. My problem is that presumes males should have the power and authority. Whether that comes with any pecuniary reward is irrelevant.

The "power and authority" also comes with strings attached.

Anyone who has the priesthood is supposed to be held to a far higher standard of conduct than other members. As part of it, men are obligated to love and provide for their families; I'll have to go back and find the source of the statement, but the quote goes that if a man is not worthy of the family he has, then "amen to the priesthood of that man". It's gone, and so is he. Marriage is to be a partnership between man and woman, and the church relies on that partnership.

 

[RhaegarTargaryen]

Tell me O great one how do I know you are who you say you are? There are many who say the same thing as you. Do you have proof you are the real thing?

Exactly the same way mornomism "knows" that Joseph Smith was who he said he was: He said it!
Admittedly, he probably had a bit more charisma, but the "evidence" is exactly the same for my statement, as for Joseph Smith's claim.

 

[smaneck]

The "power and authority" also comes with strings attached.

Anyone who has the priesthood is supposed to be held to a far higher standard of conduct than other members.

Aren't women capable of living up to that standard?

 

[Ironhold]

Aren't women capable of living up to that standard?

This goes back to everyone in the family needing to love and respect each other.

 

[drstevej]

This goes back to everyone in the family needing to love and respect each other.

This is a non-answer answer

 

[Zoness]

Again you are not reahding but a small portion of church history that is presented to make the church look bad. You do not like the church and are not open minded to anything except negative. If what we teach is true, that their has been a restoration of of ancient teachings and organization then don't you think that a sincere person would at least try to be open minded.

Wait...I read the LDS Essays posted on lds.org owned by the Latter Day Saints. You're telling me that that the church itself writes its own anti-church history? I'm plenty open minded about many positive things but of all the religions in the world (and there are a lot of them). Mormonism seems in the much less likely category.

 

[fatboys]

This has been said many times over--they have free will--God has allowed sin to now run it's course to show the whole universe the end result of sin. No one will ever again disobey--not out of fear of Him--out of horror for what is the end result---separation from Him and suffering.

Why would he allow sin. That wasn't his plan to begin with.

 

[fatboys]

Wait...I read the LDS Essays posted on lds.org owned by the Latter Day Saints. You're telling me that that the church itself writes its own anti-church history? I'm plenty open minded about many positive things but of all the religions in the world (and there are a lot of them). Mormonism seems in the much less likely category.

Then what do you find unacceptable?

 

[smaneck]

This goes back to everyone in the family needing to love and respect each other.

Relevance?

 

[fatboys]

Exactly the same way mornomism "knows" that Joseph Smith was who he said he was: He said it!
Admittedly, he probably had a bit more charisma, but the "evidence" is exactly the same for my statement, as for Joseph Smith's claim.

So part of your proof is an ancient book that you translated that has over 500 pages that you wrote the whole thing in less than two months. This should be interesting what are you calling it?

 

[Jane_the_Bane]

Genuine ancient books aren't written in fake early modern English. Or ficitonal languages like "reformed Egyptian", for that matter.

 

[RDKatz]

The quote you are looking for is:

7 That they may be conferred upon us, it is true; but when we undertake to cover our sins, or to gratify our pride, our vain ambition, or to exercise control or dominion or compulsion upon the souls of the children of men, in any degree of unrighteousness, behold, the heavens withdraw themselves; the Spirit of the Lord is grieved; and when it is withdrawn, Amen to the priesthood or the authority of that man.

(Doctrine and Covenants | Section 121:37)

 

[fatboys]

Genuine ancient books aren't written in fake early modern English. Or ficitonal languages like "reformed Egyptian", for that matter.

So what language would be acceptable for you to believe it is authentic?

 

[Jane_the_Bane]

So what language would be acceptable for you to believe it is authentic?

One that is neither a) fictional, nor b) an incorrect, clumsy imitation.
I'd say these are very sensible requirements, and not exactly demanding ones, either.

 

[A New Dawn]

Again I will say that any person who relies on others for truth instead of finding out for themselves is foolish. I know the bible is true because o read and prayed about it. That is what I did with the Book of Mormon. You have not. Saying that a book is false without reading it with an open mind is and then praying about it well not promote intelligence or knowledge.

fatboys, she said she read it and formed the judgment for herself. How is that "[relying] on others for truth instead of finding out for themselves"?

 

[Zoness]

Then what do you find unacceptable?

I simply don't believe Joseph Smith's claims are valid.

 

[fatboys]

I simply don't believe Joseph Smith's claims are valid.

Okay but what is object able in the Book of Mormon

 

[fatboys]

I simply don't believe Joseph Smith's claims are valid.

What about claims of others who witnessed events and that were the same story. Are they lying