What the Bush Administration thinks of Christians.

[Hunterkirk]

"the" liberals and Democrats? Stop generalizing.
Ringo

Show me how the generalization is wrong.

 

[Hunterkirk]

Your very words prove that if such unfounded, arbitrary animosity exists (though I don't believe it does) between the parties, that it certainly goes both ways.

That aside, I've never heard any Democrat "hating" or "mocking" conservatives, at least not any worse than the Republicans dish out. It goes both ways. And it's important to know that the loudest voices will get heard, even though those voices rarely speak for the majority. Just because you heard some shock jock liberal say that "conservatives are stupid" (though you would have probably heard that on FoxNews...), doesn't mean that those views represent the party of movement as a whole.

Again you have offered no proof of a likeing for Conservative Christians by the Democrats or by liberals for that matter. Till evidance can be shown to refute that the claim still stands. The Democrats have meet with Hamas they refuse to meet with Conservative Christians.

 

[Candide]

No, you're the one making the outlandish claim, thus, if you wish to avoid logical fallacies, you must show the proof. The burden of proof is on you, not me, mate.

 

[Ringo84]

Show me how the generalization is wrong.

Show how it's wrong? The mere fact that it's a generalization makes it wrong.

You take a minority of Democrats and liberals who possibly feel the same way that you described in your original post, and you make it apply to ALL liberals and Democrats.

Not only is it a logical fallacy, but it's absolutely wrong. I'm both a liberal AND a Democrat and I fight hard in the intellectual battle for religious freedom, as evidenced by my activity on this forum. So don't put words into my mouth.
Ringo

 

[unity77]

Bush by his actions emphasizes the con in conservative Christian.

 

[GoodNewsJim]

When George Bush was in China he signed a book in a church a greeting to all Christians. I am not one that cares if China is communistic or something different, but I do care that our Christian brothers are linked across the world. Christians aren't one's to revolt against a government, but they have been targetted as if they were some serious underlying threat in different parts of the world. I'm just saying this because it wasn't like Bush did this with a motive. He truly believes in Jesus and tries to act according to what God wants him to do.

 

[Hunterkirk]

Show how it's wrong? The mere fact that it's a generalization makes it wrong.

You take a minority of Democrats and liberals who possibly feel the same way that you described in your original post, and you make it apply to ALL liberals and Democrats.

Not only is it a logical fallacy, but it's absolutely wrong. I'm both a liberal AND a Democrat and I fight hard in the intellectual battle for religious freedom, as evidenced by my activity on this forum. So don't put words into my mouth.
Ringo

LOL sure what ever you want to think. By the way nice dodging, you have yet to site a example of democrats sopporting conservative christian values. Although they have made lots of outreach to terrorist groups like hamas.

 

[Candide]

You mean like some of the recently elected congressional Democrats who are pro-life?

 

[Ringo84]

LOL sure what ever you want to think. By the way nice dodging, you have yet to site a example of democrats sopporting conservative christian values. Although they have made lots of outreach to terrorist groups like hamas.

Why should I have to "prove" anything to you? Did someone die and appoint you the Guardian of Morals?

Besides which: I didn't come here to defend the "unChristian" actions of Congressional Democrats. I came here to address your generalization, which I have already done.
Ringo

 

[Hunterkirk]

Why should I have to "prove" anything to you? Did someone die and appoint you the Guardian of Morals?

Besides which: I didn't come here to defend the "unChristian" actions of Congressional Democrats. I came here to address your generalization, which I have already done.
Ringo

Hey you were the one questioning the position that the democrats have no interest in reaching out to conservative Christians. Granted they love talking to terrorist groups like Hama's, but Democrats have to have standards don't they?

 

[Hunterkirk]

You mean like some of the recently elected congressional Democrats who are pro-life?

LOL pro lifers who vote for abortion "rights"... those guys right?

 

[Ringo84]

Hey you were the one questioning the position that the democrats have no interest in reaching out to conservative Christians. Granted they love talking to terrorist groups like Hama's, but Democrats have to have standards don't they?

I was questioning your assertion that all Democrats/liberals thought and acted alike. That's why I posted in this thread in the first place.
Ringo

 

[Hunterkirk]

I was questioning your assertion that all Democrats/liberals thought and acted alike. That's why I posted in this thread in the first place.
Ringo

I responded that the Democrats have no interest in reaching out to the Christian Conservative and how they are willing to talk with terrorist groups but would never come to talk with conservative christians.

Because of that FACT the Conservative Christian may as well side with a party that at least throws them a bone from time to time and listens to them when they talk then a party that so deeply dislikes them.

Nothing you have said proves any of this wrong, no matter how much one may try to personnalize it. We are talking about partys here and liberals as a group not as individuals. When you talk about groups of people you have to generalize based on the norms of that group.

 

[Candide]

Have you ever seen a conservative Christian reach out to a Democrat?

Adversely, why does it matter? It's not as though conservative Christians are the only Christians, so he's not making the assertion that there's no Christian Democrats. Though I would argue that there are conservative Christian Democrats, though they may not be very prominent in the party. Harry Reid is a Mormon, for god sake.

 

[Ringo84]

Have you ever seen a conservative Christian reach out to a Democrat?

Adversely, why does it matter? It's not as though conservative Christians are the only Christians, so he's not making the assertion that there's no Christian Democrats. Though I would argue that there are conservative Christian Democrats, though they may not be very prominent in the party. Harry Reid is a Mormon, for god sake.

Good point, Candide. Thank you.

On the other hand, why would Democrats want to reach out to conservative Christians? A lot of conservative Christians (but not all of them) spend a lot of time and energy griping about liberals and Democrats - calling them anti-God, accusing them of hating this country, being evil, etc etc. To some people, it seems as though faith is only valid if it's conservative faith. It doesn't exactly inspire me to reach out to those who are very long on condemnation and accusations and very short on compassion and understanding. Perhaps those conservative Christians who feel so slighted should remember that before taking a seat on the pity pot.

It's not that they don't necessarily have a case. It's just that there are two sides to every issue. Conservative Christians feel devalued by Democrats, and many Democrats feel as though most conservative Christians think them evil and Godless.

I can't tell you about the Hamas connection. I don't have knowledge on the issue to speak about it coherently, though it seems more like propaganda than objective fact (no offense; it's just an observation. I can tell you, however, that your generalization above about liberals and Democrats is wrong. There are liberal Democrats who are Christians. I am one of them, and I don't see any conflict in those two things at all.
Ringo

 

[Hunterkirk]

Have you ever seen a conservative Christian reach out to a Democrat?

Adversely, why does it matter? It's not as though conservative Christians are the only Christians, so he's not making the assertion that there's no Christian Democrats. Though I would argue that there are conservative Christian Democrats, though they may not be very prominent in the party. Harry Reid is a Mormon, for god sake.

Why should they?

Secondly thinking Mormons are Christian much less conservative Christians shows how little you know about the Christian Conservative movement. Mormons are not considered Christian by them and neither are Jehovah Witnesses.

As for LIberal Christians since they dont like to define Christianity or set it to any kind of structure, much less speak of their faith openly, it makes sense they would feel welcome in the Democrat party. As a explaination of the effect of Liberal Democrats (which are in strong control of that party) on the few Conservative Christians in that party I would point to my wife and parents whom are both Democrats and Christian Conservatives, they have not voted for a Democrat for over 16 years now.