Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
Thank you. Agreed completely. But they will balk at this and deny they use the same thing themselves. Some even have gone so far as to say that we preach a self-contradicting, or mentally inconsistent/ incoherent god, capricious, mean and lying if not crazy. So, whenever possible, I show them other arguments that should do the job.
I'm not sure that's a fair assessment. I ask why all the time, and to me, the particular nature of the Bride answers that question (Why Jimmy and not Clark); it is God's choice, and it is not random. Unlike the question why does A choose well and B does not, answered by "freewill", which admits to randomness and chance.
Why? Give me a hint? Let me guess, a lot of posts which, supposedly, show that all mankind will be saved, the righteous and unrighteous alike, no matter what, even after death. Sorry. Bintheredunthat.
Ok, but the descriptions, or definitions, I hear concerning "free will" invoke (to whatever degree) a lack of causation, or a true spontaneity, which is simply logically self-contradictory to claim it exists to ANY degree, if not to a full degree; and it is also logically self-contradictory to attribute it to a mere creature. It can only refer to First Cause.
Haha, I would like to see how you would have responded, had I backed down after so such declarations as you have made, proven wrong, without admitting I was wrong.
Not everyone who does wrong things they want to do is eligible for prosecution. There is the age of accountability and people with very low IQs never reach it. Depravity is not considered.
I believe the Holy Spirit convicts people during the presentation of the Gospel but it is still up to them to respond. We see evidence of that in Peter's Acts 2 preaching style where he effectively promises salvation to those who repent & get baptized, and he implores the audience to "Save yourselves". If man's will is not involved, then why would Peter (being led by the Holy Spirit) strive so hard to get those in the audience to repent and be baptized?
Your question is an old one, and it is a common misunderstanding that Reformed Theology teaches that everything happens automatically, with no effort on the part of the elect. In particular this is taken to apply to the Gospel. I can't say that my answer will be typical of Reformed Theology, as there are a couple of things that I think about it that I don't often hear from anyone else. But the question is asked backwards, or in a mistaken way, attributing validity to our POV and being asked from that POV, assuming that our will is the operating principle, if it is at all involved. There is also the fact that if the sentient "free agent" (the human) is not willfully involved, it is still no implication that anything happens "automatically". I perhaps have said the human will is not involved in regeneration, because it is difficult to show someone who believes in the choice of man being the operative principle in salvation, how it is only by Grace. God does regenerate a person by use of all sorts of things, such as the preaching of the Gospel, and life's events, and human emotions and on and on. But these do not constitute regeneration.
Not to split hairs but your third group above would technically fall under the unbelievers group . So there are two groups . Even the ones who haven’t heard but will also fall under the two groups for they will either become a believer or remain unbelievers.
