What Will It Take To Finally Admit Something Is Wrong With Our Understanding of the Gospel?

[food4thought]

Love and faith. Faith is the expression of our love. That's just my opinion though.

Hi W2L. I have always thought of it as the other way around... IOW's, love is the expression of our faith.

I am participating in this thread because I m trapped in Romans 7. What I will to do, that I do not do. What I will not to do, that I do! Oh! Wretched man that I am! I long for a closer walk with Jesus, but I feel far away from Him right now. I am particularly perplexed by my addiction to cigarettes, I have been trying to quit for almost 8 years... 8 YEARS!!! And I am no closer to quitting than I was 8 years ago. I just don't know what to do at this point. I struggle to pray because of my shame, and my hunger for the Word has waned... I feel like I'm getting further from Him, not closer.

What am I to do?

 

[W2L]

Hi W2L. I have always thought of it as the other way around... IOW's, love is the expression of our faith.

I am participating in this thread because I m trapped in Romans 7. What I will to do, that I do not do. What I will not to do, that I do! Oh! Wretched man that I am! I long for a closer walk with Jesus, but I feel far away from Him right now. I am particularly perplexed by my addiction to cigarettes, I have been trying to quit for almost 8 years... 8 YEARS!!! And I am no closer to quitting than I was 8 years ago. I just don't know what to do at this point. I struggle to pray because of my shame, and my hunger for the Word has waned... I feel like I'm getting further from Him, not closer.

What am I to do?

Don't ask me brother, I live day by day. One day at a time, and im a failure.

 

[GOD Shines Forth!]

I am particularly perplexed by my addiction to cigarettes, I have been trying to quit for almost 8 years... 8 YEARS!!! And I am no closer to quitting than I was 8 years ago.

Been there. Before I quit decades ago, I once frustratedly tore up a pack of cigarettes and left for work. When I got home after work I TAPED SOME CIGARETTES BACK TOGETHER AND SMOKED THEM!

One day, perhaps in a quiet way, it will be like a door that GOD opens up and you just WALK THROUGH it, with a gentle push. You'll look back, rejoice, and then forget the 8 years of failure and be on to the NEXT item (that you know of) on His freeing agenda.

 

[Dkh587]

The gospel being preached today and for hundreds of years is a lawless gospel.

 

[fhansen]

Hi W2L. I have always thought of it as the other way around... IOW's, love is the expression of our faith.

I am participating in this thread because I m trapped in Romans 7. What I will to do, that I do not do. What I will not to do, that I do! Oh! Wretched man that I am! I long for a closer walk with Jesus, but I feel far away from Him right now. I am particularly perplexed by my addiction to cigarettes, I have been trying to quit for almost 8 years... 8 YEARS!!! And I am no closer to quitting than I was 8 years ago. I just don't know what to do at this point. I struggle to pray because of my shame, and my hunger for the Word has waned... I feel like I'm getting further from Him, not closer.

What am I to do?

We never know what prayers God will answer, at least to our liking , but when I finally got truly scared by my huge out-of-control cigarette addiction years ago, and totally helpless (hate to admit how weak I can be), I cried out with one of the first truly sincere prayers of my life, after trying in a variety of ways for months or years to quit on my own-and I finally did! And the one thing I knew after that was that I had to want it-but I didn't do it-never could before that prayer. So don't give up on that avenue.

 

[food4thought]

We never know what prayers God will answer, at least to our liking , but when I finally got truly scared by my huge out-of-control cigarette addiction years ago, and totally helpless (hate to admit how weak I can be), I cried out with one of the first truly sincere prayers of my life, after trying in a variety of ways for months or years to quit on my own-and I finally did! And the one thing I knew after that was that I had to want it-but I didn't do it-never could before that prayer. So don't give up on that avenue.

Thanks for the encouragement.

 

[food4thought]

Been there. Before I quit decades ago, I once frustratedly tore up a pack of cigarettes and left for work. When I got home after work I TAPED SOME CIGARETTES BACK TOGETHER AND SMOKED THEM!

One day, perhaps in a quiet way, it will be like a door that GOD opens up and you just WALK THROUGH it, with a gentle push. You'll look back, rejoice, and then forget the 8 years of failure and be on to the NEXT item (that you know of) on His freeing agenda.

Thank you... I just have to trust that God has a purpose in all this.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

If I may. Any act of love, mercy, forgiveness tends to engender that same response from others-and spreads God's word and ways-His love-in ways that turn people to Him and away from the anger, cynicism, competitiveness, and selfishness that seem to rule and drive our world.

"seem to" ? Jesus says the world (society) is pernicious (death dealing). Entirely wicked. Jesus says He, the Light, came into the world to save men, and the world INSTEAD OF "engender that same response" hates Him. And the world hates us (Ekklesia, born again ones) . We love our enemies, as Jesus says, but this does not engender the same response from them usually - the majority continue to hate Jesus, to hate us, and to put us to death.
Daily, as written.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

QUOTE="Gideons300, post: 74158594, member: 378315"]I am going to step in here and say something many may not like.
As I have watched this thread become a tit for tat match with each side explaining why their view is the right one, it has become the perfect object lesson that my OP put forth.
We are blind to our lack and the church is now 500+ schisms and sects each one rallying around their truth... you know.. the REAL truth. LOL. But we do not see what should be obvious to us, but is not.... yet. The world simply walks by us, amazed that we are so oblivious to our lack. Do you know when God said the world will know that He is THE God?
When He shall be sanctified IN US before their very eyes.
We think we are defending truth with our reasonings based upon things we know with our heads from the Word, but truth needs to be displayed to be desired, not defended.
I mean no disrespect to any here. But again, I return to the question asked at the beginning.
What will it take for His people to wake up to our stale, joyless and lifeless state, where we possess just enough truth to quiet our guilt, but not enough to let the truth actually possess us?
There is a vast difference between having our prison cells flung open, and actually leaving our cells behind, walking in real observable freedom.
May God bless you all.
Gids[/QUOTE
==================================
What will it take ?
Pray. Repent. Obey.

Only a few do and only a few, perhaps, will.

 

[fhansen]

"seem to" ? Jesus says the world (society) is pernicious (death dealing). Entirely wicked. Jesus says He, the Light, came into the world to save men, and the world INSTEAD OF "engender that same response" hates Him. And the world hates us (Ekklesia, born again ones) . We love our enemies, as Jesus says, but this does not engender the same response from them usually - the majority continue to hate Jesus, to hate us, and to put us to death.
Daily, as written.

Either way we must follow & promote His way. Regardless of what the world does.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Either way we must follow & promote His way. Regardless of what the world does.

Why must we ?
Most people never do, why must anyone ?

 

[fhansen]

Why must we ?
Most people never do, why must anyone ?

Because He says to follow Him-and there's nothing else that changes ourselves and the world in any way that's worth anything in the end other than love, forgiveness, mercy, compassion etc. It's an ugly world that may prefer darkness but we're to be light in it.

 

[Gideons300]

I think we are prone to being like the sluggard here:

"The sluggard buries his hand in the dish and will not even bring it back to his mouth!"--Proverbs 19:24

The armor is provided free of charge but is actually designed for USE. By US. To be PUT ON.

Just as you have been saying.

Sluggard may not be an appropriate word, lol. How about "comfortable"? We are not up for having our boats rocked, it makes us "uncomfortable". But here is what we must understand. God loves us enough to rock our boats. Heck, He wants to capsize them!

Do we think the early church was amazing? We will be a part of THE church that ushers in His coming. God says THAT church, the one experiencing the latter rain, will be GREATER than the former. Whoa.

But a shaking is coming. It must. Everything that is not of God will be shaken out. And glory to God, once we all light our lamps, the church will no longer even resemble what we see here.

There are only three responses to the shaking coming our way.

1. We can submit and surrender willfully and joyfully, like the prodigal did, making the Lord and Him alone the treasure we desire.

2. We can be brought low by circumstances and in some cases stern discipline from the Holy Spirit in order to become more pliable in His Hand.

3. We can either reject or ignore God's calls to us through the shaking, and find when all is shaken out of us that is not God, there is nothing left of us. Self wins.

It is just my personal opinion, option #1 is the clear leader here. LOL. We think we are giving up a lot, and it terrifies us, but what we get back is flat out mind boggling. Free Indeed is the costliest thing in the universe, paid for in God's blood. And it is ours, where Jesus takes over and lives out through us.... with us..... I simply cannot put it into words. But joy is a pretty good summation.

I pray we wake up and cry out for our faith to awaken, as we simply believe Him. When Paul tells us "Know ye not that you are dead, amd your life is hid with Christ in God.", we simply choose to believe it. God will increase awakened faith.

Guys, I know I come off as a broken record, but this is your birthright. We are promised that "they that sow in tears WILL reap in joy". I think it is time we took that admonition to heart. What awaits on the other side, once we drop all of OUR pearls, is THE PEARL, and we get to abide in Him. 24/7. Victory, flat out.

blessings,

Gids

 

[Hammster]

But a shaking is coming.

You allude to this, but never expand. If this is true, you do a disservice to keep it to yourself and not allow it to be examined.

 

[Gideons300]

You allude to this, but never expand. If this is true, you do a disservice to keep it to yourself and not allow it to be examined.

I will expand on this a bit, if I can. I am in no way predicting a certain event at a certain time. But even the people in the world see some sort of "re-adjustment" is inevitable. We have, as the human species, become somewhat of a ticking time bomb. Sort of a pick tour poison spin-of-the-wheel kind of thing.

Here are a few.

overpopulation

Global Warming

poisoned oceans

supervolcano

Air pollution

dirty bomb

that plastic "thing" in the pacific the size of Texas??

and of course the granddaddy of them all, WW3.

There are MANY more. All point to an apex, a terminal point. I am NOT saying I will live to see it. I am 70 and my wife and I are raising our adopted grandson, 9, and great grandson 3. So I told the Lord that it sure would be nice to let me see them grow up till they are ready to fly on their own. I doubt He if He took that one seriously. It is all in His hands. WE are all in His hands! We are simply about to realize it.

Should this scare us? Doesn't have to. But the shaking, in some form, will be Just enough to chase each one of us back in Him arms. though for some, I suspect it will be a "more vigorous" shaking. Whatever is needed, not an ounce less. And all because He wants to chase us down in our being 'religious' routine, and LOVE on us. Do we know ABOUT Him, or do we really KNOW Him? One is religious, the other, abiding in the vine.

We have substituted doctrine, the core, the essential and all important skeleton for life to be lived on. Doctrine IS important. Thank God the core parts have endured a tumultuous 2000 year journey. But dry bones are not life. Can these bones live? You bet.

It is not rocket science for us all to stop playing like the end many years off. All we have to do is to connect the dots to see that our grandkids are going to pay for our contented blindnesses, if not our children themselves. And I am included in that group, head of the line.

So yes, there is coming a shaking because God has promised it. Because He loves us.You see, He is going to show us how to get rid of the US in us. The self that got saved but seems to have an aversion to anything that does not gratify..... well, self. That self? He is going to set us free from him.... or her. lol. And it will be glorious.

With that said, there is not one reason why anyone hungry for abiding in Him, for feeling loved ALL of the time, cannot find rest tonight, Heck, this second! And that is no lie.

Blessings to all,

Gids

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

So it basically boils down to faith, right?
How do I get to that place?
I agree with God that I am a hopeless sinner... I have no doubt about that.

And also, with faith, true knowledge, lest as written: "For lack of experiential knowledge, My people PERISH" ..... and as in Corinthians, many were sick and dying , not knowing and not doing what God instructed them to do.

"How"? by sheer grace and the Father's revealing to you what is true and what is needed.

He always honors and keeps every one of His Promises, all of His Word is Truth. (including the Ekklesia living daily full of peace, joy and righteousness,
walking every day in union, one with, Jesus and with the Father, the same as the Son and the Father are one, so also are the Ekklesia, born again ones.)

 

[Gideons300]

==================================
What will it take ?
Pray. Repent. Obey.

Only a few do and only a few, perhaps, will.[/QUOTE]
Hello my brother. May I ask a question? Repent? Absolutely! But of what? The first message I ever received and wrote out was a doozy. A seven page discourse titled "Repentance- Only hope for a sleeping bride". That was in 1985.

Well, I spent the next 20+ years of repenting, and trying to obey.... and failing and.... rinse and repeat. You see, I had not identified the root sin, the one opening the door for all those other sins to creep in.

What is the underlying cause of our sin, our failure? You see, if we do not identify it, and expose it, so that we can repent of IT? Well, then we will always remain self-ruled, overcome of evil in one way or another, growing plenty of weeds, but where is the fruit? Oh, we will call ourselves Christians, but I fear we will be so in name only. It is called life support Christianity. Alive but barely. All that is about to go bye bye.

But is there still hope? Can these bones live? Absolutely! And once our eyes are opened, and in our hearts we go 'aha!, I see it! It IS sin!", we then can take the axe of truth to the lie we all assumed was true, repent of it.... and leave it, and all the sins that spang from it.... in the distant background.

And what is the sin? We have not believed our God. We have walked in unbelief, limiting what He can do for us, with us and through us.

And what have we not believed? We have not believed that when Christ died, so did the old us.

Nor have we believed that when Christ rose from the dead to newness of life, so did we.

Pretty plain and simple, isn't it? And that, my brothers and sisters is THE blockage to our running, and never getting weary, and walking and never fainting.

Why are we not walking as overcomers, victorious over the world, the flesh and the devil? Has He not promised this? Is God's arm shortened that He cannot deliver? There is no shortage of God's power here. He says we are dead and that is how He wants our mindset to be. Not worm. Butterfly. The mother of all paradigm shifts.

i can hear the protests. "We are dead. I believe that.". Oh, we know it with our heads! LOL. The only problem is that it has to go from head knowledge to heart belief, and the only way one can do that is to reckon themselves personally as dead to sin and alive to Christ. They have to take the leap of faith, trusting God will catch them, and boy, does He!

We are arriving at the point where multitudes will hear God will say to them "Awake to righteousness" and hesitantly but excitedly answer "Yes, Lord", and for the first time mean the Lord part. Savior AND Lord! Glory!

The sheep will jump at the offer, and the goats will bail. Wholesale. LOL. Can you say 'great falling away?

We are all, every last one of the elect, are about to believe, truly believe, that we are new creatures in Christ and start to yield ourselves to God as those who are alive from the dead.

We are about to discover how deep grace really goes. Prepare to be amazed.

blessings,

Gids

 

[food4thought]

And what is the sin? We have not believed our God. We have walked in unbelief, limiting what He can do for us, with us and through us.

And what have we not believed? We have not believed that when Christ died, so did the old us.

Nor have we believed that when Christ rose from the dead to newness of life, so did we.

You're talking about Romans 6:1-14, right?

 

[Gideons300]

You're talking about Romans 6:1-14, right?

Bingo. Yes, indeed. Do we see Paul tells us to DO something after understanding the old us died and we have brand new natures..... with our heads.

Work for it? Try harder? Earn it? Heck, no. What does God ask us to DO? He simply asks us to come into agreement with Him and believe that we are dead. Believe that we have new natures, ones that long to obey Him and can!

Do not err here. We cannot believe we will get them. That is not faith, but hope. Let us remember, in this covenant, He asks one thing of us..... believe Him.

So here is the dilemma. We, by and large, with a few blessed exceptions, have not done that one thing. It is time to do it.

Blessings,

Gids

 

[Hazelelponi]

Hi W2L. I have always thought of it as the other way around... IOW's, love is the expression of our faith.

I am participating in this thread because I m trapped in Romans 7. What I will to do, that I do not do. What I will not to do, that I do! Oh! Wretched man that I am! I long for a closer walk with Jesus, but I feel far away from Him right now. I am particularly perplexed by my addiction to cigarettes, I have been trying to quit for almost 8 years... 8 YEARS!!! And I am no closer to quitting than I was 8 years ago. I just don't know what to do at this point. I struggle to pray because of my shame, and my hunger for the Word has waned... I feel like I'm getting further from Him, not closer.

What am I to do?

I smoked for 32 years - was a textbook definition of an addict - quit smoking after I was saved, set free by the power of God.

2 Corinthians 10:4

" For the weapons of our warfare are not of the flesh but have divine power to destroy strongholds."

Sometimes God uses an addiction we had prior to being saved, for us to learn to rest in His power and not our own.

You may not get it the first go around or even two, but before it's over you will have learned how to lean not into your own understanding, but in all your ways acknowledge Him.. Proverbs 3:5-6

"We" aren't what conquers, He is.. quitting smoking is through Him alone.

The mistake is when we say "I" will or "I" need to do x, instead of saying He did it - past tense.. fait accompli