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I don't, other than to guess that it has to be something that involves self-importance, or self-preservation involving denial of God. I can't see it happening to anyone "by accident", or in innocence.Speaking of the mark of the beast, how do you interpret that?
I believe it can happen at any time, because I have been wrong about many other things. As for the man of lawlessness, what does it mean —is it not possible that he has already been revealed and most did not realize it as such? But yes, I agree with the sequence as you show it.
Is it really "revealed" if no one gets it. . .particularly so since Paul makes it the condition for the second coming?
That's what I'm thinking, also. . .not to mention the spirit of the anti-Christ which is in the world, as well as many other anti-christs.There was this guru in India that said he came to fulfill what Jesus started. I don't know if his movement still exists, but his "spiritual blessings" were given all over the world. He was certrainly an antichrist, but when the antichrist comes, I think it will be quite obvious to true believers.
Do you think it could be a reference to the fleshly nature which is very much like a beast?I don't, other than to guess that it has to be something that involves self-importance, or self-preservation involving denial of God. I can't see it happening to anyone "by accident", or in innocence.
I have some opinions and have seen some vague parallels or applications in scripture, but I don't see anything firm to hold to other than the mere fact of it. I have more conjecture than even opinion. I don't know.It certainly does not have anything to do with after death repentance. I am surprised you say it is unknown. Most refer to it as part of the apostles creed. Surely you have an opinion, being a teacher.
I doubt it, though it will involve that, certainly.Do you think it could be a reference to the fleshly nature which is very much like a beast?
1Jo 2:18 ¶ Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.That's what I'm thinking, also. . .not to mention the spirit of the anti-Christ which is in the world, as well as many other anti-christs.
1Jo 2:18 ¶ Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
1Jo 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1Jo 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2Jo 1:7 ¶ For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
A 2000-year-old "last hour". . .for a day is as a thousand years.Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour.
— 1 John 2:18
About the same as yours.I have some opinions and have seen some vague parallels or applications in scripture, but I don't see anything firm to hold to other than the mere fact of it. I have more conjecture than even opinion. I don't know.
The apostles' creed doesn't even mention it specifically, but that he descended into hell, (or "to the dead") depending on what version is used. But the apostles' creed isn't Scripture. What Scripture mentions seems related to the judging of the living and the dead, which in my opinion is referring (if not also to other dead) to those dead to whom he preached.
The idea of 'proclaiming' rather than 'preaching' seems to me to allow some relevance to all things being restored to God.
What are your thoughts on it?
You don't really need my opinions. Aw shucks.I meant, you said them twice in answer to two different posts of mine, as if repeating them after I asked for you to explain their relevance, was the explanation of the relevance.
Haha! No, I'm saying I don't know what your opinion is, nor what your opinion is about. All I saw was a few Bible verses, that at first (and second) read did not seem relevant to the thread nor the post to which they were posted in response.You don't really need my opinions. Aw shucks.
If the passages did not directly address, then sorry. I did my best.Haha! No, I'm saying I don't know what your opinion is, nor what your opinion is about. All I saw was a few Bible verses, that at first (and second) read did not seem relevant to the thread nor the post to which they were posted in response.
Yes they were in Johns day as per 1 John 4:1-4 and 2 John 1:7That's what I'm thinking, also. . .not to mention the spirit of the anti-Christ which is in the world, as well as many other anti-christs.
Maharishi Mahesh YogiThere was this guru in India that said he came to fulfill what Jesus started. I don't know if his movement still exists, but his "spiritual blessings" were given all over the world. He was certrainly an antichrist (I even thought at the time it might be him), but when the antichrist comes, I think it will be quite obvious to true believers.
Maharishi Mahesh Yogi
I'm still not sure if you are discarding this: "How can one be responsible without actual willed choice?", for this: "How can one be responsible without uncaused free will?"
That's what I'm thinking, also. . .not to mention the spirit of the anti-Christ which is in the world, as well as many other anti-christs.
Here is my view on the teaching of the spirit of antichrist and what that means. It has to do with the 2 natures in Christ, that He is fully God and remains fully man, in the flesh. I have quoted several renown Greek scholars that concur.
The number one test to distinguish truth for error and the Spirit of God from that of the spirit of antichrist is the confession of our divine Lord Jesus Christ. Every spirit that confesses Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God. There is one thing the spirit of antichrist will deny and that is they will deny the deity of Jesus Christ. They will deny God in human flesh. They will always deny the Incarnation which was permanent. When a person affirms that Jesus Christ is God in flesh that equates to divine truth. Every spirit that confesses meaning to continually confess or agrees with saying the same thing as John declares in his writings is from God. This is the person who is taught by the Spirit of God according to John. The first test that you want to have for any teacher is their Christology, check out what they say about Christ. This becomes a litmus test that is very easy to spot among the false teachers. If you have somebody who denies the deity of Christ you have a clear indication they are of the spirit of antichrist.
If we go back to the beginning of 1 John, we read that which we he beheld, and actually touched concerning the Word of life. That is a term expressing the very deity of Christ. Christ emanates from God as His living Word. He was with the Father in the beginning in 1:2. Jesus was One with the Father sharing the same essence with the Father in heaven with Him before the foundation of the world. John says He was manifested to us. John's language then starts out with the fact that Jesus Christ emanates from God as the very living Word of God. Jesus is the living Word of God,the One John says that was from the beginning that we heard, we saw and we touched. Jesus the Word of life was the eternal One who was with the Father prior to His Incarnation and was then manifested to us in the flesh that we could see and hear and touch according to John. Therefore, we can clearly see Jesus is the very Word of God Incarnate. He is the eternal life who became flesh. The Word who was with God, the Word who was God, was the One who John says was manifested to us. This is how we can tell the spirit of truth from the spirit of antichrist. Can you confess Jesus is God Incarnate?
1 John 4:2
By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God;
2 John 7
For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is the deceiver and the antichrist.
Erchomenon the present participle in 2 John 7
Alford- the present tense is timeless(pg 274 RNTC on 2 John)
Brooke- the Incarnation is not only an event in history, it is an abiding truth(pg 274 RNTC on 2 John)
Stott- the two natures manhood and Godhood were united already at His birth, never to be divided. In 1 John 4:2 and here in 2 John 7 emphasizes this permanent union of the natures in the One Person ( TNTC pages 209-210) He who denies the Incarnation is not just a deceiver and an antichrist but “the deceiver and the antichrist”. There is in this heresy a double affront: it opposes Christ and deceives men.(stott TNCT page 210)
Marshall- the use of the present and perfect tenses becomes significant if the point is that Jesus Christ had come and still existed “in flesh”. For him(John) it was axiomatic that there had been a true Incarnation, that the word became flesh and remained flesh. It is a point that receives much stress in 1 John 2:18-28;4:1-6;5:5-8. (NICNT pages 70-71)
Smalley- the present tense emphasizes the permanent union of the human and Divine natures in Jesus. Gods self disclosure in Jesus took place at a particular moment in history , but it has continuing effects in the present and into the future(Word Biblical Commentary page 317)
Nicoll- the continuous manifestation of the Incarnate Christ(Expositors Greek Testament Volume 5 page 202)
Akin- Much has been made of the fact that John uses the present tense in this Christological confession. Literally the verse reads, “Jesus Christ coming in flesh.” “Coming” is a present active participle. This stands out in remarkable contrast to the affirmation of 1 John 4:2, where the text states that “Jesus Christ has [emphasis mine] come in the flesh.” There the perfect active participle is used. The key, it seems, is to discover what John is affirming. Here in 2 John the emphasis falls on the abiding reality of the incarnation. First John 4:2 teaches that the Christ, the Father’s Son (v. 3), has come in the flesh. Second John affirms that the wedding of deity and humanity has an abiding reality (cf. 1 Tim 2:5). The ontological and essential nature of the incarnation that would receive eloquent expression one thousand years later in the writing of St. Anselm (1033–1109) in his classic Cur Deus Homo is already present in seed form in the tiny and neglected letter of 2 John.
Lenski- In 1 John 4:2 we have ἐν σαρκὶ ἐληλυθότα, the perfect participle, “as having come in flesh” (incarnate, John 1:14); here we have ἐρχόμενον ἐν σαρκί, “as coming in flesh,” although the participle is present in form it is really timeless.of Christ as "still being manifested." See the note at 1 John 3:5. In 1 John 4:2 we have the manifestation treated as a past fact by the perfect tense, eleeluthota "has come
Robertson- That Jesus Christ cometh in the flesh Ieesoun Christon erchomenon en sarki. "Jesus Christ coming in the flesh." Present middle participle of erchomai treating the Incarnation as a continuing fact which the Docetic Gnostics flatly denied. In 1 John 4:2 we have eleeluthota (perfect active participle) in this same construction with homologeoo, because there the reference is to the definite historical fact of the Incarnation.
Vincent- Is come erchomenon. Wrong. The verb is in the present participle, "coming," which describes the manhood
hope this helps !!!
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