What was the most important battle in world history?

[rahma]

Rahama my brother,I call you my brother because I really believe that we are brothers.

It's hard for me to be a brother when I am female

What most people deny is the rich culture and history that Arabs have brought us,Let's face it,before Islam was Esau and before Esau was Ishmael and before him was Nimrod and Cain who built the greatest citys in the world.The first born sons always were the men to be envied,Who did Abraham love so much? Abraham prayed that Ishmael might live before him and the twelve tribes of Ishmael are listed in the bible.

Um, ok, what's your point?

The only problem with the world today is Islam.Islam is not the problem because we all don't like Islam,Islam is the problem because Islamic terrorists are killing people.Islamic terrorists are also killing Muslims as we see everyday in Iraq.

There are 1.5 billion muslims in the world. If we were all terrorists or problems, there wouldn't be a world left. The very fact that terrorists make up .0000000000000000001% of our total population shows that they are the exception rather then the rule.

What other religion is blowing up innocent people in suicide bombings?

Well, historically several groups have used suicide attacks. It wasn't originated by Muslims.

But, in modern times, it has been used in Sri Lanka, a conflict Muslims have no part in

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2004/jul2004/sril-j09.shtml

http://www.essex.ac.uk/armedcon/Countries/Asia/Texts/SriLanka011.htm

How do you justify the world trade centers or the people being killed in 25 nations by Muslims?

I do not justify the World Trade Center bombing, nor do most Muslims

Muslim Condemnations of 9/11

As for many of the other numerous conflicts around the globe, each must be evaluated seperately. There are multiple factors that go into a conflict. The religion of the participants is but one factor in a multitude. Oftentimes, economic or sovereignty issues are a far greater motivating factor then religion.

how do you justify the hundreds of children killed the other day in Russia by the rebels or the Philipines and all over Africa?

I do not justify it. I condemn it. I look to the example of the Prophet Muhammad (saws) who cried when he found innocent women and children killed in battle.

And also, just as a hint, Muslims have no part in the vast majority of African conflicts. Although Sudan gets most of the press now adays (after languishing for a long time without), the crises in Uganda are definately on the same scale, and there are no muslims involved there. No Muslims invovled in Rwanda either.

Can you tell me that Islamic rule has nothing to do with these millions of people killed?

Yes, it has nothing to do with it. If there was really Islamic rule, we wouldn't have despotic rulers and tyrants ruling "muslim" countries.

9-11 reminds me of O.J.Sympson because every muslim in the world rejoiced at seeing the towers fall,allthough they should know it was wrong ,they smiled and it felt right to them .

I celebrated? Wow, I must have done it in the midst of my crying, praying and seeking out friends for comfort.

Again, I give you this link

Muslim Condemnation of 9/11

Islamic Scholars Condemn Attacks

We saw Palistinians dancing in the streets and Muslims celebrating in every Muslim nation.

Palestinian children observe 5 minutes of silence in memory of those who died on September 11.

From the website I gave above:

-- The terrorist act was strongly condemned by every single Palestinian organization including Fatah, the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, Hamas, Workers Unions and Committees, Human Right organizations (AlHaq, Law, Palestine Center for Human Rights), student associations, municipalities, mosques and churches, etc.

- The US Consul General in Jerusalem reported that he has received a huge stack of faxes from Palestinians and Palestinian organizations expressing condolences, grief and solidarity. He himself was pained to see that the media chose to focus on the sensational images of a few Palestinians rejoicing.

- The Palestine Legislative Council condemned the terrorist attack on the United States and sent an urgent letter of condolences to Mr. J Dennis Hasterd, Speaker of the House of Representatives.

- Palestinians in East Jerusalem held a candle-light vigils on 12 and 14 September to express their grief and solidarity with the American families struck by this tragedy. Mr. Abdel Qader Al-Husseini, son of the late Palestinian leader Faisal Al-Husseini led one of the vigils.

- Jerusalem University students, along with the President of the University and the Deans of the various Faculties, began a blood donation drive in East Jerusalem. Students and professors went to hospitals in order to donate blood for the American victims who need it.

- The 1 million Palestinian students in the Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, stood five minutes in silence to express their solidarity with the hundreds of American children who have been struck by this strategy, which resembles in its shocking effects their daily sufferings

My husband is an Egyptian who was in Egypt when September 11 happened. There was no rejoicing. I've lived in Egypt since September 11, and when people find out I'm an American, almost always the first thing out of their mouth is, we are so sorry to hear what happened to your country. It was a terrible terrible thing.

Same thing happened with O.J. The blacks know he killed them people but they rejoiced when he was set free.

I really like how you think all blacks are alike and all blacks think the same thing. Many white people (myself included) don't think OJ did it either

I think you should be a man and admit it,you know you want to,You smiled when them towers fell didnt you?

Well, I'm not a man, so it's hard to be one. Let me think if I smiled. Hmm, nope, I cried. After I cried, I cried some more. Then I hid in my room because there are people out there, kind of like you, who think all muslims enjoy killing innocent people.

As a Muslim I believe you have a physical right to live in the land of Palistine

That's nice, but I'm not Palestinian. Most Muslims are not Palestinian. I dont' have any more right to that land then the Israelis.

Egypt,Iraq,Jordan,Lebanon,Syria Afganastan and Turkey should be the most wealthiest nations in the world because if there was really peace tourist would never stop 24 hours a day but people are scared.Why?

Tourist nations aren't really all that wealthy. Egypt does get tons of tourists though. It's a nice place, good weather, very friendly people.

 

[crazy4Christ007]

Most important battle:
Biblical = God vs. Satan....God will win
non-secular = Persian Wars and Pelopennesian War

 

[Zug-Zwang]

It's hard for me to be a brother when I am female



Um, ok, what's your point?




There are 1.5 billion muslims in the world. If we were all terrorists or problems, there wouldn't be a world left. The very fact that terrorists make up .0000000000000000001% of our total population shows that they are the exception rather then the rule.



Well, historically several groups have used suicide attacks. It wasn't originated by Muslims.

But, in modern times, it has been used in Sri Lanka, a conflict Muslims have no part in

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2004/jul2004/sril-j09.shtml

http://www.essex.ac.uk/armedcon/Countries/Asia/Texts/SriLanka011.htm




I do not justify the World Trade Center bombing, nor do most Muslims

Muslim Condemnations of 9/11

As for many of the other numerous conflicts around the globe, each must be evaluated seperately. There are multiple factors that go into a conflict. The religion of the participants is but one factor in a multitude. Oftentimes, economic or sovereignty issues are a far greater motivating factor then religion.



I do not justify it. I condemn it. I look to the example of the Prophet Muhammad (saws) who cried when he found innocent women and children killed in battle.

And also, just as a hint, Muslims have no part in the vast majority of African conflicts. Although Sudan gets most of the press now adays (after languishing for a long time without), the crises in Uganda are definately on the same scale, and there are no muslims involved there. No Muslims invovled in Rwanda either.



Yes, it has nothing to do with it. If there was really Islamic rule, we wouldn't have despotic rulers and tyrants ruling "muslim" countries.




I celebrated? Wow, I must have done it in the midst of my crying, praying and seeking out friends for comfort.

Again, I give you this link

Muslim Condemnation of 9/11

Islamic Scholars Condemn Attacks

Palestinian children observe 5 minutes of silence in memory of those who died on September 11.

From the website I gave above:



My husband is an Egyptian who was in Egypt when September 11 happened. There was no rejoicing. I've lived in Egypt since September 11, and when people find out I'm an American, almost always the first thing out of their mouth is, we are so sorry to hear what happened to your country. It was a terrible terrible thing.





I really like how you think all blacks are alike and all blacks think the same thing. Many white people (myself included) don't think OJ did it either



Well, I'm not a man, so it's hard to be one. Let me think if I smiled. Hmm, nope, I cried. After I cried, I cried some more. Then I hid in my room because there are people out there, kind of like you, who think all muslims enjoy killing innocent people.




That's nice, but I'm not Palestinian. Most Muslims are not Palestinian. I dont' have any more right to that land then the Israelis.



Tourist nations aren't really all that wealthy. Egypt does get tons of tourists though. It's a nice place, good weather, very friendly people.

I am very ashamed that I put all Muslims lumped together in one pile,I do the same thing all the time with Christians and I really shouldn't do it but it seems to come around because of my obvious anger.Have you ever seen deliverance with Burt Reynolds? I'm one of those country boys,backwoods and hatefull.I hate you because I'm jealous of you,I hate Christians because they represent me and that's not who I am,they also hate you but for a different reason.I thought you were a male for some reason,I just assumed without looking at your symbol,I assumed that because you have something about you,A passion maybe that made me think you were a man.You being female disturbs me even further because while I see Muslim males as my brother,I see Muslim women as my wife and they are cheating on me.I must sound like a phycho by now but you being a Muslim woman makes me jealous for good reason.I compare you with Christian women,you have alot of passion and you obviously are a very intelligent woman and you of course are willing to sacrifice because I see that you sacrifice your time just being in here,you probably wear a headscarf and whether your Jewish or Muslim that turns me on because you wear it for G-d.You say you believe in the G-d of Adam,of his children,of Noah's children,of Abraham's children,you recognize Yeshuah in the Qur'an saying he will have his day of Judgement.Arab's and Muslims give respect to the bible cause they know it's a holy book but they stray because it states the role of Arab and Muslims as being G-d's people but G-d's inheritance is Israel and he says that over and over,the g-d of Abraham states that it's Isaac who has the inheritance not Ishmael,It's Israel not Esau.
The problem with Muslims and Jews is that they both see the name of Irael meaning only one thing{Jews}

Rahma,you say you live in Egypt,In 722 bc the king of Assyria took Egyptians and Babylonians{Iraqi's} and placed them in the excact house of the Northern kingdom of Israel,called Ephraim known as the house of Israel and commonly called the ten lost tribes.Those ten tribes are callled lost because Arabs took their houses in 722 bc and they were called the new house of Israel.Christians also claim to be the new house of Israel because they also were grafted into the house of Israel in Yeshuah's day.Arab's till this day occuppy the house of Israel,It has many names,it's capital is Shechem{Nablus},it is also called the house of Joseph second in command of Egypt in his day.Joseph had to sons by the priestess of On{Heliopolis}.Joseph's sons were Mannessa the first born and Ephraim{multitude of nations} these two head tribes of the northern kingdom of Israel are very well documented.The first born Mannessah always was at civil war with Ephraim in who would lead the house of Israel.It's an Ancient struggle,the first born fighting the second born.In 722 bc the struggle ended between Ephraim and Mannessah fighting for the kingdom.Samaritains now occupied the land till this day and the struggle was reborn after Yeshuah died calling gentiles to be grafted into Palistine by the spirit.So now we have Christians saying that they are Epraim{Palistine},they say they are the new house of Israel while Arab's claim the land physically.It's an ancient struggle and the bible speaks about it saying Ephraim devours Mannessah and Mannessah devours Ephraim and both are against Judah.The question remains,Who owns Jerusalem?

I say I hate you because I'm jealous of you because I see you as my Eve,my flesh occupying the land and while we should be defending each other,we are killing each other.

 

[aSoviet_Shield]

The two people who started this topic have the correct battles. The Soviet Union defeated Nazi army for Stalingrad. Bolshevik revolution in October 1917 is other very important battle of history. Strong Soviet army built from that time was army able to withstand Hitlers invasion into Soviet territory. If Czars army been instead of Red army then maybe Nazi win. Czar proved weak when Bolshevik overthrow him.

 

[Paladin Dave]

Rahama my brother,I call you my brother because I really believe that we are brothers.What most people deny is the rich culture and history that Arabs have brought us,Let's face it,before Islam was Esau and before Esau was Ishmael and before him was Nimrod and Cain who built the greatest citys in the world.The first born sons always were the men to be envied,Who did Abraham love so much? Abraham prayed that Ishmael might live before him and the twelve tribes of Ishmael are listed in the bible.The only problem with the world today is Islam.Islam is not the problem because we all don't like Islam,Islam is the problem because Islamic terrorists are killing people.Islamic terrorists are also killing Muslims as we see everyday in Iraq.What other religion is blowing up innocent people in suicide bombings? How do you justify the world trade centers or the people being killed in 25 nations by Muslims? how do you justify the hundreds of children killed the other day in Russia by the rebels or the Philipines and all over Africa?Millions and millions,do you know how many mass graves it takes to bury a million people?Can you tell me that Islamic rule has nothing to do with these millions of people killed? You can't because it's historical fact that its happening.

9-11 reminds me of O.J.Sympson because every muslim in the world rejoiced at seeing the towers fall,allthough they should know it was wrong ,they smiled and it felt right to them .We saw Palistinians dancing in the streets and Muslims celebrating in every Muslim nation.Same thing happened with O.J. The blacks know he killed them people but they rejoiced when he was set free.I think you should be a man and admit it,you know you want to,You smiled when them towers fell didnt you? As a Muslim I believe you have a physical right to live in the land of Palistine and because I believe in Yehsuah I believe I also have a right to live in the land of Palistine along with our brother Israel but Islam and Christianity has fought against Israel.There is no difference in Hamas or hezbolla or Alquada and to think otherwise is madness.Egypt,Iraq,Jordan,Lebanon,Syria Afganastan and Turkey should be the most wealthiest nations in the world because if there was really peace tourist would never stop 24 hours a day but people are scared.Why?

My, I think we are over generalizing a bit my friend. I understand the ancestors of Jews and Muslims have been fighting for millennia, but that is no reason to claim that soemone, especially a good person like Rahma, would rejoice in the death of innocent people when you do not know this person. I think you would do well to get to know more muslims, and you may find that they are not all bad, because if they were, do you really think you or I would be alive today? There are so many out there that if they were all evil, all of humanity would be pretty screwed. Rahma is actually an advocate of peace and cooperation between muslims and non muslims from what I have seen, and I am sure that dancing for joy or smiling was the last thing she was doing when the planes hit. And I ask you? How can you justify the killing of many innocent saracens, jews, byzantines etc by christian warriors during the crusades? If that sort of violence is enough to make you hate Islam, then is it enough to make you hate christians as well? Do you feel the same way about italians, due to the way that the Roman Empire treated the jews? Or how about Germans? In the world of the shallow minded, german=nazi, just as muslim=terrorist. You would definately do well to try and learn more about a group of people and think of members of this group as individuals, and not just a statistic, or being just like the common example of their group.

 

[lismore]

Agincourt was France and England. I had to do some Googling, but you're thinking of Tours in 732. Good call. I'd toss in Manzikert (1071) and Vienna (1683) as being the other two key battles in the military conflicts between Christendom and Islam.

.

My favorite is Lepanto in 1571. The navy of venice+ the spanish Armada completely destroyed the Turkish invasion fleet. Saved Italy from muslim domination .

 

[lismore]

What do you think it is?

I would say the Battle of Stalingrad during World War II, as it kept Germany from defeating the Soviet Union and gaining control of its resources, especially the oil.

What's your pick?

Another good one for me is the battle of the Milvian Bridge . End of pgagan Rome.

 

[lismore]

The idea that Germany could have had an atomic bomb has no basis in reality.

Go to the Telemark Museum

 

[lismore]

. But in this case, the Crusades were not a war of defense against the Muslims at all.

.

If you take into account the horrendous massacre of the People of Ani, the capital of Armenia, by the Turks and the fall of Nicea, Ephesus and Iconium to the Turks. Add to this the fact that the Turks were undefeated and there was no large Byantine Army to stop them. The high point of the Turkish advance was to within 2 miles of constantinople. Add to this the fact that so many Christians: Cilicians, Lycians, Carians, Armenians (Greater and Lesser Armenia) and Georgians welcomed the crusaders you can see that this was a war of defence against muslim aggression.

The Byzantines certainly benefited from the crusade: they recaptured Nicea and Ephesus from the Turks because of it, Nicea being the second city of the Empire.

 

[Diane_Windsor]

What's your pick?

The Battle of Calvary where one man had to overcome so much to defeat sin and death. No other battle in history affects the eternal salvation of people.

Diane

 

[Blackmarch]

The Battle of Calvary where one man had to overcome so much to defeat sin and death. No other battle in history affects the eternal salvation of people.

Diane

Thou hast resurrected this thread...
LoL

One would also add that it started in the Garden of Gethsemane.

 

[Roman Soldier]

It's a little annoying when people come to this forum trying to preach. Like when we ask what was the greatest disaster in history and someone comes along and says a world-wide flood. Or when they refer to a religous event as a "battle" when we are clearly talking about wars.

 

[Milla]

In order to decide what the most important battle in world history is, you have to decide what the most important region is in world history, and that just becomes silly. Western Europe is dominant now, but on a scale of the history of humanity, that's a fairly recent development. It's even a fairly recent development compared to the beginning of written history. I think a more interesting challenge would be to determine the most important battle to the history of each nation...what battle solidified an individual nation's power, or signified its downfall? That sort of thing.

 

[Milla]

how do you justify the hundreds of children killed the other day in Russia by the rebels or the Philipines and all over Africa?Millions and millions,do you know how many mass graves it takes to bury a million people?Can you tell me that Islamic rule has nothing to do with these millions of people killed?

I know I've made this point innumerable times on this board, but I'll make it again. The conflict over Chechnya has little to nothing to do with religion. It's been going on for centuries, and it's about national self-determination - namely, Chechens form a unique ethnic group which has resisted domination by the Russian Empire, USSR and now the Russian Federation. It has become a fight of ***-for-tat - the Russian government strikes against the Chechens, who strike back, which causes the Russians to strike, etc. The rhetoric used by the Chechen rebels, both historically and in modernity, contains little to no reference to religion. The wholesale attacks on civilians are a new and disturbing development in this cycle of violence - I believe the escalation to be related to increased frustration because in general the other nations that wanted independence were granted it during the breakup of the USSR but Chechnya was left dominated. I wish Chechnya had been let go as well; it would have been such a good time to end this endless conflict without excessive loss of face.

 

[f16fan12]

definitely the battle of gettysburgh

 

[Diane_Windsor]

It's a little annoying when people come to this forum trying to preach. Like when we ask what was the greatest disaster in history and someone comes along and says a world-wide flood. Or when they refer to a religous event as a "battle" when we are clearly talking about wars.

I'm not trying to preach at anyone, and I regret that you get that impression. Having said that please keep in mind that this is a Christian message board so expect Christians to voice their opinions too. For me, the Cross was indeed a battle, and it is the most important battle (in the war against evil and death) in all of history IMO.

Diane

 

[DJ_Ghost]

Having said that please keep in mind that this is a Christian message board so expect Christians to voice their opinions too.

We have been, and in the spirit in which the thread was intended.

Ghost

 

[Diane_Windsor]

We have been, and in the spirit in which the thread was intended.

Ghost

I have too in the spirit of the thread

Diane