What Would Falsify the Flood?

[Golan]

The issue still remains that the meandering shape of the entire GC (not merely the Colorado river at the bottom) is utterly inconsistent with the Flood model. We know from actual observations that catastrophic flows produce straight, wide, flat-bottomed channels. For the Flood model to account for the GC, you have to explain how a high-energy, high-volume flow could produce a meandering canyon. Spoiler: you can't do this unless you can prove that the laws of physics were different in the past.

It was a miracle, a no ifs hows or buts plain up and down God produced miracle.
'Miracle', a lovely word, it's a band aid a bandage and a cure all pill for everything unexplainable, a creationists friend.
Used by conmen throughout the ages to answer unanswerable questions.

 

[Atheos canadensis]

It is the exact pattern we see.

Lowest to highest geological eras:

Cambrian - molluscs and anthropods (trilobites, etc)

Ordovician - molluscs and anthropods and start of jawed fishes.

Silurian - jawed and bony fish

Devonian - ray finned and lobe finned bony

Carboniferous - amphibians and anthropods

Permian - aminiotes, turtles, small mammals, reptiles, etc.

Triasic - beginning of small dinosaurs

Jurassic - dinosaurs proper

Cretaseous - more dinosaurs including types not seen in Jurassic because of density and size differences.

And so forth up to the modern period.

All merely caused by settlement and layering as the sediments themselves settled out of the water.


Of course with wind and wave fluctuations and differences in height of landmasses, we would expect a tiny divergence here and there as nothing is perfect. As the water receeded off of high land masses, some mixing would occur and smaller animals washed upwards and larger downwards. It only occurs perfectly in the laboratory. And this is exactly what we see.

I notice you have once again latched on to another topic to avoid responding to the evidence that your Flood model is utterly wrong. I have indicated I am more than willing to discuss transitional fossils with you, but following our discussion of the initial point which is that the pattern of the fossil record does not follow the dense to small to large organization you claim it does. I know you will either avoid the issue entirely or simple assert again that the pattern supports your model, but this doesn't make it so. The pattern you have claimed must be produced be your model does not in fact exist. This is a major problem for you. You should deal with it.

 

[Black Akuma]

Well, yes, I suppose that, cladistically, dinosaurs would be reptiles. But then again, so would people.

At any rate, what I was originally getting at was that Justa's contention that the classification of dinosaurs as some major problem is unfounded. He acts like dinosaurs having mammal-like traits somehow falsifies evolution. It doesn't. In fact, it strengthens it.

 

[Split Rock]

I would expect nothing from a transitional species as evolutionists define them since they do not exist .

This one sentence is really all your argument comes down to. If we show you transitionals, that have the expected mixture of features in the espected order in the geological column (you always leave that last part out, I noticed), then they cannot be transitionals, because you say there are no transitionals. A classic circular argument.

 

[Atheos canadensis]

It was a miracle, a no ifs hows or buts plain up and down God produced miracle.
'Miracle', a lovely word, it's a band aid a bandage and a cure all pill for everything unexplainable, a creationists friend.
Used by conmen throughout the ages to answer unanswerable questions.

I'm assuming that's what the answer will have to be because I'm pretty certain no one on this forum is up to the task of demonstrating that the laws of physics operated differently in the past. I have asked this question twice on this thread and in other places as well and have always been met with resounding silence. Not even an attempt at addressing it because even hardcore Flood proponents understand that there is no evidence-based counter argument to be made. The only option, as you point out, is to invoke a miracle.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I'm assuming that's what the answer will have to be because I'm pretty certain no one on this forum is up to the task of demonstrating that the laws of physics operated differently in the past. I have asked this question twice on this thread and in other places as well and have always been met with resounding silence. Not even an attempt at addressing it because even hardcore Flood proponents understand that there is no evidence-based counter argument to be made. The only option, as you point out, is to invoke a miracle.

And yet we have evidence that the processes in the past were the same as the processes we observe today. The only excuse they can come up with a change in the laws of physics is that without that change the Bible is not correct and we can't be having that now.


And I like "magic" better.

 

[AV1611VET]

It was a miracle, a no ifs hows or buts plain up and down God produced miracle.
'Miracle', a lovely word, it's a band aid a bandage and a cure all pill for everything unexplainable, a creationists friend.
Used by conmen throughout the ages to answer unanswerable questions.

I would say "miracle" is one of you guys' most-feared words in the English language.

I notice you guys don't like to use it, even in context.

 

[AV1611VET]

I would say "miracle" is one of you guys' most-feared words in the English language.

I notice you guys don't like to use it, even in context.

And I like "magic" better.

Oh, my.

Thank you for the QED.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I would say "miracle" is one of you guys' most-laughable words in the English language.

I notice you guys don't like to use it, even in context.

Fixed that for you

 

[Subduction Zone]

Oh, my.

Thank you for the QED.

You are welcome. Of course it QED's my correction of your post, not the original post.

 

[AV1611VET]

Fixed that for you

I'm not going to report you for that because your Recent Visitors field looks like a string of Christmas lights.

[You're welcome.]

 

[Subduction Zone]

I'm not going to report you for that because your Recent Visitors field looks like a string of Christmas lights.

[You're welcome.]

So since you lose all arguments legitimate or not you have to run and tattle.

That is fine with me. It is simply another admission that you have lost.

 

[Aman777]

Here is a simple challenge for you. Find some evidence outside of your book of myth that supports your claims.

You do realize that biology says there was no flood, don't you?

Dear SZ, Sure. For more than 99% of the time since man diverged from Chimps, he remained like an animal, looking for something to eat and a place to sleep. SUDDENLY some 10k years ago, farmers began to grow crops, which brought on homebuilding, city building, and EVERY other trait of modern Humans.

Here is the evidence of the SUDDEN arrival of farmers, which brought Human civilization to this Planet. In LESS than 1% of the time since man first roamed this Earth, we have gone from Caves to the Moon and back. Evols refuse to believe this since it is empirical evidence which refutes their false assumptions. Map: Fertile Cresent, 9000 to 4500 BCE

I predict you will hand wave and call names but in the end you will be totally unable to explain this Scientitic and Historic Fact, which exposes the incomplete data which Evols have falsely assumed.

BTW, There has NEVER been a Global Flood on our Planet. The Global Flood which totally destroyed Adam's world, destroyed a much smaller world than our present Cosmos...BUT...it did happen EXACTLY as God told us it did, some 10k years ago, and Noah came to our world which was NOT destroyed in the Flood.

That is HOW prehistoric people inherited the Human intelligence of Adam. Like Cain, on Adam's world, Noah's grandsons had NO other Humans to marry, so they married and produced children with the DNA of the common ancestor of Apes, and with the Human intelligence of Adam, who never stepped foot on our Earth. We, the 7 Billion living Humans on Earth today, are those children.

In Love,
Aman

 

[AV1611VET]

So since you lose all arguments legitimate or not you have to run and tattle.

That is fine with me. It is simply another admission that you have lost.

Maybe you need to read what I wrote again, scientist.

I said I am NOT going to report you.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Dear SZ, Sure. For more than 99% of the time since man diverged from Chimps, he remained like an animal, looking for something to eat and a place to sleep. SUDDENLY some 10k years ago, farmers began to grow crops, which brought on homebuilding, city building, and EVERY other trait of modern Humans.

We did not diverge from Chimps. Neither evolution nor the Bible support that claim. Perhaps you would like to try again?

Here is the evidence of the SUDDEN arrival of farmers, which brought Human civilization to this Planet. In LESS than 1% of the time since man first roamed this Earth, we have gone from Caves to the Moon and back. Evols refuse to believe this since it is empirical evidence which refutes their false assumptions. Map: Fertile Cresent, 9000 to 4500 BCE

How is this any sort of evidence against evolution? You have to do better than to state an obvious fact.

I predict you will hand wave and call names but in the end you will be totally unable to explain this Scientitic and Historic Fact, which exposes the incomplete data which Evols have falsely assumed.

Once again, how is this fact supposed to mean anything at all in this debate?
It seems at best you have an argument from ignorance.

BTW, There has NEVER been a Global Flood on our Planet. The Global Flood which totally destroyed Adam's world, destroyed a much smaller world than our present Cosmos...BUT...it did happen EXACTLY as God told us it did, some 10k years ago, and Noah came to our world which was NOT destroyed in the Flood.

And your evidence for this is? And how did our ancestors get from that world to this one?

That is HOW prehistoric people inherited the Human intelligence of Adam. Like Cain, on Adam's world, Noah's grandsons had NO other Humans to marry, so they married and produced children with the DNA of the common ancestor of Apes, and with the Human intelligence of Adam, who never stepped foot on our Earth. We, the 7 Billion living Humans on Earth today, are those children.

In Love,
Aman

Again, what is your evidence that supports this? At best it seems you have some facts that you try to claim supports you. You have not shown how.

Since all you produce is a wildly hand waving argument at best it takes nothing at all to dismiss your argument.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Maybe you need to read what I wrote again, scientist.

I said I am NOT going to report you.

You are right. My mistake and I apologize. I thought that you were making a threat.

 

[AV1611VET]

You are right. My mistake and I apologize. I thought that you were making a threat.

What did you think I said?

Here's what I said:

I'm not going to report you for that because your Recent Visitors field looks like a string of Christmas lights.

[You're welcome.]

It wouldn't make sense if you read it as:

I'm going to report you for that because your Recent Visitors field looks like a string of Christmas lights.

[You're welcome.]

I'm going to report you because you've been "visited" already?

That doesn't even make sense.

And why would I say, "You're welcome," if I was reporting you?

Anyone can overlook the word "not" in a person's post; but if it throws the rest of the post out of context, wouldn't the SM thing to do is at least go back over it?

... Whatever.

 

[46AND2]

Ever hear of the little Grand Canyon that was formed in a very short time frame? Complete with stratified walls.

What did you think I said?

Here's what I said:

It wouldn't make sense if you read it as:

I'm going to report you because you've been "visited" already?

That doesn't even make sense.

And why would I say, "You're welcome," if I was reporting you?

Anyone can overlook the word "not" in a person's post; but if it throws the rest of the post out of context, wouldn't the SM thing to do is at least go back over it?

... Whatever.

He apologized, av, why you have to keep pushing? ;-)

 

[AV1611VET]

He apologized, av, why you have to keep pushing? ;-)

Maybe because I'm getting fed up with having "scientific method" shoved down my throat by people who do everything but.

They don't proofread their posts, they don't read something that looks odd a second time, they post with broken quote tags, they mistype and misspell words, and on and et cetera.

All the while, telling us how our country is in 26th place in the academic world.

Whatever.

 

[Atheos canadensis]

I would say "miracle" is one of you guys' most-feared words in the English language.

I notice you guys don't like to use it, even in context.

You seem to have mistaken disdain for fear. You can invoke miracles if you like, but that is where rational, evidence-based discussion ends. You can explain any number of physical impossibilities by saying it was a miracle, so there is really no point in talking about them at all. Hence the disdain when they are invoked during ostensibly science-based discussions. I know this is not a problem for you who has said "evidence can take a hike", but for the rational folk it's a real turn off.