What we need is another Pearl Harbor

[ArJay81]

edit, double post.

 

[Driver]

Again, conspiracy theories dishonor all who support them.

I am convinced that the government account is a conspiracy theory. How could those Arabs who could not even fly a Cessna be able to fly those planes and hit their targets with such precision, all directed by a man in a cave in Afghanistan, thwarting America's trillion dollar defenses, unassisted?

More and more Americans are becoming convinced by doing the research. There are a lot of unanswered questions. What is the point of suppressing those seeking the truth?

Is the government's word infallible?

Bush said "If you are not with us, you're with the terrorists."

My correction: "If you're not for the truth, you're with the terrorists".

 

[Poke]

Again, conspiracy theories dishonor all who support them.

His father, a Jew who does not support the war in Iraq, said his son was there to help set up telephone networks or some such.

Imagine wanting to get in on the ground floor of a business in a "new" country.

I guess a spy wouldn't have communications equipment, let alone be running around in a war zone, where he got arrested for spying and then was released only to end up getting killed by Islamo-fascists (another ubber-bad luck encounter). But, you didn't answer the question, how do you explain a 9/11 terrorist using a Jew's email for sending email, if the Jew had no relationship with the terrorist?

The only conspiracy I'm suggesting is that Israel knew of the plan but decided not to tell the US. Berg's real career was following terrorists.

It is not incumbent on any sovereign nation to warn another nation about what is to come; however, there is proof out there that Israeli intelligence did, in fact, warn the US about the attack and the government chose to ignore the warnings.

It sure is incumbent for an alleged ally to provide a warning. Don't you think?

What is this warning you believe Israel gave. There was that report Condi Rice didn't bother reading that all but gave the names of the 9/11 terrorists. Was Israel involved in making that report that warned of terrorists taking flight classes to crash planes into buildings? Why would Condi Rice get promoted after such a costly blunder?

I have no idea why you would believe that I "like" war.

People who find dubious excuses for war, or worse, people who show excitement over war, I can only conclude like war. If you don't like war, you don't like war.

No sane person "likes" war.

Sanity as well as evil/good. Zionism is pushed by evil people, even if some non-evil people get suckered by it.

However, sometimes war is necessary.

Only in a true case of self-defense, which doesn't apply to the party starting the war. WMDs, especially imaginary WMDs, don't justify war. Hezbollah capturing two israeli troops in Lebanon doesn't justify war.

Israel was looking for a pretext and was given one.

Pretexts by definition do not justify war.

But, be that as it may, you can rest assured that Hezbollah is an enemy of Israel, the US, and the rest of the world.

Which is all the more reason why I object to Israel helping Hezbollah recruit more members.

More Americans died at the hands of Hezbollah pre 9/11 than at the hands of any other terrorist organization.

If the US were righteous in its mid-east policy, there wouldn't have been a 9/11.

It makes sense that Israel would not have a law of return for those who have the stated aim to kill all members of the majority people in the land.

So, you think by virtue of being born Arab, someone would want to kill all Jews??? Israel's law is race-based, not stated-aim based.

Do you really believe that Christians had the right to practice their faith in Iraq as the Muslims did?

Compared to now, without a doubt.

 

[belladonic-haze]

Don't worry. There will be other Americans who will pay the sacrifice and fight in bloody wars so you can sit at home, eat popcorn, talk on your cell phone, chat on your computer and practice your Christian faith without fear.

First of all, I never said that I don't respect soldiers that fight in battle for whatever lame reason the politicians come up with.
Secondly, this is big BS...saying that war making gives me freedom. Well, I'd rather have less freedom and world peace...thank you.

And last.....The soldiers are the ones who suffer the most while some idiotic power loving peace hating politicians sit safely in their houses...whatever the color is and use this same excuse to send young men and women to their death. War is always about money. Big powerful politicians make loads of money and in the meanwhile come up with lame excuses as freedom and war against terror to make loads of money......It's business, no more no less....and I find it horrific that my 79 yo dad is still suffering from the horrors he saw and he was after that not the same and lost the ability to life a normal life. His mind and soul are broken down and believe me PTSD is no fun....and in these days there were no psychologist to help these men. He even lost the love of his life (not my Mom, he met her later....and that marriage didn't work because of his problems......) Do not give me such excuses as eating popcorn. I have my own battles in life and do not just sit in my home having fun.......

And no matter what you say...a peaceful solutions is more everlasting..... Humans tend to fight and kill their own species over...nothing...and use oil, religion and so on as an excuse. God wheeps and Jesus shakes His head with all the filth that is happening out here today. We must be ashamed of ourselves threating eachother in such a disrespectful way.

For me there is only one way and that is love, respect and compassion and war doesn't fit in that picture.....

 

[stone]

Speaking as a former protestor of the Viet Nam war: I was just a teenager then. I knew little about politics. I understood one thing, that I hated war.

Does anyone here actually like war? Of course not! Do i enjoy seeing innocent civilians die? Certainly not!

Did America want to get involved in WWII? We wanted to remain in our own country. Ignorance is bliss, so the saying goes. That is until the Japanese attacked us at Pearl Harbor. Then we were awakened from our dream of safety at all costs and our hoping that our ememies would just magically cease and desist.

If these nations had their way, Germany's Hitler for one, we probably wouldn't be typing comfortably in our homes arguing about Israel doing all She can both to defend Herself and making sure bombs don't continue to hit Her and kill Her innocent civilians. If Japan had destroyed America you may not be enjoying the freedom of complaining about your Government (if you're American.) There will be no Christianforums if the Islamic Fundies rule the world. Half the pograming you enjoy on television would not be available for your viewing pleasure. So much for "American idol." I may not agree with men looking at women in mini skirts but be prepared fellows. Women you can forget about voting and don't even dream of kissing your boy friend in public.

When they start dropping bombs on our shores, when our freedoms are threatened, when our comfortable lifestyles are challenged, when our women are placed under Islamic Law, when it's illegal to be a Christian then maybe people will get why Israel had to take the measures that they are taking. But it seems as though some comfortable spoiled Americans and Europeans don't get this. They are enamored with Hezbollah (sp?) blind to the fact that they (we) may be the next target of Jihad.

What is Israel? A democracy! How are you able to enjoy your freedom? People fought and died so you can be free.

When the bombs fell on Pearl Harbor that's when America woke up. Wow! People out there really do hate us and want to distroy our country. Israel has known this for a long, long, time and She won't give up Her freedom. Israel is a friend of democracy.

no body likes war here, but self defense is a must if you want to live.

 

[Ivy]

It doesn't mean anything to you that Israel's violence created Hezbollah in the first place and that even now, Israel's violence is making Hezbollah stronger. When this little war is over, and Hezbollah is still around, you'll just rationalize that Israel was too restrained.

Hizbollah--plus a whopping doses of delusional anti-Semitic rhetoric--created Hizbollah. They are responsible for their own actions.

 

[GraceLikeRainFallsDown]

For me there is only one way and that is love, respect and compassion and war doesn't fit in that picture.....

I am not asking this to start a debate, I truely want to understand your view.

If diplomatic negotiation have failed and another group/country is coming onto your land to kill your family/friends/neighbors, what do you do if you do not fight them? (ON a smaller scale if someone enters your home to kill a family member . . . do you just let them and make them coffee to go?)

What do you do if not fight once negotiations have failed? Do you let the other side eliminate you/family/friends?

I have never understood the pacifist viewpoint. I do not understand how it can work in reality. Please enlighten me.

I think that many that hold this view have never lived in countries where they have to fight in order to survive. (such as Isreal)

 

[Poke]

Hizbollah--plus a whopping doses of delusional anti-Semitic rhetoric--created Hizbollah. They are responsible for their own actions.

Israel is mass murdering Lebanese, using a flimsy pretext to justify it, and you think anti-Semitic rhetoric is the problem? Israel is the chief cause of anti-Semitic rhetoric.

 

[tulc]

I think that many that hold this view have never lived in countries where they have to fight in order to survive. (such as Isreal)

...or like the time when Jesus lived? or when the Church was first founded? I understand it's hard to grasp and if I had my way it wouldn't be in the Bible at all. Unfortunatly I didn't say it He did, and as long as I call myself a Christian I feel I have to obey.
tulc(more of a "kill them all, let God seperate 'em!" kind of guy)

 

[Driver]

Reports say they are also using banned weapons-nuclear,chemical, and biological against the civilians. How can anyone defend what they did to the Lebanese children in this photo (scroll down the page)...

http://www.nogw.com/

 

[GraceLikeRainFallsDown]

http://www.nogw.com/

That is one scary site you go to. I hope it is not your main news source. You must not sleep a lot reading all that junk. I could not help but notice it was not fair OR balanced.

I clicked on some of the links to see where they got their sources. The first one I clicked on was Al Jazeera. For some reason I do not think they are unbiased at all.

The couple of others I looked at were not reputable. Looked like a lot of conspiracy theory and anti-Isreal sites.

Please check your sources before spreading this propaganda around.

 

[tulc]

I clicked on some of the links to see where they got their sources. The first one I clicked on was Al Jazeera. For some reason I do not think they are unbiased at all.

What did you find biased there? Isn't it just a view of the news from a different perspective?
tulc(heard Al Jazeera was actually pretty good)

 

[Driver]

That is one scary site you go to. I hope it is not your main news source. You must not sleep a lot reading all that junk. I could not help but notice it was not fair OR balanced.

I like getting my news from various sources, because I don't think the major news outlets in the US (CBS, ABC, NBC, FOX) present the whole story. CSPAN might be the exception.

But, there are many alternative sources of information in the US available over the internet that are quite good and informative.

I came across www.nogw.com just recently when doing a Search on the Lebanese situation.

 

[Poke]

"What we need is another Pearl Harbor"

Translation:

What we need is another 9/11 or sort sort of extreme harm to the people of the US to wake Americans up to the fun of war. Go team! Yeah, Israel put that US-made bomb down and killed all those babies. Cool!!!! Long live Israel!!!!!!!!!


Disclaimer: I don't support the killing of babies, but it's not Israel's fault, it's all those anti-semites' fault for resisting Israeli aggression.

 

[GraceLikeRainFallsDown]

What did you find biased there? Isn't it just a view of the news from a different perspective?
tulc(heard Al Jazeera was actually pretty good)

It is definitely news from a "different perspective". But, it is so biased that I doubt it is the truth. Did you see the main headline on the home page. . . "George W. Bush - Terrorist in the White House". This is obviously a very extremist point of view. It shows they have a prejudice against the President to start.

I also saw a prejudice against Isreal. There was no talk of what the other side did to Isreal, it was all one sided. (Maybe I missed the Isreali viewpoint)

Motive of the writer is important in journalism. Things can be so twisted in the media today, any theory can be supported by some source. That does not mean it is what really happened.

It is hard to discern the truth from partial truths twisted into a lie to promote an agenda. All sides of the isle do the twisting. Sometimes it seems the general public will never know the true story behind things.

I personally doubt the sources on the site that was posted and caution others to take what they say as fact.

Others are free to believe them. We all need to do our own research and come up with our own conclusion.

 

[tulc]

Did you see the main headline on the home page. . . "George W. Bush - Terrorist in the White House". This is obviously a very extremist point of view. It shows they have a prejudice against the President to start.

Ahhh LOL! But if you saw a headline that said "Hezbollah: terrorist attacks continue!" you wouldn't think it was biased? Why? Isn't it because "Well everyone knows that's true!" but not everyone believes they (Israel) are wholly innocent. or that Hezbollah are wholly evil. Again, it is a view point most of us Americans haven't ever considered but our viewpoint isn't the ONLY viewpoint. See?
tulc(just a thought)

 

[ContraMundum]

Israel is mass murdering Lebanese, using a flimsy pretext to justify it, and you think anti-Semitic rhetoric is the problem? Israel is the chief cause of anti-Semitic rhetoric.

Before I vomit any more- you'd have to read a lot of Chomky and Blum to get a mind as mixed up on politics and hard truth as this.

Hezbollah started a fight they wanted to have. You don't stockpile 10k+ missiles and train for a decade for nothing. They want civilian and UN casualties (otherwise they would not fight from civilian and UN positions, which no sane person now disputes, would they?) and they got them. They got what they wanted, and suckers like you play into their game.

They want your sympathy, but deep down, they hate you. They want your culture destroyed and replaced by theirs. How gullible are you? I suggest you put down your Chomsky and ignore your university lecturer on this and get yourself some real information.

Dr Walid Phares' book "Future Jihad" is worth checking out- and believe me, he knows more about this than whatever left/green rag you've been reading.

 

[ContraMundum]

Ahhh LOL! But if you saw a headline that said "Hezbollah: terrorist attacks continue!" you wouldn't think it was biased? Why? Isn't it because "Well everyone knows that's true!" but not everyone believes they (Israel) are wholly innocent. or that Hezbollah are wholly evil. Again, it is a view point most of us Americans haven't ever considered but our viewpoint isn't the ONLY viewpoint. See?
tulc(just a thought)

There's always diverse points of view- but that doesn't mean you discount all of them, do you?

I think some people just like to be "rebels" against the status quo and push "alternative" views just because they can't handle the fact that sometimes the status quo is correct.

Blaming Israel for anti-semitism is like blaming deer for deer hunters.

 

[tulc]

There's always diverse points of view- but that doesn't mean you discount all of them, do you?

Uhmmm I think that was MY point.

I think some people just like to be "rebels" against the status quo and push "alternative" views just because they can't handle the fact that sometimes the status quo is correct.

...and sometimes it's not.

Blaming Israel for anti-semitism is like blaming deer for deer hunters.

I agree, but with the proviso: because someone disagree's with Isreal's policies doesn't make them anti-semite.
tulc(just a guy who likes different views!)

 

[Driver]

I agree, but with the proviso: because someone disagree's with Isreal's policies doesn't make them anti-semite.

That's so true. Just like disagreeing with Bush's policies does not make you anti-Christian or anti-American!