What New Aspect Of The Sabbath Is Contained In "proclaiming The Sabbath More Fully"??

[keyboard321]

Just curious...

If in that verse it includes the 10 commandments, then why would it be contrary to us and against us? I'm talking about Col 2:14-17

Just asking guys...

 

[Martinman]

Just curious...

If in that verse it includes the 10 commandments, then why would it be contrary to us and against us? I'm talking about Col 2:14-17

Just asking guys...

Colossians 2:16, 17 "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]: Which are a shadow of things to come;"


From the verse itself, all of the items mentioned "are shadows of things to come", and are references to rituals and observances in the old covenant, the earthly sanctuary. This entire system was prophetic. It shows what is to come in the plan of salvation and the exact time of when the events represented would occur.

"The Sabbath was committed to Adam, the father and representative of the whole human family. Its observance was to be an act of grateful acknowledgment, on the part of all who should dwell upon the earth, that God was their Creator and their rightful Sovereign; that they were the work of His hands and the subjects of His authority. Thus the institution was wholly commemorative, and given to all mankind. There was nothing in it shadowy or of restricted application to any people." PP 48

This quotation from Patriarchs and Prophets says that the 7th-day Sabbath is not a "shadow".

Here we have positive inspired proof that the 7th-day Sabbath is not the "Sabbath" mentioned in Colossians 2:16, 17.

The "Sabbath" in Colossians are only shadows of where the 7th day Sabbath will be in the weekly cycle when the feast days are fulfilled.

If you stand in the light, your body will cast a shadow. But the shadow is not you, its only a shadow of you. This applies to the "shadow" Sabbaths. They are not the 7th day Sabbath, but they represent it.

 

[Martinman]

Col 2:16 says nothing about the sabbath day itself. Paul being that he was a observing Jew would never advocate for others to act differently.

The key phrase in this verse is 'in respect of'. That means things connected to, associated to. Paul was actually saying let no man judge in food and drink and things associated to the holy days, sabbath and the new moon. The Jews made a thousand regulations regarding the sabbath. Paul was liberating the new gentile Christians from burden of the man-made Rabbinical laws, not from the delight of the sabbath of the 10 commandments of God.

When the curtain in the temple was torn from the top to the bottom in 31 C.E. when the Messiah yielded up His life for man, the old covenant ended and our focus now is on the reality, the new covenant, where Christ is our High Priest in the heavenly sanctuary.

Paul was showing the prophetic nature of items within the earthly sanctuary system--meat offerings, drink offerings, etc. All of these were "shadows" representing facets of the new covenant in event and in the time they were to be fulfilled. They were shadows only of some future reality.

 

[OntheDL]

Just curious...

If in that verse it includes the 10 commandments, then why would it be contrary to us and against us? I'm talking about Col 2:14-17

Just asking guys...

Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Because Paul was talking about the Mosaic law.

Deuteronomy 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

 

[Cribstyl]

Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Because Paul was talking about the Mosaic law.

Deuteronomy 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

Now that's biblical truth I can agree with. What Paul is calling "the handwriting of ordinances that was against us" is "all things" written in the book of the law.
Now where we disagree is that SDA claim the law of Moses is not the law of God. The book of Deuteronomy proves that those terms are interchangeably for the same law.

What I dont see implied, is that the book of the law was altered by Moses or the Rabbis in reference to what Paul is saying in Col 2.

 

[keyboard321]

Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Because Paul was talking about the Mosaic law.

Deuteronomy 31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

Thanks! that is what I'm thinking

 

[OntheDL]

Now that's biblical truth I can agree with. What Paul is calling "the handwriting of ordinances that was against us" is "all things" written in the book of the law.
Now where we disagree is that SDA claim the law of Moses is not the law of God. The book of Deuteronomy proves that those terms are interchangeably for the same law.

What I dont see implied, is that the book of the law was altered by Moses or the Rabbis in reference to what Paul is saying in Col 2.

When the Jews talk about the law: torah, they refer to the whole law. However the bible gives distinction between the two.

The Mosaic law was written by Moses under the direction of God. The Mosaic law was the contractual term of the provisional covenant of Sinai. The book of law of Moses was placed out side of the Ark of Covenant, Deut 31:26, as a witness against man's failure to abide by the covenant. And the ceremonies defined in the Mosaic law expired at the crucifixion because they prefigured Christ and His ministry.

The Ten commandments were written by God's own finger. They are the contractual terms of the eternal covenant ratified by the blood of Jesus. They are the standard of judgment and are placed inside of the Ark of Covenant in the heavenly sanctuary.

Paul taught against holding the NT Christians under the Mosaic law. That law expired at the cross. That and the oral law (Jesus called tradition of elders: the Rabbinical teaching from Talmud) did not apply to the new gentile Christians who came into a predominantly Jewish Christian church. This was the main controversy in the new church. We see this in Act 15 and throughout the Pauline writings.

 

[ChrisCarol]

It's because myself and Stryder and Adventists Crib and read these passages differently than you... what do you expect in an SDA room?

Does the SDA chruch make statement that:

Seventh-day Adventists accept the Bible as their only creed and hold certain fundamental beliefs to be the teaching of the Holy Scriptures.

If this is true then why would you look at passages differently and expect something different in an SDA room.

I believe the same as Cribstylyet I haven't a clue as to her place of worship. I only see that she takes her instruction from the Bible and the Bible alone. You cannot make that statement because it is very evident that your understanding comes from the writings of Ellen.

 

[OntheDL]

Does the SDA chruch make statement that:

Seventh-day Adventists accept the Bible as their only creed and hold certain fundamental beliefs to be the teaching of the Holy Scriptures.

If this is true then why would you look at passages differently and expect something different in an SDA room.

I believe the same as Cribstylyet I haven't a clue as to her place of worship. I only see that she takes her instruction from the Bible and the Bible alone. You cannot make that statement because it is very evident that your understanding comes from the writings of Ellen.

That statement is very typical of an outsider who does not understand SDA beliefs and how they were formulated.

When SDA beliefs were formed, Ellen White was only about 17 and had no formal education. What influence do you think an young girl could have on grown men during the mid-1800's?

SDA beliefs came from exhaustive bible studies and earnest prayers. Ellen White's prophetic gifts only later confirmed what they had come to believe. That's just a historical fact.

The bible ever since it was first written has been an subject to interpretation. The Jews had different factions and sects. Christianity has over 30000 denominations all based on how they interpret the bible.

When you have studied what we believe and what sets us apart, you can then ask why we believe in certain ways instead of saying our beliefs are not biblical and are based Ellen White's writings.

 

[ChrisCarol]

That statement is very typical of an outsider who does not understand SDA beliefs and how they were formulated.

When SDA beliefs were formed, Ellen White was only about 17 and had no formal education. What influence do you think an young girl could have on grown men during the mid-1800's?

SDA beliefs came from exhaustive bible studies and earnest prayers. Ellen White's prophetic gifts only later confirmed what they had come to believe. That's just a historical fact.

The bible ever since it was first written has been an subject to interpretation. The Jews had different factions and sects. Christianity has over 30000 denominations all based on how they interpret the bible.

When you have studied what we believe and what sets us apart, you can then ask why we believe in certain ways instead of saying our beliefs are not biblical and are based Ellen White's writings.

Sorry doesn't cut with me. I am told by The Word of God to:

Deuteronomy 18:15
“ The LORD your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your countrymen, you shall listen to him.


I listen to Him.

And in Matthew 17:5While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.

I listen to Him.

Deuteronomy 20But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.

21And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? 22When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.

I listen to Him

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Sorry doesn't cut with me. I am told by The Word of God to:

Deuteronomy 18:15
“ The LORD your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your countrymen, you shall listen to him.


I listen to Him.

And in Matthew 17:5While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.

I listen to Him.

Deuteronomy 20But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.

21And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? 22When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.

I listen to Him

If you listen only to Him, can you tell me where He said to stop worshipping on the Sabbath? If the Sababth was a perpetual sign between Him and His people, there must be a 'thus saith the Lord' to change that, right?

 

[ricker]

If you listen only to Him, can you tell me where He said to stop worshipping on the Sabbath? If the Sababth was a perpetual sign between Him and His people, there must be a 'thus saith the Lord' to change that, right?

His people were the nation of Israel, who rejected Him and ceased to be a nation about 70AD. No Sabbath was ever given to a Gentile.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

His people were the nation of Israel, who rejected Him and ceased to be a nation about 70AD. No Sabbath was ever given to a Gentile.

Did Jesus teach that? Did He not minister to the Samaritan as well as the Jew? God's people have always been those that worshipped Him and obeyed Him, period. From Adam, to Enoch to Abraham to Moses to David to Daniel to Paul to Luther to us at the end of the world.... 'I change not'

 

[ChrisCarol]

If you listen only to Him, can you tell me where He said to stop worshipping on the Sabbath? If the Sababth was a perpetual sign between Him and His people, there must be a 'thus saith the Lord' to change that, right?

Because

Matthew 17:5While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.

Matthew 28: 18
All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.

Therefore I can not find where Jesus has commanded me or you or anyone else to keep the Sabbath.

 

[ricker]

Did Jesus teach that? Did He not minister to the Samaritan as well as the Jew? God's people have always been those that worshipped Him and obeyed Him, period. From Adam, to Enoch to Abraham to Moses to David to Daniel to Paul to Luther to us at the end of the world.... 'I change not'

Jesus never commanded Sabbath observance of a Samaritan. You don't obey all the laws given to the nation of Israel. We are not under obligation to follow signs and covenants given exclusively to Israel. Christianity and Judaism are different religions. We are to obey God, but not all signs and covenants are given by God universally.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Jesus never commanded Sabbath observance of a Samaritan. You don't obey all the laws given to the nation of Israel. We are not under obligation to follow signs and covenants given exclusively to Israel. Christianity and Judaism are different religions. We are to obey God, but not all signs and covenants are given by God universally.

But yet you follow the precepts of the other nine Commandments (I assume)... why do you do that if you are no longer under the covenant given to Israel?

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Therefore I can not find where Jesus has commanded me or you or anyone else to keep the Sabbath.

Matt 5:19
Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matt 19:17
And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

We are told what these commandments are in Mark

Mark 10:19
Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.

Here are other verses that Jesus commanded...

John 14:15
If ye love me, keep my commandments.

John 15:10
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Here are the fruits of keeping the Commandments...

1 John 2:3,4
And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

1John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Rev 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.


Rev 22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Based on the last verse, what makes you think you are going to enter heaven without keeping the Commandments?

 

[Stryder06]

His people were the nation of Israel, who rejected Him and ceased to be a nation about 70AD. No Sabbath was ever given to a Gentile.

Ricker, have you read Isaiah 56? And let's be honest, not one of the promises of God made in the OT were for Gentiles, but I hear a whole lot of them claiming those Israel exclusive promises. In the NT, the gentiles were being called out of their old life and into the family of God.

 

[Stryder06]

Read it and believe if it's God's word. It's not that complicated.. It's not funny either.

It is simple isn't it.

These text are in form of a letter. It's says...dont let anyone judge you on meats, drink, holy days or sabbath days. Your commentary is what is introducing the law of Moses is implied. Your commentary implies that the law of Moses is seperate from the Law of God.

All the laws that Israel received came from God. Moses was the stewart of that law, which is why it is refered to as the law of Moses. And again, it's not worth arguing over. You imply that Paul is saying don't do xyz, while I imply that he is telling them to keep on doing xyz.

When we stay with the context we dont find Paul talking about only ceromonially laws or whatever you want to imply as the law of Moses. We find him talking about transgressions that lead to death that was against us. Hello???

Crib, Paul never taught against the law of God. Paul taught against rigtheousness by works.

What you should do is show us why you think that Paul is talking about the law of Moses. Where in the scriptures did Moses come up with a law about, what to eat, drink, Holy days and sabbaths to keep apart from what's in God's law.

What I should do is exactly what I've been doing. I'll continue to explain to you what I understand, and how I understand it.

 

[ChrisCarol]

Matt 5:19
Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matt 19:17
And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

We are told what these commandments are in Mark

Mark 10:19
Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.

Here are other verses that Jesus commanded...

John 14:15
If ye love me, keep my commandments.

John 15:10
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Here are the fruits of keeping the Commandments...

1 John 2:3,4
And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

1John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Rev 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.


Rev 22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Based on the last verse, what makes you think you are going to enter heaven without keeping the Commandments?

Mark 9:22 “It has often thrown him into fire or water to kill him. But if you can do anything, take pity on us and help us.”
23 “‘If you can’?” said Jesus. “Everything is possible for one who believes.”

Interesting the way Jesus responds to the father: “‘If you can’?”.

You responded to me in the same way in previous post:

If you listen only to Him, can you tell me where He said to stop worshipping on the Sabbath? If the Sababth was a perpetual sign between Him and His people, there must be a 'thus saith the Lord' to change that, right?

These verses do not say anything about commanding a Sabbath. You thru your interpreter have assumed too much. You are no different than the people Jesus spoke to when He walked this earth such as:



Matthew 19: 16And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?

17And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
18He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
19Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
20The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
21Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
22But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.
23Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
24And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
25When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved? 26But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

This underlined is the key to the whole verse. The rich young ruler could not get it and neither can you. God sent His Son for one reason:

John 3:16 For God so loved the World that He gave His Only Begotten Son that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

I believe it and there is your answer.

John 6:28Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent. 30They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?


Until you get God out of the box of understanding of your Prophetess you will never have the wonderful peace that comes from knowing He is Able and has done what He said He would do.

Thank you God for leading me to these your answers.

May God give you understanding as you seek this truth.